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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that bit is impossible to live off of benefits?

748 replies

Rolf38 · 30/11/2017 21:49

So Universal Credit rates are £498.89 an adult couple over the age of 25. This is meant to last them one whole month. So £250 per adult which works out at about £60 per week or just £8.57 per day.

How is someone meant to buy food, pay their bills and maintain a jobsearch at these rates?

I understand that some may think that by setting benefits at a low rate, there will be a greater incentive for recipients to return to work. This I understand and agree with to a point.

Surely though that danger of setting benefit rates too low is that it has the opposite effect. Claimants may reun the risk of getting in to debt, depression and lose the desire to maintain an active job search, along with any ambitions and aspirations they ever had.

Is met ting benefit rates too low a precursor to the increase of long term benefit claimants, simply by affording claimants less resources and willpower to maintain their job search?

After all, say if have been unemployed fir or three months. In this time, you have been so cash strapped that you haven't even been able to go to the cinema or meet an old friend, as bills and increasing debts have taken priority.

Without just a bit of enjoyment to boost morale, how less determined would a claimant be to give their job search their all as they would be if they could take their mind off of it for a bit.

For the couples payment too, I wouldn't be surprised if such a low payment to sustain two adults for a month may cause friction in the relationship, adding further restrictions to morale and job search.

Of course taxpayers money should be treated with the utmost respect.

However, is keeping benefit rates at such a low level proving more costly in the long run?

Why not add an incentive for job search for claimants? Increase UC payments by 10% for those who continually do all they can for their job search over a sustained period (say three months).

Such an increase, just form he most committed in their job search, would act as a continued incentive for the most determined to find work quicker (thus reducing long-term burdens on the taxpayers). Restricting an enhanced payment to just the most committed would also ensure that those not committed to athe or jobsearch and envisage a long-term existence on benefits find that this, beyond subsidence level, is not sustainable.

If you are doing everything you can in your jobsearch, why should you be unable to afford very basic enjoyments (even on a very occasional basis)? Why are those who put in the effort, in testing times, not differentiated from those who show no desire to come off benefits.

Perhaps in addition to sanctioning claimants who do not fulfill their commitments, the government should do more to help and reward the positive attitude to do all they can to get back to work.

OP posts:
DullAndOld · 01/12/2017 14:12

Do you actually think that people wouldnt prefer to be working?
You think I like living on £40 a week? FFS.

Gilead · 01/12/2017 14:13

Unemployment is at it's lowest level for decades so there is absolutely no excuse for anyone to whine that they can't get a job.
The trouble nowadays is that for many, living on benefits is a lifestyle choice, paid for of course by the taxes of the poor devils in work.
Absolute tosh! Try googling some facts and figures before posting nonsense. The ONS will give you the figures you're looking for and the Joseph Rowntree Foundation some facts regarding poverty.

northernruth · 01/12/2017 14:33

Not read all the responses, so sorry.

1/ the biggest part of the benefits bill in this country is pensions, yet we have this picture of the poor old pensioner peddled by the government to justfiy ringfencing state pensions. I realise lots of pensioners live in poverty but many don't. Another massive chunk is the housing benefit bill - which goes to private landlords
2/ agree with the posters who mention the 16 hours a week thing - I have a mate who gets £1600 a month in tax credits which is the same as her take home pay. Not sure if this will change under UC
3/ also have another mate who can't find hairdressers to work in her salon for more than 16 hours a week for the same reason
4/ the treatment of disabled people by this government is abhorrent
5/ people can't just turn off wifi and phone packages as many have a contract. We need to stop imagining benefit claimants as being permanently workshy - a significant number have lost jobs in the last 12 months
6/ conversely, the benefits system isn't there to support small businesses/ entrepreneurs IMO.

To think that bit is impossible to live off of benefits?
Itsgonnabeacoldone · 01/12/2017 14:39

you had to get expensive agency staff in. Would it be cheaper in the long run to pay more to a staff member?

We tried offering significantly enhanced pay for the part timers and we were already paying living wage years before it came in. They still weren't interested as they didn't take home any more money.

I don't blame the people, it's the system.

Pensions are whole other can of worms.

What is frustrating is they withdrew any funding for the JSA bus pass (outside of London) but there is the money for a bus pass for the boomers that want a free lift into town as they don't want to risk the Merc getting scratched. Here it is two buses just to sign on and about 15 quid. You can easily spend the whole JSA amount just on bus travel looking for work. Disgusting.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 01/12/2017 14:49

Unemployment is at its lowest level in decades.

On which planet. Certainly not this one, and if that is the case why aren't job centre staff being made redundant, after all. The unemployed
are keeping them in work.

DoesHeWantToOrNot · 01/12/2017 14:50

Ironically the job I had to quit was security in the job centres.

DullAndOld · 01/12/2017 15:25

should I take job in Italy where I cant be on hand for my young adult children?
It's a serious question, I just more or less got offered a teaching gig in Southern Italy with a salary of 1.300 and a flat supplied...

wasonthelist · 01/12/2017 15:32

Unemployment is at it's lowest level for decades so there is absolutely no excuse for anyone to whine that they can't get a job.
The trouble nowadays is that for many, living on benefits is a lifestyle choice, paid for of course by the taxes of the poor devils in work.

What a despicable, nasty, blinkered, thick and blinkered attitude. Of course there are pisstakers - but with so very many people receiving benefits (which as OP points out are below subsistence levels) can anyone seriously be saying that they are all (or even in significant numbers) making a lifestyle choice?

Justanotherlurker · 01/12/2017 15:37

On which planet. Certainly not this one

www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peoplenotinwork/unemployment/timeseries/mgsx/lms

and if that is the case why aren't job centre staff being made redundant, after all.

Ahh, your not really interested in actual figures.

KathArtic · 01/12/2017 15:55

But Dull some people get to work despite living rurally, with no transport. My FIL used to ride his bike to the next county for work in the 60's.

And some will take up work away from home, even abroad.

It's down to choice.

Gilead · 01/12/2017 16:00

It's down to choice.
Nonsense.
The roads were far less bus when your FiL travelled. One imagines, given the times that his partner stayed at home with family commitments thereby avoiding the cost of childcare. Children walked home from school in those days, they don't now, so some sort of wrap around care is required. There are many factors and few are about choices if you live rurally.

DullAndOld · 01/12/2017 16:07

" It's down to choice."

just fuck off with that, right now. You think I choose to live with so little money that i cant put the heating on ? really? and fuck off with your grandad and his bike, right now.

Tinygem · 01/12/2017 16:17

Ah, nice to see Kaths here to kick people when they're down as usual...
She hasn't got a clue.

wasonthelist · 01/12/2017 16:22

My FIL used to ride his bike to the next county for work in the 60's.

'Kin "ell Norman Tebbit posts on here - who knew?

MiraiDevant · 01/12/2017 16:23

Exactly swing - that's how I felt. Sick of people on HB and Tax Credits spending summer days in the park and generally having a lovely time while I commuted for an hour each way and worked in a hot office for less disposable income.

Of course we need benefits but it isn't free money. Someone else is paying

LouPeru · 01/12/2017 16:24

"Fuck off with your grandad and his bike" 😂 Comment of the day!

Raise benefits but make people work for them (if able). This would reduce poverty, increase living standards and provide work experience. On top of this, the people that DO choose to go on benefits because they can't be arsed to work (they do exist!) will no longer have the option to sit on their arses claiming so faced with the choice of working for benefits or working for a proper wage - one would hope the would choose the latter.

DoesHeWantToOrNot · 01/12/2017 16:30

@tiny I guess she's known for that then?

It's clearly obvious if I'd known what would've happened I wouldn't have had a child however she was a happy accident.

Anyways what can I do now? Send her back?

And even though I get HB and tax credits I won't be in the park on summer days as me and dp will be extremely busy over the summer.

This year I was in the park on summer days as I was on mat leave.

NooNooHead · 01/12/2017 16:35

I wish to God I was offered benefits now I am out of work, but being self employed and married, I don’t qualify. Even the bloke at the Job Centre said he didn’t understand how some parts of the system work, not being able to pay someone like me who had been in taxable employment for years before becoming self employed, yet don’t qualify for anything like Job Seekers/Universal Credit now when I most need it.Hmm

I know someone who does take the piss a bit when it comes to benefits. She is a single mum and has been for years, yet she refused to go back to work years ago as she would faced paying back a lot of legal aid fees and - in her words - was better off on benefits instead of working. She certainly wasn’t incapable of working while her daughter was at school, it was more of a choice for her, which is her choice of course. Whether she would agree that her lifestyle is desirable or she actually wants it is another thing altogether.

wasonthelist · 01/12/2017 16:37

Raise benefits but make people work for them (if able)

This already happens with working tax credits of course. As for some kind of workfare - it's just a ridiculous idea that would cost zillions just to administer. The idea that the State becomes the employer for loads of extra people with attendant admin etc is just ludicrous - and it's incredible that it gets suggested by people who are so right wing on the whole since it is effectively East Germany! under communism.

It is utterly ridiculous if you even give it five minutes thought.

Thishatisnotmine · 01/12/2017 16:45

My FIL used to ride his bike to the next county for work in the 60's.
I used to live somewhere where over the border to the next county was about two miles. Not a cycling feat I'd bother telling my grandchildren about!

It's a bit "let them eat cake" isn't it.

Gilead · 01/12/2017 16:47

NooNoo, if your friend's child is of school age she will have to demonstrate that she is looking for work in order to access her benefits.

LouPeru · 01/12/2017 16:49

What is ludicrous is having able bodied people choosing to sit on their arses at home and getting paid for it.

Make them work for it. For example they only get their payment if their timesheet is signed for 37.5 hours voluntary work.

DullAndOld · 01/12/2017 16:51

don't be ridiculous Lou, I am not working for less than £2 an hour.

DullAndOld · 01/12/2017 16:53

and can i say one more time, I am not 'choosing to sit on my arse' . I have applied for jobs that I can get to, and do not even get an answer back. That is because literally a hundred people might have applied for it. If I was in London, or the south east I would be working , I can assure you.

NooNooHead · 01/12/2017 16:54

Gilead Isn’t there a time limit for how long you can be looking for work and claim benefits for? (Sorry, I know nothing about being a single parent on benefits...) She must have been claiming the benefits for at least 5-6years now (her child is nearly 10) so can someone claim for that long?

Just wondered. It seems odd that an able bodied and mentally sound person should be out of work for so long by choice. Surely if someone has the capacity and capability to work, they really need to prove they can’t otherwise?