To think that people that drive diesel cars know that they're killing children

[dieselKiller]

Diesel cars are destroying our towns and villages. The health effects on kids are particularly bad. People must know this by now. So AIBU to think that people who drive diesel cars know that they're killing kids (and everyone really)?

It's like smoking: it's not possible to smoke in public without affecting others' health. This seems to have been accepted by most people. What makes diesel different?

Museum, I'm interested in lots of environmental issues. I don't think it's necessary to discuss them all in this thread though. If you started a thread on agribusiness, I'd certainly read it and might even respond.

To save people hoping for a future response from me any effort, I'll just say I'm bowing out of this thread. I accept that my original post was a little too goady. Thanks to everyone that read, thought about the issue, or posted on the thread.

Museum, I'm interested in lots of environmental issues. I don't think it's necessary to discuss them all in this thread though. If you started a thread on agribusiness, I'd certainly read it and might even respond.

Me too. I'm particularly interested in the ways in which governments and international consensus can impose restrictions on anyone, anywhere, who makes anything - forcing them into a zero footprint product. Let's focus on the producer rather than the consumer.

We should have by now come to understand that modern human consumer choices are defined by (sadly) poverty and self-interest. We can't rely upon goodwill to save us - the vast majority of us can't afford to make better choices, and of those who can, most won't.

The auto industry is, to my way of thinking, a modest success with a slightly heartening trajectory.

I would be very against the idea of being bullied into buying a EV prematurely (when they haven’t evolved enough to suit my needs)

If the time came I would probably save love up and buy 2/3 of the same care drive one for the rest of my life and use the others for parts to keep it running.

A LPG conversion kit would insure I could run it even if fuel becomes scarce.

I live way out in the country so unlikely that anyone would care what I did out here.

We bought ours because we were told it was environmentally better. Give us some money for a new one and we'll gladly get rid of it.

That. And in particular, waiting for a well-known car manufacturer to stump up some cash to make amends for lying about my car's environmental credentials. Then I will buy a better one.

My dp drives a van around Oxford that's more money to pay out. We'll have to lease another van I wonder how much it will cost to run an electric van?

emoji, you may find this article useful:

www.parkers.co.uk/vans/news-and-advice/electric-vans/

In case you haven't got all the info you wanted for your article or whatever OP, have a read of this (apologies for the DM link) and then shove a battery up your arse.....

Electric Cars Not So Green

Thought you were probably a Daily Mail reader Piffle.

Thought you were probably a Daily Mail reader Piffle.

Nope, not me - the link was shared on a techy forum I'm on & I thought it was germane to the thread here....

Unfortunately, although the Fail article was written in their usual doomladen style, most of the facts are correct.
Insisting on electric-only cars will simply move the pollution elsewhere.

Just a thought. Everyone who had oil heating in there homes is basically burning diesel.

You can't just say that diesels are at fault and leave it at that by listening to the news. Petrol vehicles can be just as polluting.

Who said that people die from the pollution caused by motor vehicles and motor vehicles alone? There are other things in the world that cause pollution (cough scrapping the car itself cough) that can cause death.

If it was up to you, we'd all be compelled into running down the motorways to prevent killing people - oh, but then we'd release too much carbon dioxide by breathing quickly so you'd then condemn us all to spending our lives in electric scooters. But it's okay - at least we'd save the planet!

Honestly, people and their ideas today make me absolutely crease.

Argh, I should know better than to read anything in the DM, but I just read that article that was linked to, and this bit makes me sad:

If we really do want that utopia, then we should just get rid of cars, electric or otherwise, and get on our bikes. Now that really is pie in the sky.

Is that not (in some cases; I know you can't cycle on the motorway with toddlers, etc. etc.), one of the actual answers to the problem, and one that you can't really throw bile at? What am I missing here? Apart from an overactive bile duct.

I’m a nanny who raises baby’s so I really doubt I’m driving my car to kill children. What an absurd stament.

Research into making suitably economical and effective particulate traps for diesel engines, much on the same lines as the catalytic convertors used on petrol engines would be a sensible way forward.
OK not 'green' (which is a load of rubbish anyway as it is simply 'feelgood language' for those who can't or won't understand the realities) but it would be a significant step forward.
The introduction of lead free petrol (a good thing) had the effect of making petrol engines around 10 percent less efficient, thus you had to burn MORE petrol to do the same miles (not so good).
Imposing and enforcing significantly lower speed limits (around 55mph used to be near optimum efficiency) would also help.
Practical measures to reduce or prevent standing traffic (bulldoze a few city centres to optimise the road layout) are another possibility.
Effective and either fee or cheap 'transit' around larger towns (electric buses for example) with free, easy access and safe parking for those who need to driver from further afield, linked in with the transit network. Provision for people who need to carry things that are EASY to use. Items such as tools (for trades) child buggies etc for PARENTS and so on.
None of it is actually difficult.

ArcheryAnnie....I have now brought up the car idling issue up with tge school about 4 times now. In the summer I was told cars shouldn't be parked outside the school but in the agreed car park by the cricket club (so its better to pollute by the cricket club I guess 😤) and last winter I was told it was cold so its understandable people run their engines. I haven't even tried to deal with people idling at traffic lights etc but I have called a few parents out on it....nicely if course....outside of the school. I've come to the conclusion that people like to say they are eco friendly when its just a matter of using reusable bags and using their recycling bins correctly. But I don't think its necessarily about people being lazy but more about people simply not realising some of the habits they have are very environment unfriendly.....not switching off the power point when the phone is fully charged for example :)

@UnicornRainbowColours I'm guessing you haven't actually read any of the thread, right?

Muminmama, it depends what your Utopia is. Mine, for instance would not really include bicycles at all as disability prevents me having anything to do with them. Their existence as the only mode of transport available preclude me leaving my house independently.

"It’s not only pedestrians and cyclists who are poisoned by the toxic emissions from vehicles. Health experts believe that the effects are even worse for passengers inside the car."

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/dec/11/polluting-cars-killing-us-air-pollution

(In case it needs to be said, I didn't write this article)

tfl.gov.uk/corporate/about-tfl/air-quality

From the 1st paragraph:

"Every child in London is breathing toxic air, mainly caused by polluting road vehicles."

I wonder if anyone on this thread wants to change their position?

From further down:

"Children are particularly vulnerable to the effects of poor air quality. Children growing up in heavily polluted streets have a smaller lung capacity than those in cleaner areas. This can't be reversed."