To think that bit is impossible to live off of benefits?

[Rolf38]

So Universal Credit rates are £498.89 an adult couple over the age of 25. This is meant to last them one whole month. So £250 per adult which works out at about £60 per week or just £8.57 per day.

How is someone meant to buy food, pay their bills and maintain a jobsearch at these rates?

I understand that some may think that by setting benefits at a low rate, there will be a greater incentive for recipients to return to work. This I understand and agree with to a point.

Surely though that danger of setting benefit rates too low is that it has the opposite effect. Claimants may reun the risk of getting in to debt, depression and lose the desire to maintain an active job search, along with any ambitions and aspirations they ever had.

Is met ting benefit rates too low a precursor to the increase of long term benefit claimants, simply by affording claimants less resources and willpower to maintain their job search?

After all, say if have been unemployed fir or three months. In this time, you have been so cash strapped that you haven't even been able to go to the cinema or meet an old friend, as bills and increasing debts have taken priority.

Without just a bit of enjoyment to boost morale, how less determined would a claimant be to give their job search their all as they would be if they could take their mind off of it for a bit.

For the couples payment too, I wouldn't be surprised if such a low payment to sustain two adults for a month may cause friction in the relationship, adding further restrictions to morale and job search.

Of course taxpayers money should be treated with the utmost respect.

However, is keeping benefit rates at such a low level proving more costly in the long run?

Why not add an incentive for job search for claimants? Increase UC payments by 10% for those who continually do all they can for their job search over a sustained period (say three months).

Such an increase, just form he most committed in their job search, would act as a continued incentive for the most determined to find work quicker (thus reducing long-term burdens on the taxpayers). Restricting an enhanced payment to just the most committed would also ensure that those not committed to athe or jobsearch and envisage a long-term existence on benefits find that this, beyond subsidence level, is not sustainable.

If you are doing everything you can in your jobsearch, why should you be unable to afford very basic enjoyments (even on a very occasional basis)? Why are those who put in the effort, in testing times, not differentiated from those who show no desire to come off benefits.

Perhaps in addition to sanctioning claimants who do not fulfill their commitments, the government should do more to help and reward the positive attitude to do all they can to get back to work.

What is this world coming to when people think others money should be shared
Gosh, I don't know, reasonable, kind, fair...

Fair for me to make the effort to earn my money to have to share it. Wow I earn it, the stress of work and juggling a family to have to share with people who don't. This would be fair. To put all the working people in one half of the UK and all the non working in the other half. Set up a fair tax system for the working half, for example the costs of running our half split equally between everyone, therefore everyone paying the same. Then those that don't earn could use there skills to build there own society. We would have a much better and fairer life. More money to spend on education and health care. More public services which would reduce crime. Somewhere to be proud of

Cabin - have to say I am a bit sceptical of your claims to be a high earner and doing care work and childminding for some extra money. Doesn't really add up I am afraid.

Also as a carer/childminder what would you do if all your clients went to live in the non working part of the country that you suggest? Seems to me that it would be only so long until you end up there too.

Yes, Cabin, sounds great. How about instead of splitting the country we introduce workhouses for those feckless single mothers, and institutions to put disabled people in so their parents can get back out to work. Worked well before didn't it?

How do I get on the non working side without giving up my job?

I like my job but I'm not sure I want to live with people like Cabin and Kath. Can you volunteer to be on the feckless side?

What bills are they expected to cover out of that? Does it include rent? I’m not really familiar with the UC system but I know from renting that some people only have to pay a small amount towards their rent and the bulk is paid directly to the landlord.

Council tax top-up in most cases, electricity, water rates, gas, mobile phone and internet (as pointed out the JC class these as essentials and you could be sanctioned for not having them), TV license (although there is an easy entry scheme where you pay per week. It's still the same price in total), food, travel expenses (to job interviews and meetings at the job center), clothing and any home repairs you'd be responsible for.

Rent does need to be paid from UC. It's no longer paid directly to LL but the amount in the OP is basic rate (i.e not including housing or child elements)

I despair when I read things like *Stop taking off the rich to feed the poor”.

We were once a civilised country. How can we make that claim when people think like that? No wonder IS called us decadent. Thoughts like yours, Cabin, degrade us all.

If you pay a rent top-up (which most people do) that will need to come out of the basic rate.

Ah ok well if it’s not including rent it doesn’t seem too unreasonable to me then? What am I missing as there seems to be a lot of upset ppl on this thread? I mean obviously five weeks backdated is shit but week by week that doesn’t seem all that bad, certainly not impossible?

Water £40
Gas £40
Electric £30
TV £12.50
Internet (free use at library)
Mobiles x2 £30
Food for two £100
Rent shortfall estimate £200
£452.50

What did I miss? Surely it’s not supposed to be a sustainable way of living but that would cover your basics in the interim?

You clearly have excellent utilities rates and the appetite of a sparrow if you think that's do-able.

I live in a relativey small house. Gas and electric alone cost me £110 per month. Broadband internet another £23, phone £20, water £18. I'm not sure how much council tax and rent top-up they'd need to pay. On the weeks I've received full housing benefit, I pay a top of £20 p/w rent (£80 pcm) and £20pcm council tax, so another £100 but let's be conservative and say £30 rent and council tax top pcm.

That's £200, which would leave a couple with £37.50 per week each for food, clothing and travel expenses if they don't have any other debts or basic expenses like TV licence and if nothing essential such as a cooker or computer breaks.

I'm not seeing how that is manageable?

"What did I miss?"

Your empathy gene?!

That’s just using our actual bills as an example. And yes that was our food bill when there was just the two of us although it’s not gone up by much. Mostly down to batch cooking which baring in mind someone on UC would need to be aware of budget then surely they’re not expecting to afford to eat out?

Obviously internet’s not essential as there’s free options such as library or job centre.

I’ve never received any benefits and never intend to but I think it seems fairly doable. I mean nobody’s expecting it to be a long term thing.

Empathy gene or not, the figures appear to add up. Perhaps more budgeting help is needed?

You were saying Lollipop?

www.theguardian.com/books/2017/nov/28/northamptonshire-may-close-up-to-28-of-its-36-libraries

Also people on low incomes are more likely to be on pre-payment meters and those bastarding things just eat your money.

I last had one around 8ish years ago and was spending £20 p/w on electric and £10-15 on gas (gas central heating, electric cooker and fire and immersion heater for hot water) and the house was always freezing. I tried to only use the electric fire as I couldn't afford to heat the house with gas. I was working full time.

Internet/computer use at our library is free for the first hour and £1 per hour thereafter. You're supposed to job seek (online) for eight hours a day unless you have an interview. That's £7 a day, so paying monthly for internet would be a lot cheaper.

And of course there's then the cost of travel to and from the library daily, depending on how close your library is.

As well as rent I've also got a mortgage to pay as our house is shared ownership. Luckily it's a small mortgage, but i imagine others would be facing homelessness if they couldn't afford repayments and had to go on benefits.

It's all very well saying you don't intend to use benefits but you don't know what lays in your future. I certainly never intended using them but you know, now I'm a single parent with children, 1 of whom is disabled meaning I can't work (although apparently I should be able to Magic Sen childcare)

I'm glad the benefits system is there when we need it. The amount of benefit fraud is actually quite low despite what the tabloids and Channel 5 would have you think.

Yeah the prepayment meters suck. Can you not just request it to be changed to direct debit though? The only time we’ve been somewhere with one we asked for it to be changed to our name which landlord preferred as any debt would stay with us not them/the meter?

I’m not in Northampton but I know round here they’ve closed a couple of libraries and changed the others times. However the town halls always open as is the job centre and they have computers for the specific use of job searches.

Isn't it funny how the only people who say benefits are far too generous are those who have never needed to claim them?

The shit talked on this thread makes me think it should be compulsory for everyone to have their income limited to benefits levels for a year so they can grow a brain and some empathy.

‘It's all very well saying you don't intend to use benefits but you don't know what lays in your future.’

You’re absolutely right but that’s why I think it’s fantastic that we have that safety net. My problem with the complaints is that in reality the amount proposed does cover essentials when budgeted properly. No you won’t get luxuries and it wouldn’t be easy but surely it should only be used whilst getting back in your feet.

We're on prepayment meters and we spend around £25 a week on electric and £15 on gas. I try not to put the heating on too much. We all have blankets to keep us warm, though the kids don't feel the cold as much.

Can you not just request it to be changed to direct debit though?

Yeah, if you can afford to pay the fee for it to be changed. I can't remember how much it was when I enquired about it.

Not all towns and cities have free computers in the library. Mine doesn't. I haven't been in the Job Center in over a decade but I don't recall seeing computers last time I was there. There were phones. This was before UC, sanctions and 8 hours a day job seeking, so maybe it's changed now.

@Fintons Would my salary need to be limited to £498.98 plus my rent then?