To never see my dad without his wife there?

[lizziejs]

I’m mid 30’s. Parents divorced when I was in my teens due my dad having an affair. My dad subsequently married OW. My siblings and I must have met her the first time when I was about 17 because we thought if they were going to keep being together, we might as well get it out in the open and try and move forward. I really regret making it so easy for them now.

Since then I have very rarely seen my dad without his new wife there. She literally comes to everything. She’s not got kids of her own and is pretty awkward around mine who are 10 months and 2.

I don’t really like his wife but have always been really kind for my dads sake (which has really upset my mum who is a really brilliant mother.) I always send thoughtful birthday gifts, help when we go to their house, talk to her, seem interested etc. I’ve done my best in what’s felt like tricky circumstances.

Is it normal and acceptable that I never see my dad without this woman (who I never invited into my life and has caused my siblings and I so much misery) being there? I don’t want her there every time - I would just like the odd visit with just my dad so I don’t have to be on best behaviour with this woman who isn’t my family and is so different to anyone else I would choose to be around. It’s like being with a colleague.

Step-parents, do you do this? Does it feel like an ok thing to never allow your partners children to see them without you being there? I’m just interested if other adult children feel this.

I’ve never spoken to my dad about this. He would go all silent and be really ‘hurt’ by it and it would probably be more weird. I’m currently just avoiding seeing them at all.

I'd start to avoid seeing him, tbh. If he asked, then I'd tell the truth and he could take his 'hurt' and shove it.

sloe I remember that I used to cherish the rare times I got to speak to my dad without my mum lurking eavedropping in the background. She's dead now (3 years ago) but I've spoken to my dad far more often (and freely) since she died. Maybe it's not just a step-parent issue.

I think it's reasonable to want to see your DF on his own sometimes. My DSis is a stepmum and she's been in her DSS's life since he was 9 (he's 20 and married with a baby now. ) She was also his primary carer when her DH was at work as he lived with them and not his mum for a few years. She has 3 DCs of her own and she loves her DSS just as much.

But she's always been careful not to intrude too much on his time with his dad, which I think she feels is very important, especially as he was a single dad for some years before she came along.

You should try and talk to him about it. If your SM is always there you could try email/letter maybe? You should make sure there's no suggestion of blame so that he doesn't go on the defensive.

I’ve never spoken to my dad about this. He would go all silent and be really ‘hurt’ by it

Would he? You could broach the matter, quietly, gently and diplomatically and present it in a positive way - hey Dad how about just you and me going to x for some father-daughter time?

However, I do think in our mid-30s we sometimes start to see our parents as they really are. He does sound overly-dependant on her. I also suggest he might be silent and "hurt" because he might have to face up to a truth he would rather avoid, rather than keep pretending playing happy families. Some people prefer to remain cocooned in their unreal little world.

I feel your pain. My DPs split when I had left for uni but my sister was still at home. My Dad, in his misguided desperation to do right by his wife and keep his second marriage on track, insisted on her and her kids being invited to everything, joining in everything and tried to mesh together a blended family of all adult children. Bar my sister who was quite a bit younger and obviously couldn't speak for herself as easily.

It got more and more frustrating and I got more furious until one day by sister - then 18, rang me in floods of tears saying she'd asked my Dad if he fancied going somewhere for dinner with her and he'd declined. His reason was he didn't like to leave his wife alone at home. She is older than him and perfectly intelligent and independent. I lost it. I rang him straight away and I'm ashamed to say without checking where he was or who he was with I screamed and shouted at him and told him I was sick of him putting his wife first all the time, that my sister and I needed to feel we mattered too and how dare he refuse dinner with his 18yo when so many 18yos wouldn't dream of wanting to spend time with their parents and didn't he realise how lucky he was.

Unbeknownst to me, my Stepmum was in the car and heard everything. It was horrific. But to give them their due we haven't really had any issues since. They both allocate separate time to spend with kids and grandkids and my dad comes up once a month or so and hangs out with just me and DD. I love it and then we do bigger family holidays or Easter/Xmas at his with step mum.

Anyway my point is, I think you have to talk to your Dad (reasonably, I wouldn't recommend how I did it) and give him a chance to rectify it. Either suggest some things you could do together and say you miss spending time with just him or tell him how much you struggle. I hope you can turn things around

I'm a step mum, I am perfectly happy for my husband and stepson to spend time together without me. I'd equally be upset if he always saw him without me and I was never included.

You sound lovely, like you've really made an effort with her and your dad. I think the parents have let you down. It's a shame your mum got upset about you being friends with your dad and his new wife (yes I understand she was the ow and your mum has a right to be upset, totally, but it's a shame that she let that affect your life and relationship with your dad). Your dad has let you down by being so flaky and pathetic when it comes to seeing you without the new wife. He should know that his children would sometimes want to see him alone, it shouldn't need pointing out. Perhaps time to put your foot down a bit and be a little less lovely when you talk to him? If he stalls and mums and ers tell him how it's letting you down and he needs to change. Put your own feelings at the front for once. Tell him it's damaging your relationship with his wife as you're starting to resent her always being there.. Tell him/them that you want to be friends with her (even if it's a white lie!) but that you just want some one on one time with your dad.

I see how it sounds like I blame her for the affair and not my dad, but don’t at all. He’d actually had an affair before with someone else so she wasn’t the only other woman - he’s hardly the blameless and it’s ‘in his blood’ so to speak.

I can see what some of you are saying - they are husband and wife. I do most things with my husband, they probably do the same. She’s his wife, why shouldn’t she be there.

I really appreciate both the people saying ‘I know how you feel’ and also those with the other side of the coin, it’s useful to get another perspective.

So you are faced with a choice ... to leave him there or challenge him. No easy answers or clear outcomes.

Ums and ers that should say!

YANBU, though I think there is a huge difference between you having a stepmother who had nothing to do with the breakup of your family, and this woman, who did.

If this lady was simply your father's new partner/wife, she is bound to be around a lot, though I would expect her to be sensitive to allowing his children and him some time alone, without shutting her out. She would be integral, family, and I would hope you welcome her as much as she welcomes you.

But your circumstance is different, it is the OW. So you have a backdrop of this woman not respecting you in your past (if she did, she wouldn't have been 50% responsible for breaking up your family), and the damage she and your father created. Hard to have respect for either of them to be honest, but you have close ties with your father, so how you handle him is up to you. But her - you are in a difficult position, and I really do not feel you are BU to request she is not around when you visit.

My parents aren't divorced and although I see my Mum on her own I have racked my brains and can't think of time when I've seen Dad on his own.

I think there are very few of us who arent in a form of step relationship. I had a stepmother, I got on well with her and still do even though my dad has been passed 15 years now. But their relationship wasnt born out of an affiar, it was from berevement so I didnt see my mother as the aggrieved party .

I do appreciate what you are saying but you also have to bring it back to your own situation and 'what ifs'. Couples tend to move as couples. Especially within family units. What if someone tried to isolate out your partner/DH? you wouldnt be happy would you?

Just to point out that my Mum and Dad are still married but I never see one without the other! If your Dad and SMum are married and live in the same house it would be a be a bit odd to try and see him without her wouldn't it? What do you want - her to go out of the day whilst you pop round or maybe him to pop over to yours leaving her alone at home for the day?

When my Mum was alive, if I rang, my Dad put me straight on to my Mum - we never talked more than a minute and that was if I managed to keep him from going to fetch her. Some men seem to be happy to shift any relationship responsibility driving seat onto their wife and stand back.

Maybe not such a popular view but let's face it - the both of them are pretty bad eggs aren't they?

What a shit of a Dad to have multiple affairs. And what a thoughtless entitled arse to then tell you how lovely she is. My response would be 'Well to be honest I try not to think about how much both of you are really not at all lovely people'.

The one I feel so so sorry for is your Mum. I can see how you thought you were doing the best thing but it must kill her to see those two 'get off scot free' so to speak - enjoying family and grandparent time, no comeuppance for their (joint) behaviour at all. No thought for the fact that while he plays with your kids, he did the worst things to his own - they get the same regard and privileges (in public at least).

My answer to your conundrum would be - why would you want to spend more time with your dad alone? They've made it clear they come as a pair - why not say fair enough, I don't like her and actually I don't owe you a thing Dad - so thanks but not thanks, I'll focus my love and spend me and my childrens' precious time with the person who has shown by her actions that she truly cares?

Triple benefits. You don't have to see her, you don't have to act like you condone his behaviour any more, and you can show your mum that now the chips are down, you do value her and her loyalty more.

I'd keep avoiding, see them rarely for a courtesy visit and spend your grandparent time with your mum. And when your dad points it out, say - well you reap what you sow really.

with all due respect to your first post @SloeSloeQuickQuickGin, it's not the same situation at all. this woman was directly involved in the affair that broke apart OP's family, and OP not wanting the OW at every interaction is hardly the same as her father not including his son-in-law and DGC. OW may not be 100% to blame, but she is certainly not an innocent party, and I can well understand (from personal experience) how OP might not want to see her at every point, esp given how hard it must be on her mum.

I also find the idea of couples who are married needing to do every single thing together ridiculous. Do they never go out to lunch without each other? Does every social interaction need to include both of them? Do they not have their own sets of friends? If my DH came to every one of my social outings I'd be .

OP is not asking for EVERY meeting to be just with her dad, and she's not saying she doesn't want to see her stepmum. But it's not unreasonable to want to have some alone time with her actual parent. OP, maybe you can suggest an activity that you and your dad can do alone... you can even phrase it that way. Clearly he can understand that your interactions with just him would be different. He should want that, too.

Best of luck.

I too understand exactly how you feel. My dad left us for the OW when I was six and they've been married pretty much since the divorce came though. For the entirety of my childhood I very rarely saw him alone. We went to his house EOW and he never took us out, even for a walk, without her/her DC being there and in adulthood it continued .... until quite recently there was a change. I'm now in my 40s and have two DC and in the past couple of years, since he retired I suppose, he's started to spend more time with us, visit us sometimes on his own, etc. And she goes and does things with her DC and GC without him. It's bloody lovely! The difficulty with your SM is that she doesn't have DC of her own, but I hope that in time she relaxes a bit and 'allows' him to spend time with you without always being there. I see it as an insecurity thing, but it shouldn't be. After all, these men left their DC for these women, so you'd think they'd feel rather pleased with themselves, but instead they cling like limpets. Really annoying.

Oh I hate the argument she is innocent - he broke up his marriage. Yes he did but that does not absolve the other half from having an affair with a married man. My best friend had an affair with my EX - the betrayal on so many levels is immense - breaking of friendships, loyalites, trust from the perosn I loved and the non family person I trusted.
Everyone knows the likely fall out and the upset to the innocent parties.

Sadly it is yet another example of the "new" family sticking two fingers up to the old - collectively and often trying to prove a point that the affair was right and that they are still together so they were right. The hurt, anger, sadness and fractured relationships do not matter because two people are "happy".

Sick to death of people sticking up for the OW and OM - they are as bad in different ways as the one in the relationship

I also know how you feel from a slightly different angle. My daughter's partner was attached to her like glue and whilst we enjoyed his company and liked him we did start to notice that we almost never saw our daughter without him in tow. We never said anything because if you imply to someone that you'd rather see less of their partner it's invariably only going to be taken very badly.

She eventually left because he was too clingy and suffocating (borderline controlling by the sounds of things).

I'm a step mum and I'd be bowled over with the effort that you make. I'm not the OW, however I still see the value in one to one time with your Dad. In fact I'm forever encouraging them to do stuff together.

I'd speak to your Dad outright and say you want this. It's such an important relationship the one with your parents. Good luck.

The problem is, if she wasn't there, it would just be your Dad and you - and then you and he would have to have a deeper relationship.

This is clearly what you want, spending time with your Dad, one on one. However, it doesn't seem to be what he wants.

You might be faced with some painful realities - such as he doesn't actually know how to to have a relationship with you. It does seem like his top priority has been pleasing your SM, not you - and if seeing him alone was his only option you might not see much of him.

I think you have all done really well to have the relationship with him that you have. But you may have to accept that this is what it is going to be, he is who he is not who you would like him to be, and he just can't do that one step further that you would really like.

I think you should talk to your Dad and ask to see him alone sometimes. I don't always go along with DH when he visits his Mum for instance, because I think it is important to have time alone with a parent, and that is in a much less difficult situation than yours. I think your Dad is being selfish and thoughtless. He is forcing a relationship between you and the OW to make himself feel better. He has to see that your needs matter too, and to work on his relationship with his children.

I don't think yabu but you need to just get on with saying something to him and see if he changes his tune. If he's hurt then you've got your answer, if this time next week you're both enjoying a coffee then great. As it stands I think you sound a very levelled and reasonable individual conducting yourself the way you have over the last 15-odd years. Just say something.

Contessa said Maybe it's not just a step-parent issue and I agree.
When I was younger I would have loved to have a chat and a giggle with just me and mum, but my dad was always there eavesdropping because he thought that we were always talking about him (wrong! why would I have wasted my breath talking about that moody and nasty sod)

I know 2 couples who are joined at the hip in this sort of way, both relationships came from affairs and in bogh cases it is the OW who insists in being involved in every last bit of the husbands life.

My feeling is that they know exactly what sort of man they "won" and so dont trust them an inch, knowing very well what they are capable of.

If that is the case here then talking to him wont make much, if any, difference. Some men will always put their wants and needs before their kids. In one case in particular the OW has been very successful in airbrushing the ex and kids out of existence and he did nothing to prevent it.