To ask for your help on how to stand up for myself later?

[HarrietKettleWasHere]

Hi,

Ok so I've deliberately chosen AIBU as I need non-minced words

In August I took on a sort of nanny/family PA/housekeeper type role. The parents seemed laid back, lovely....with reasonable expectations.

I'm clearly a crap judge of character. Although the kid I look after is indeed brilliant, no complaints there.

I had a three month probationary period. Due to end last Friday. They've just informed me they'd like to extend it for another three months (i.e. they could still get rid of me with a week's notice and I have no comeback for unfair dismissal etc)

Because, although I'm apparently a fantastic nanny, (way to treat a fantastic nanny ) I haven't met their expectations in the other departments. They are still stressed on the weekend apparently and finding themselves having to do housework....

They also have a cleaner for 12 hours a week, I put laundry on once a day and the cleaner does it too, loads of other stuff gets taken and picked up from the dry cleaner by me.

I seriously am at a loss to know where this extra work and stres is coming from.

They own about five properties across the city and in the time I've been working for them, two sets of tenants have served notice. That meant advertising for more, finding more, organising viewings, vetting, moving the previous tenants out, organising cleaners, handymen.... I worked two Saturdays to get all this done. So while all this has been going on I'm also expected to keep the house ship shape, do the school run in the afternoon, ferry to after school club, oversee homework, make dinner, get ready for bed....then there's all their other PA stuff like booking flights, theatre tickets, paying for parking tickets, inputting all the expenses in spreadsheets, ordering groceries....

The dad especially is a bit military in his approach to cleanliness and often pulls me up on things like side not polished, dishwasher not switched on/loaded correctly...I used cling film in the fridge which is a big no as apparently we'll all get cancer...

I can't do all this and meet every single need perfectly. Added to this in the school holidays I'm 'just' supposed to be a full time nanny and keep a six year old stimulated (no screen time allowed ever) all day.... so you can imagine how much all the other stuff goes to pot during those times.

Meant to have weekly meetings with the mum- she's never found the time.

So after her just telling me I'm supposed to just continue on probation until they can 'define the role' I have asked for a meeting to discuss, because I do not think I'm being treated very fairly. It's apparently goung to take place at 5pm.

I need to be firm, assertive and not take any shit. Or should I just jack it in (I am very tempted right now to just jack it in but it would seem Ike quitting, I don't have another job lined up obviously but would be fine money wise for a little while as we are staying with a family member and paying nominal rent while we save)

[Nyx]

They are expecting you to do the work of an entire staff. Good luck in your meeting, I hope they see sense. There's lots of great advice in the thread, especially around asking exactly what they expect of you and how many hours they expect you to do it all in!

[timeisnotaline]

Do not negotiate , apologise, or say anything wishwashy on the extension. 'Let's clear one thing up first, I do not agree to any extension of the probationary period' then discuss your role. They hired you as a nanny, and seem to expect you to do multiple roles. Do put your break into your time calcukation, you may not take it but it's a legal right I believe. 'No i don't get those things done, you hired me as a nanny. The role of a nanny is to look after your child , I have delivered over and above on that with managing the admin on your 5 separate properties, which would usually be a separate role on its own- I suggest you google 'property manager'. I also fit in a substantial amount of cleaning for a nanny. If you need more you are asking me to ignore your child, which I won't do, as I'm her nanny. Be very prepared to quit. They sound awful.

[picklemepopcorn]

Open the meeting by agreeing with them that the current situation is not working, and the role needs to be redefined as it is not achievable.

I’d agree suggesting that cleaning is removed from your duties. Apart from anything else, cleaning can go on indefinitely- there is no way of knowing when it is all done, he will always find something that hasn’t been done.

I remember you posting before, I’m sorry things haven’t improved.

[HarrietKettleWasHere]

Thanks for all the advice. It's a shame to leave as I think the kid is great and we've really bonded. But I don't see how this is sustainable. I will need a reference though so want to keep that in mind.

[Itsallfuckery]

You sound like you have the patience of a saint! They sound like complete pisstakers. If it’s feasible, quit. You are worth more than this

[TwitterQueen1]

Sorry OP but I am rolling on the floor laughing here. You are, as everyone else has said, way too good for them. You are Mary Poppins x 2.

I would respond by telling them that unfortunately you don't feel they have passed your trial period either. Then you can either say you need a massive pay rise, or say that you will not be responsible for any cleaning for example.

"I too have some concerns about the tasks you expect me to complete and I'm afraid I've come to the conclusion that things just aren't workable as they are. I suggest you increase the hours your cleaner works as I cannot fit this into the current schedule...." etc etc etc. finish with "I do hope you understand. How about you think about it for a day or so and if we can't come to an agreement I'll give you 1/2/3/4 weeks notice."

[ADishBestEatenCold]

Could it be possible that they do actually want to terminate your employment, but it is not convenient for them to do so for say 4 weeks (example).

If you have rolled on to the post trial, contractual period ... so they couldn't do that.
However if they can extend your trial period, they could then give you 1 weeks notice in 3 weeks time.

If you see what I mean.

[HarrietKettleWasHere]

I see exactly what you mean, ADish and that's exactly what my DP thinks they are doing too.

[ADishBestEatenCold]

Even if that were the case, the suggestions made by other posters could still work to your advantage.

You could still point out that the working pattern is untenable, you could propose certain changes, and ask them how they thought it could be better worked.
If something vaguely workable came out of that discussion, you could tell them you were happily willing to try it (if you wanted too), but that you would require to move onto full contractual terms at the originally agreed time.
If they agreed, from there you would move on to a better working pattern and full contractual terms

If they refused, give them one weeks notice.

If nothing vaguely workable came out of the discussion, give them one weeks notice.

All three possibilities do (perhaps in a weird kind of way) lead to you having the stronger hand.

[HarrietKettleWasHere]

Damn it! Predictably she's cancelled, too much on at work. This happens every single time.

[LittleOwl153]

How did they inform you that they wanted to extend probation? It would appear they are offering a 3 month contract now - what was your original contract permanent?
I guess it depends on how easily you think you can get another job, and whether the 7 day notice could work in your favour. Employment law these days gives you little real rights after 3 months.

[HarrietKettleWasHere]

I just got an email yesterday morning to inform that they were going to 'roll over' the probation for another 3x months

[InternetHoopJumper]

I'd say, hand in your notice. If you can't even get a meeting to discuss issues, they are clearly taking advantage of you and are stringing you along.

[ADishBestEatenCold]

Did she phone? text? email?

I think you should message back (preferably email).

Tell her you do understand how busy they both are. However, that it is not only mutually beneficial that the meeting to review your working pattern and responsibilities takes place as soon as possible, but meantime it is imperative that they are both immediately aware you are not willing to extend the terms of trial period beyond the originally agreed 12 weeks.
That you will require the full contractual terms to take effect from the day immediately following the end of the 12 week trial period and, while you would be saddened to leave your charge, if that is not acceptable they can, of course, apply the one weeks notice while still within the original trial period.

[RandomMess]

As they’ve cancelled the meeting I would consider replying “That doesn’t work for me. I don’t think it’s appropriate for you to be raising performance issues at the end of the three months when review meetings have been consistently cancelled. I’m not willing to agree to an extension at such short notice”

Worth considering?

[Laura811]

They sound like a shower of shit! I'd definitely, without a shadow of a doubt, leave!

Nothing any employee ever does will ever be good enough for them!

[mrsmalcolmreynolds]

Do what random and ADish said. Do not leave it as they'll argue you've accepted the extension as a variation to the original contract.

[The80sweregreat]

You sound wonderful and they sound a nightmare to work for. That is just unacceptable, if there were 3 of you doing this job it would be okay i guess, but one of you and being criticised all the time is out of order. as someone said up thread, what on earth will they expect at christmas? i can imagine a lot more work for you!
I would look for something else. you deserve better.

[timeisnotaline]

You need to reply in writing . Keep it simple. I do not agree to any extension of my probation, my probationary period is contractually ended date X. You have also expressed discontent at some tasks not being done. I feel these tasks are 1. Not the role of a nanny and 2. If your nanny agrees to do them , only what fits into the agreed working hours not spent looking after your children can reasonably be used on these tasks. I would like to reschedule the meeting cancelled today to discuss these matters, please let me know when is a suitable time.

It is essential you communicate that you do not agree to the probation extension

[timeisnotaline]

Also what others said above about appropriate to raise issues when review meetings are cancelled. You should be job hunting though, I suspect you know this. If you are still there past probation stop doing stuff like cleaning the fridge!

[Floellabumbags]

I think you know that you need to look for another job. What a fistful of bastards they are.

[expatinscotland]

These people are complete and total arseholes. You will never be good enough and they will end up exhausting you and dragging your self-esteem and confidence into the toilet and pushing the button. They are already punishing you with this extension of probation because you haven't been able to do the impossible, punishing you the way you would a naughty schoolchild. Please, please, leave. They want a robotic slave to do the work of 3 people.

Don't bother ever trying to negotiating with douche bags like this, they will never treat you properly. They're utter skinflints, too. They need to hire in more staff but they're too cheap. That's why they're successful and probably why their tenants leave, because if they're twats to you (and they are) I can guarantee they are twats to everyone else.

They are weapons-grade cunts.

The only meeting you need to schedule is the one ending your employment with them.

I utter despise people who treat those who work for them like this.

[Sprinklestar]

Quit. Life's too short!

[AJPTaylor]

I would give them a weeks notice and deduct hols owed.

[StormTreader]

Tell them you do not agree - you had hoped to discuss things at the review meeting but since that meeting is no longer possible, you must sadly tender your resignation as of x date.

You can bet they'll find time for the meeting then!

They know theyre being totally unreasonable and are totally taking advantage of you, and are hoping youre too wishy-washy to call them on it if they stay "too busy". "Extending your probation but too busy to discuss it" my left foot!