...to consider teacher training once DCs are at school?

[GandTforme]

Is teaching (primary) really so stressful and unpleasant?

My DTs are 18mo now and I work part time in local government (social work assistant within an adult team). My job is ok but the only way to progress would be to go full time in a few years when dc start school and train in social work - I'm not sure that I enjoy my job enough to do that.

I have always just had 'jobs' rather than a 'career' but I would like to remedy this in the future. The only thing that has ever really appealed to me is teaching. My local city has a training federation offering the pgce and I was toying with the idea of applying for this when the dc are 4/5 and I will once again be able to work/study full time. But after looking into it there are so many horror stories about how dreadful the job is these days, how many people burn out, how much overtime is required. Now I'm used to stress, working in a social work team. But what I read about teaching makes it sound like it's on another level of awfulness compared to other local government professions.

What's the truth? Would I be mad to consider working towards it?

I'm an NQT with 3 children of my own and I'm really struggling. I love teaching, don't mind the planning etc.

But to have book scrutinies where they pick on individual children and effectively tell you that if these certain children don't visibly improve in the next few weeks then you've failed them...
Learning walks where you only get negative feedback
Endless jargon and schemes in school that need to be displayed and sold to the children (characters to represent learning behaviours, school values ad nauseam)
Challenge partners so you can be critiqued by other SLT as well as your own
Expectation to run extra curricular clubs as well as help with SATS boosters as year 6 is all important for the entire school
Kids crying in Year 5 as they are scared of SAYS
Response to marking must happen daily so books must be marked every night regardless of other commitments in school
Paperwork - 65% pupil premium in my class - each child must have a tracker with attendance, behaviour, lates, number of reads, levels, number of marvellous Mrs, spelling scores. That's an afternoon of PPA per half term gone.
Intervention forms, provision maps, work prepped for lunch clubs, teacher led intervention in assembly or lunch times.
I have become overwhelmed and I can't see myself continuing after this year. As many have said, PT just means doing virtually FT hours on less pay.
After the time and money I invested in qualifying I feel like an utter fool. Everybody warned me it was awful but I thought I could cope.

Don't do it.

When they start school wpuld be the worst time (full on before school care/school/after school care AND then you needing to work in the evenings!!) So it you are going to do it do it now.

Barbie222
I totally agree.
I'm quite organised and generally try to cut as much rubbish out as possible so I can have a better balance. But, before Christmas I made some beautiful revision materials. It was therapeutic and I really enjoyed it. But I can't sit whining about the fact I'm going to spend this weekend marking a stack of books because I chose to spend my last few PPAs before Christmas drinking coffee wiyh my friend making GCSE resources to save time later in the year.

The fact I have books to mark this weekend is entirely my own doing.

Some people do a lot of pretty / distraction tasks all thr time tend to be quite vocal whiners about how overworked they are.

Definitely depends on the school as well. I mean, it's stressful everywhere but unbearably some places. I was secondary and hated decorating the classroom (never had my own) however in one school it was policy to change the display monthly and this had to be the kind which apparently helped learning, so an enlarged essay with arrows critiquing it was a favourite. This was checked by slt so wasn't a case of me choosing to waste time making it. You also feel a responsibility to do things well as it's young peoples' futures. I taught new specs of a level so had to teach myself the texts, some quite difficult and requiring degree level study, reading criticisms and academic essays about them. If you have pupils who are aiming for an a star and applying to Oxbridge you have to be very informed. Then 2 years later the spec changed and I did it again. However that wouldn't apply to you and don't know what it's like at primary.

I'm in the middle of interview ans assessment days having applied to do secondary English SCITT from Sept 2018. I'm under no illusions that it's going to be hard, but I've also been told that candidates with a family and a bit of life experience are better at balancing the demands and knowing when their work is 'good enough'.
Take a look a school-centred GTR - there are part-time training options that may work better for you.

I'm under no illusions that it's going to be hard, but I've also been told that candidates with a family and a bit of life experience are better at balancing the demands and knowing when their work is 'good enough'.

Who has told you that? Hopefully nobody recruiting.

Hi I'm a primary teacher and a mum to 4 year old twins I qualified straight from uni though so had been working 8 years by the time I had them. As others have said I love the teaching bit of my job but it's the million other things that keep changing and need done that I hate. I currently work 0.5 and have a reasonable work life balance as I use some of my time when I'm off and don't have the kids to do school work at home. I think I would struggle full time. Financially this works for me as I was a way up the paysvale when I went part time but it would be a bit rubbish being on 0.5 on entry level pay. I wouldn't say don't do it and due to your current job I bet you have some of the skills already but I would say be prepared for a hard few years (think school 7:30-5 then an hour or 2 at home and a few at the weekends) Also with young kids teaching is pretty inflexible. Holidays fab but it is a pain getting cover for plays and sports days at your own kids schools. I currently have a lovely head who is great for this but that hasn't been the case everywhere I've worked!

I’ve noticed an anecdotal trend. Those who go into teaching either straight from uni or with no prior private sector experience seem to find it a lot harder than those that have had previous careers.

I wonder if the stresses of private sector roles (and they are huge and many just like in teaching) and learning how to cope there prepare you much better for teaching. I’m reading a lot here about how some teachers can’t embrace the ‘good enough’ concept that the workplace - and indeed life - necessitates in order to find balance. I could sit in my office 24/7 and still never get my job ‘done’. That’s just life

I haven't read all the replies but i see so many being so negative!

Yes it's a hard job, it's sometimes ridiculously overwhelming, but if you are productive it won't take over your life!! Find the right school for you, I did year 6 in a 1 form entry... it was awful at times. Moved to a 3 form and it's amazing! I can get home by 4.30 and do maybe half an hour! I just work throughout my day! Mark on the go, sort and prep half of lunch,eat my lunch and crack on! Honestly it's tiring yes, but i love my job!
The paper work etc is annoying but we have a supportive slt who understand the pressure and don't set unrealistic goals!

Op I would spend as much time as you can in schools and go from there!

Shouldnotwouldnot - I found the opposite, particularly with those qualifying over 30. I've worked with 5 teachers in the past 5 years who qualified when over 30, only 1 is still teaching. Lots of the teachers I've worked with qualified in their mid 20s after a couple of years in other jobs and I've found they had a similar retention rate to those who come straight into teaching.

I found the same as filga. I supported pgce students in my old school and found the ones who qualified later often didn't go onto nqt year or dropped out after a few years. I think they had more options as already had had a career and realised how bad teaching was in comparison.

Blimey, this is like a giant therapy session!

OP have all the teachers scared you off? because I suspect you aren't off somewhere filling in a PGCE application!!

Anyway, I am a teacher, married to a teacher (which can lead to ridiculous one-upmanship , arguments and parents' evening chaos btw) , with two DCs and no family nearby at all. I have always worked full time. Workload has never been a huge issue to me but general morale has and all the constant government changes with the tendency of SLTs to just acquiesce to them. Bear in mind, promotion wise, it can be dog eat dog, too, and you will watch young men step all over each other to gain promotion! And often be given it pretty undeservedly! not bitter at all

But I have been teaching 25 years and am still alive. DH hates it but not because of workload. That is one issue but it can just be a very demoralising work environment, So can social work, mind! My school is dishevelled, outmoded and outdated, dirty, too cold or too hot, rickety and did I mention filthy?

If I could do it all again I might have gone part time when DCs were young just to occasionally do a school run. I often resented the lower school's 'pop and see us' policy on everything!

It can be an enormously draining job. But I can't see how social work could be hugely different : it's probably a good grounding.

but I've also been told that candidates with a family and a bit of life experience are better at balancing the demands and knowing when their work is 'good enough'

As a teacher who has seen many NQTs and experienced come and go-I would say that this isn’t true. Older teachers who come into the job with plenty of life experience and other commitments tend to see overbearing SMT and the time-consuming ‘other stuff’ for the gobshite rubbish that they so clearly are and walk, very quickly, back to their previous lives.

So much depends on your school. You have to be prepared to work hard, it's not an easy job, but tbh, are many jobs easy?

I've got two preschoolers and work full time. It's tiring but I manage. But my dh works Mon fri with little travel so can do some nursery drops/pick ups to enable me to stay late when needed/go in early etc. That makes it more manageable.

To me, it's the best job ever and I can't imagine doing anything else. I get to work about 8.30 and have to leave by 5.30 for nursery pick ups. Sometimes I do an hour or so at home. I'll do 2/3 hours prep at the weekends (usually a Friday night). I have the weekend free to spend with my family, expect occasional times like reports etc.

I find it family friendly, especially compared to previous jobs I've had in hospitality where I'd be doing weekends/evenings and there is no childcare to cover those hours.

I think anyone going into teaching needs to really think hard about their motivations.

If it is to make the world a better place - good, but be prepared to become disillusioned. Sometimes, I am disappointed at how tough I have become although I am softer now than I was 10 - 15 years ago . Having my own DCs made me see children in a different way.

If it is 'because I like children' that isn't enough. I think this happens a lot with people who go into primary. You need to like children, but you need to have other reasons too. I do think people who go into secondary at least realise more quickly that the children are going to be a tough crowd who piss them off regularly and come in pre-armed! Some go into primary training (or private schools) to avoid discipline issues. Hahahahahaha. Bad plan.

An no one prepares you for how horrible parents can be. Both to teachers and to their children.

You also need to love learning and learning about learning. Many people don't cite love of learning as a motivation. If you haven't got that enthusiasm, when all else is lost you will have no energy or desire to learn yourself.

The great thing in teaching is variety and never going a day without talking to someone! It is not a quiet, restful or serene job!

I have known teachers leave because they find the job so isolating and that’s also something to bear in mind.

You do spend the majority of your time in a classroom on your own-‘performing’ to an audience. There’s no one really to share ideas with or discuss things. Obviously there are children but it’s clearly a different relationship. You also can’t get out to the loo or get a drink either (I had so many kidney infections in my first few years!!) and people tend not to go to the staffroom or stop and chat-my old school actually removed the staffroom completely!

I don’t particularly mind this isolation really-I quite like my own company and am not fussed by a lack of adult conversation during the day . Two mature NQTs I worked with who came from the nhs hated it though and felt very lonely in their classroom with no one to bounce ideas from. Neither are teaching any more.

Don't do it.

I think we do talk to each other in my school appu and in my dept , we make an effort (most of us) to not work through lunch or stop for a chat. But everything is manic and rushed - our lunch 'break ' is only 30 minutes.

And, in my previous role, I received up to 50 emails an hour! Now I am not doing that role, I am on about 50 a week !

I could re-wind the clock I'd stay in my previous career. I did my nqt year and the year after in a horrendous academy but am now teaching in a grammar where the workload is a lot less and the behaviour is good. It makes a huge difference but these jobs are few and far between. The time with my dd over the holidays is amazing though.

Older teachers who come into the job with plenty of life experience and other commitments tend to see overbearing SMT and the time-consuming ‘other stuff’ for the gobshite rubbish that they so clearly are and walk, very quickly, back to their previous lives.
Very true.
I had a career before teaching and ended up in a school with ridiculous workload (mainly pointless), too many people in promoted posts because they were little lap dogs who almost always had a new initiative which mean them doing learning walks and everyone else doing the work and that place was so bad for my sanity. The decision was simple: find a new school or leave teaching.

I found a new school and haven't looked back. And in my current school (whilst all schools have a bit of crap) you can raise issues, be listened to and there is some give. They seem to do their best for staff and even if I don't always like their decisions, I can't deny they genuinely care about staff and students.

piggy
I'd forgotten emails! They were another hellish element of a former school. Messages from students at 10pm thr day before homework is due saying 'i'm stuck and don't get it' followed by another from Mum saying 'Timmy won't be doing a detention for missinf homeqork as he messaged ypu for help and you failed to provide it therefore it is unreasonable for any sanction when it is not his fault'.

Oh and then the people who live for teaching who like to send group emails late on / early hours often with a member of SLT copied in regularly just to prove hmhow long they are working (one off from people you don't mind, but we had half a dozen who were 'look at my time.stamp' emailers)

I know there are loads of teachers who will tell you otherwise, but I love it, and I actually find the work load manageable. I have a 4 year old, and a 1 year old. I get into work at 6.30 everyday (my kids wake at 5am so no big issue leaving early) I leave work bang on 3pm except for when I have meetings/parents evenings. Kids are in bed by 7pm, and I will then work until 9pm before taking an hour or two to chill. I do not work over the weekend at all, unless I've given tests that I need to mark. There is more work than some other jobs but doable if you're in the right school with a supportive department. I also have lots of support at home and my OH helps with the kids a lot.

I did my teacher training with a 6 month old, and then my NQT year pregnant with a one and a half year old, which was hard, but doable. I got some great bursaries to subsidies my lost income and gold are was paid for by the student loans company.

Turnocks34
Wow.
You sound like you really have it all together. Serious respect there.

Former teacher here.
My knee-jerk advice would also be "don't do it" for all the reasons stated above.

But, my more reasoned advice is to look into it carefully, speak to people doing the job, and really listen to their answers. If you think you still want to go ahead at least you're doing so with your eyes wife open...

Turnocks, when do you sleep? If you chill for a couple of hours after 9 and then get up at 5, you can’t need much sleep? That must make the job so much easier because you have more available hours!

I’m asleep by 10.30, and up at 7!

To be honest I could easily sleep until 8 or 9 o clock but I have two babies that make me get up at 5 😂 Might as well use the time to my advantage I guess. I normally fall asleep between 10.30-11 but again, I could sleep earlier I just like watching pointless American dramas!