To want my exh to stop treating me like an employee?

[nigelsbigface]

Communications from my exh re our daughters are becoming increasingly Manager (him) to employee (me) in tone.To date I have managed to find this amusing as opposed to annoyance inducing-(in particular his fondness for ludicrous management speak which always makes me feel lucky that we aren't together any more). However I wonder if I am being unreasonable in starting to getting annoyed?

He insists we have 50/50 responsibility for the kids (in practice I have them 4 nights, him 3, frequently less when he is 'away' or 'out'-which I'm happy with-I'd have them them more if he would agree to it).

This week there is meeting scheduled this evening at school to discuss something re our dd. He has been aware of this since the beginning of term. I reminded him about it last week. He sent me an email on Monday to say ' just to ensure you have this in your diary as I am out'. It's my night with the dd's and, yes I had it in my 'diary' (as I had reminded him of it) and I had planned to go, but had thought he would also attend given his being so keen to have 50/50 responsibility for the kids. I didn't reply other than to say 'ok'.

There was some prep to do for this meeting which I have done, bar one form which he did, but made an error which I will now have to go out of my way to sort out after work on my way to the meeting.

Yesterday he forwarded me 2 parent mail's (which I already receive myself-something he is aware of) to inform us there is a cake competition at dd1's school and a bake sale at dd2's tomorrow. I replied something flippant about it being short notice.Last night was parents evening which we both attended,ending at 6. He said to me afterwards-'have you sorted the cakes out?' I replied that I had been to the shops and bought some stuff but as I hadn't been home, had had no chance to do it-and as he knows, I have a regular volunteering thing I do on a Wednesday (his night with them). I suggested he sort one cake out-buy it-and I'd do the other. He laughed and said 'I don't think I'll be doing that'... at which I was a bit .
Today he has forwarded me an email containing a form in which kids sign up for after school clubs, which again we both received via parent mail yesterday. He had written 'you may want to to do this with dd2 this evening as it needs to be in by tomorrow and I didn't have time last night'. He got in with the girls at 6, they go to bed at 10, not sure what they were doing for 4 hours to rule out filling in the form.

He is aware that I am leaving work early to get the girls from after school sports today, then taking both to the meeting with me, feeding them/homework etc, then apparently making a pair of cakes this evening...as well as needing to catch up on the work I have missed due to the leaving early..( to avoid drip feed dd2 is proving to need someone to pick her up from school at the minute for various reasons, where she used to walk home on her own, and this has been me to date, which is causing some issues at work.He has not offered to assist with this-we both work full time, though I am nearer home-he agrees this is necessary but hasn't offered an alternative suggestion to me doing it daily).

I am apoplectic re his email today...I can't even find it slightly funny. AIBU to be annoyed? Or am I just overreacting due to stress re dd2 and having a lot to do? Genuine question..
And is it even in any way possible to get it through to him that a) I'm
Not his PA and b) having responsibility for the kids means contributing to everything with them, big decisions, meetings, bloody bake sales, not just delegating it all to someone else (me)?

Why are you scared of standing up to him? You're enabling him.

Obviously trying to control you is what I read into this. If the letters are duplicated you do not have a responsibility to communicate with him any further than that. That is the whole purpose of them being sent out in duplication by the school. Also this may be his way of staying very much in your life.

Oh, my ex does this. Insists we have 'shared care' (and therefore pays no maintenance) but regularly sends me dictatorial emails about things he thinks I should be doing, or times when he is 'unavailable' to parent and therefore I will be picking up the slack and having them on his days. It was particularly impressive when he opted out of parenting for two weeks right after I came out if hospital for emergency surgery. I loved that one.

My friend summed it up quite neatly when she pointed out that he may have then x overnights but I still have to do all the thinking for two parents (and did even when we were together). It's exhausting. But challenging him won't force him to behave better and just unleashes teams of nasty emails. It's easier to just roll with it. Tiring, but easier.

Can I just ask " are you collecting DD2 on evenings when they are supposed to go to his?" If so I would send him an email (in workspeak if you like!) along the lines of "vis a vis the collection of DD2 from school on Xday, Yday and Zday as these collections fall on your nights of residency in the spirit of 50/50 residence I shall leave itfor you to arrange to collect her on the aforementioned days!"

He sounds like a complete ar$e. You seem to have the patience of a saint! Those types of emails would drive me mad. I wish i had some advice for you but i don't. I'd have lost it with him!

I'd suggest reading up on parallel parenting as an alternative to co-parenting. I also second grey/gray rock.

Do stop covering for him. Your email trail reflects his fantasy at the moment vs reality, which isn't ok. Especially as you're having to put a lot of effort into covering his gaps, mistakes and dropped balls.

Stop joining in, as it A. Makes you fuming! And B. Let's him succeed at presenting reality as super dad who needs to supervise the shirking and non reliable trailing mother.

You don't have to go nuclear or be rude to quietly but firmly refuse to join in this fantasy. At the moment it's a joint endeavour, him lording it over you and presenting himself as 'the man in charge'. You're letting him do this and propping his image up by quietly covering for him and stepping into the breach.

No wonder you're annoyed!

Push back, address things as they happen e.g. Thanks so much for X school papers, not sure if you realise but school gives us each a copy so I already have these, so you don't have to forwards them on, especially as he's so busy etc.

Or, yes I've organised 1 cake, what's the plan with his cake? And don't say you've bought them and explain how you've allocated your time etc! You've fallen into responding like a secretary would, and giving him an opening to organise your time and 'productivity'. Really not something you should be doing.

You don't have to enter into a tug of war with him, or a horrible power struggle. But you don't have to prop up his daddy fantasy and make him look good, whilst sacrificing yourself in the process. You also don't answer to him and shouldn't be making your private family life so transparent. It's your family life, and he doesn't get to know the nuts and bolts as it just gives him the power to order you around.

Gently refuse to engage every time he throws his crap at you. Either pass it back smiling and politely, (and ummovingly.), or just don't accept the shit in the first place.

Just step back and let it fall at your feet. Then he looks like an angry ape throwing clods of shit, just as he really is :)

'Oh let's keep this about the children'
'Let's focus on the present now'
'Right, let's get on with planning x now shall we?'
'I'll call back / mail back when you're able to talk about x, what about Tuesday?'

Or even maybe 'I hear what you're saying, but I'm not dwelling on the past/ I'm just focused on the present now, see you on xday...'

And so what if he whitters on about old relationship grievances? You've moved on and you don't have to catch that shit he's throwing!

You could start saying to others, 'oh dear, poor Richard (or whatever), he's very much stuck looking backwards, I worry about him' if you want to be annoying (!).

And as flr covering up his gaps in responsibility, don't do it! Say what is actually happening, without being mean, but being accurate, so others don't just hear his fantasy life. So 'oh I'm not sure why h isn't here' at the school meeting 'it's a shame, as we both had the dates'. Full stop. Move on.

Good luck, so frustrating for you!

Well he clearly thinks you still answer to him and you're doing everything to confirm that he is right. If you don't actually want to continue answering to him it will involve some action on your part and yes, it will feel odd/uncomfortable setting and enforcing those boundaries until he gets the message and realises that the days of him whistling and you running are over. He will resist. Of course he will, because you are changing what is currently a very comfortable arrangement for him. But it doesn't work for you. So I advise you be brave, sit down and have a think about what level of contact you want and then maybe come back to the thread when you have worked that out and get advice on putting that to him.

Chip-mine does stuff like that all the time...
I am very much feeling the mental load I think-thinking for me, two girls, on his Behalf for the girls...it is grinding me down a bit...

But-we committed to still doing stuff all four of us sometimes and we do owe it to the girls to try and get on. If I start biting back too much that will very possibly go out of the window which won't be great for them... I want to find some middle ground but I suspect there isn't one...

To the pp who said it's his way of staying in my life-I don't think so in this case....in fact I'm pretty sure that in many ways he'd prefer it if he never had to speak or see me again as Im an unfortunate reminder to him of the way he behaved...(in terms of mutual friends that know, having his new relationship be more accepted socially with certain people etc etc... ) but the flip side of that is that he would struggle with the girls and maintaining his work and lifestyle so....

In fairness I don't think he will look to alter the maintenance. He is a high earner and thus pays me more than the basic CSA amount (but not as much as I could have asked for as part of the financial settlement so I don't think he would want to rock that boat too much).

I pick up/have the girls on 'his' nights and always have with the exception of one of them during the summer months when he does a half day. He finishes early on one of his nights, but that means he gets home at 6 as opposed to any time after 7, and which doesn't help me with dd2 who needs someone around from 3.30 onwards right now.

YANBU- I may be wrong but it seems a bit like your Ex-h is micro-managing you. I find people do this when they are out of their depth & unsure of their role in work/life.

You've been letting him do this to you so he will continue doing it until you make him stop. Who is taking DDs to school on cake days? If it is him just let him know now that you cannot make any cake and don't.

He's a high earner. Can't he figure something out the evenings he has the gjrls to accommodate dd needing to be picked up at 3.30. Otherwise you may as well go to weekends only and get the additional cash from him. If your job suffers because of this, what are you going to do?

He wants 50/50 then he should be picking up his own kids on his days. Not you running around for him.

Job is suffering a bit tbh...in fact I'm probably going to have to hand in my notice and do some part time work instead to accommodate dd2 for now...(in some ways that's a positive as i am retraining and am way behind with my studies and I'm also fed up at my current work-though lots of that might be because I've always a bit of my mind at home-not applying myself properly I guess-feels like fighting a losing battle)-but that's another thread!

I agree to ignore. Keep talking to him how you usually would, he will get over himself soon.

Hold on.
He is allegedly a father 50/50 BUT he doesn't pick up in his days, you have to to the detriment of your job.
You are talking about resigning to find a small part time job.
What on earth is that organisation??
How can you accept to still make all the sacrifices and for him to carry in doing whatever he wants whilst LOOKING like a great Father?

Re rocking the boat and the effect on the dcs
Do you think that seeing their mum jumping whenever their dad says so is good for them? Dont YOU think they deserve to learn that it's OK to be assertive and ensure that you are not taken for granted too?
I think you are giving up too much for the sake of 'not rocking the boat' and he knows that.

It is unlikely that your ex is going to change, so all you do is try to change your reaction to him.

With regards to the paperwork for clubs and school, I would just presume that he isn't going to do any of it and get it done myself. I know this isn't 50/50 parenting but that rarely works out TBH, best to just make sure it actually gets done, which can only be guaranteed by doing it yourself.

Other things like the cakes and other endless school requests like costumes, contributions for tombolas, etc - if you've got the time and resources to do them with the kids, then great. If not, they are not compulsory and the children won't suffer if they aren't done, so give them a miss. Again presume your ex will not do any of these, so let your children know that you won't be able to contribute this time.

What is the actual split of care? It isn't 50/50 for sure.

I guess because if I don't do it it won't get done...and then the kids suffer...dd needs one of us at home just now-and realistically it's going to be me-he isn't going to do it-he agrees it needs doing but not to the point he will do it himself... he's got the big job etc etc...and in some ways he's right-if he didn't have his job, he wouldn't be able to pay me the maintenance, I couldn't afford the house in which the girls and I live, we'd be stymied.
Plus of course Im her mum and I want to be there for her-but it will make things financially harder for me that's for sure...

It's not 50/50 care-it's 60/40 to me in terms of nights, plus extra in terms of pick ups...what he means when he says 50/50 is that we are equally paternally responsible, equally able to make decisions about what happens with the girls, and unspoken- his agenda is as important as the agenda he perceives that I have I guess... so effectively I do more of the actual work (which most of the time I'm not 100% unhappy with as they are my children after all), but he gets the same jurisdiction as he sees it, and the same recognition as their parent. Rubbish deal for me, but I've accepted it as the girls would be affected if I didn't. It's just days like today, emails like today's, that do my head in.And I'm tired and there needs to be a bit more balance, you are all right.

Yeah, I get all that old shit about staying in the family home etc. Fact is we wouldn’t have this home, family, well-rounded secure stable children if it weren’t for me. Maintenance does not buy your services, it pays for the children to live their lives. You aren’t the paid help. He doesn’t get it.

Sounds like you believe you're only choice is to prop up everything for him and enable him to be the fantasy 50:50 split father.

You've ignored all the suggestions for non-nuclear changes, which are putting up boundaries in a polite but clear way.

I don't mind being ignored but I would suggest you ask yourself why you are dismissing this as an option?

Do you think polite but firm change in the way you react will cause a massive response?

Do you think that response would end up with you in a worse position than you are now?

If so, then perhaps posters can help think about different options to help you stop being the down trodden micro-managed slave (!).

But I'm questioning this as I'm not sure why you are avoiding sticking up for yourself? You're obviously upset about the unfairness and low status you've been given in this dynamic your ex has imposed. So why is redrawing the rules of engagement in small but immovable ways not a Good Thing?

If your mental load improves and your status isn't so low, I think you'll find life a hell of a lot easier and more pleasurable. And your future relationships put on the right path - it's not a good thing for children to grow up believing it's ok for one parent to be the low status, put upon, ordered around, constantly sacrificing one (the woman), and the lofty perfect male directing and criticising from on high. That's not a good dynamic to teach your daughters, as they'll either believe they have less value than their future partners, or they'll channel their inner tyrant and start ordering you around too. Neither is a future that's bright for you or your dc.

You don't have to answer any of that of course, but hoping prodding a bit might help you think through exactly what's going on and the pros or cons of continuing the current status quo. Good luck though, whatever you decide is the right path.

Absolutely not ignoring it-and im sorry if it comes across like that...I'm
Just very conscious of trying to keep things on an even keel for the kids. Part of that is me being on an even keel and I know first hand how unpleasant and undermining he can be, in ways that are subtle but would make me very anxious and probably unwell-and I am scared of inviting that- I have to admit.

It's been an awful couple of years. Our break up involved my best friend-it knocked me for six that part-and I ended up losing a very good job I had just started as a result. That in itself had a serious effect on my mental health-I've never not been good at my job before-it was all a big mess in lots of ways, that I'm just now getting out off...I don't want to get back in to it in any way if I can avoid it.

Things between h and I were not good at all for obvious reasons-and although we didn't argue in front of the kids very much, they picked up on a lot, found out a lot, worked a lot out for themselves....and I wasn't able to help them as much as I'd like as I was struggling too-so I guess some of my appeasement of him now is born of guilt about that uneasy time that I didn't help the girls through as I feel I should have, and about making things as good for them now as they can be.

But as you all point out I've gone too far the other way to my detriment and I need to man up and push some of the work back to him I think..

He really needs to start pulling his weight regarding the school pick up, why are you sacrificing your career for him when he's not even your husband anymore?

Quitting your job and getting a part time, likely to be low paid one now is very short sighted.
The maintenance years won't last forever and it'll go by quicker than you think and if you can't afford the house now whochput his maintenance then how will you afford it or afford to move if you're on a low income?

It sounds like you react abdcreply quickly to his emails, at least make sure you wait a few hours and collect your thoughts before you do from now on.
Anything he forwards on from the school just reply with 'thank you but I do get these emails too'
Anything he says he needs you to cover which he should be at you reply 'As you know, i was already intending to attend but it's a shame you won't make it'
Cakes that need buying on his days just say 'oh well it's a shame the girls won't have one but I'm sure they'll explain to the school you couldn't buy any' then have some waiting if you like but don't tell him.

So he gets arsey with you, do what? Is your maintenance agreed and will he stop seeing the kids? I doubt he'll change anything as he won't be able to spin it as father of the year otherwise

I hear you OP. I still get nervous about confrontation XH might cause if I don’t comply.

He flatly refused to help last week, although he was available. He barely has the children. He’s meant to have them tomorrow. I’ve just had a text informing me ‘we’ may have a problem

Dicking cake sales

If everyone made a cake there would be too many cakes anyway

And why can't he fucking bake one !

Off topic I know but all these people wasting money on ingredients for shitty cakes that get chucked

Anyway keep a diary stay calm and carry on 💪🏼