To judge this woman?

[moralberyll]

Leaving the local maternity unit today and a heavily pregnant woman who is obviously a patient as she was wearing a dressing gown, slippers and pyjamas was standing right near the doorway smoking a cigarette, there is a big sign up saying 'no smoking on campus'. Aibu to judge her that she is not only putting her own baby at risk but she wants to put other people's baby's at risk from secondhand smoke as well? I would definitely have said something if i were leaving the unit with my newborn baby!

AtHomeDadGlos

squeekums there's a difference between something not being recommended and being actively harmful though.

I contend that, during those months of pregnancy, a woman's body is not solely hers and hers alone. It is also that of the foetus growing inside, and therefore there should be a responsibility to that foetus if the woman is planning to carry to term.
Of course it's her right to choose whether to do so (I'm not Rees-Mogg), but, if the choice is made to continue with the pregnancy then support (and possible sanctions) should be offered to help said mum-to-be have a healthy child.
Failing that, perhaps the NHS should refuse to help the child with asthma related illnesses; if the mother couldn't give a shit to stop smoking why should the NHS pick up the tab?

Your a joke dude

Again, your wrong, even when pregnant a woman still allowed to do as she pleases with it. We own our bodies. By your logic a woman on medication for say depression or say a heart condition shouldnt become pregnant as they cant just give up the meds.
You do realise asthma isnt just bought by smoking? There is family history, environment like weather, dust, other smoke not cigarettes

If a woman lives in a heavy pollution area, lock her up to? Force her to abort?
Plus once a child is born they are an individual person with every right to healthcare. Again by your logic, crack babies should be left to withdraw on their own yeah?

Women who say other women should have no bodily autonomy in pregnancy annoy me

Men who say it, make me irate
You will never be pregnant, how dare you deem what a woman can and cant do

Do we get a say in your prostate care? Vasectomy? Maybe we should.....

Here we go again.
'You have a penis therefore can't comment on anything to do with women'.

Superb. You win the best troll award. 🏆

Lmao
Basic fact, why should you, a male, get to dictate what women do with their body?
Should we get a say in mens bodies in the same way? See i dont think i have a right to dictate what men can do with theirs as they issues i will NEVER experience

Also, and this really is becoming a bit tit-for-tat, medication for a heart condition or depression are medical necessities and quite different from smoking.

I really can't understand why so many of you defend the right of the pregnant woman to choose to harm their unborn child.

It's as if the rights of women in any circumstance should trump the rights of others.

I haven't dictated anything.

I think you're letting emotion cloud the argument.

AtHome do you not realise how horrible you are coming across? You cannot ever tell a pregnant woman what to do wth her body, no matter how unfortunate the outcome on the baby will be, once you do it's a slippery slope.

Stress is proven more harmful than cutting down on the cigarettes, so by your suggestion of fines and forced classes you would be causing more stress to the unborn child which can lead to small birth weight or premature birth meaning they require immediate NHS services and doesn't solve the problem, in fact you would be creating one. All the things you are advices not to eat have been found to cause some issue but you say that is different somehow? Could you please expand on that, as I don't understand how smoking (to you) is advisable not to be done but should require a punishment if it is, yet other things like food avoidance shouldn't be punished as it's just a suggestion? How does that work? Both have been proven to be harmful yet you take more offence to smoking? Also, I cannot condone punishing a child for a mothers actions which is what you are suggesting with regards to not treating children of mothers who smoked during pregnancy.

Advising*

Forgive all the typos.

AthomeDadGlos you're being incredibly sexist and offensive. You're repeated use of hysterical woman tropes says everything about you and how you view the world not anything about the women you are trying to mock and belittle.

Furthermore you're still talking about potential harms to the unborn when it's pointed out earlier by women who have experienced the loss of a pregnancy that a dead baby isn't harmed by what they smoke outside the hospital after being told they've lost their baby. Its grossly insensitive like the rest of the snap judgements going on here.

I work in a large hospital that has smokers outside the entrance, and I've asked security ( which is just inside the main entrance) to please go out and ask people to move if they want to smoke. They won't because they reckon it's not worth the abuse they get, surely the no smoking signs mean they should? I'm a smoker too but don't at work because it's unfair to non smokers.
If you all object so much SAY SOMETHING!!
People are quick enough to have a go at people who park in disabled/ child spaces, so why not this?

How would a fine work practically?

Do we test pregnant women at maternity appointments? If they refuse then what?

It's potentially damaging for children if their fathers smoke prior to conception... maybe we should ban all men from smoking in case they at some point have a child and pass on damaged DNA due to their choice to smoke

I haven't 'repeatedly used hysterical women tropes' thank you, I said that one commenter (gender unknown) had replied to me hysterically. The only one who brought gender into it was them and subsequent posters.

Also, I'm very sympathetic to those who have just been told their pregnancy isn't viable, but you're taking that and extrapolating that therefore smoking is ok when pregnant. It isn't. And it shouldn't be socially acceptable.

Athomedad you're being misogynistic. Woman are engaging and conversing with you despite the fact you know nothing about being pregnant and never will. And you're repaying that respect by being sexist.

The OP was about a woman smoking while pregnant outside the door of a hospital on a no smoking campus.

The OP was not being unreasonable to be pissed off at that, and in the vast majority of cases (taking aside those who smoke when they've found out their pregnancy isn't viable) smoking while pregnant is abhorrent and sets up life-long health complications for your future child.

But, by all means, a woman's right to 'bodily autonomy' trumps that of a child's to good health. So go ahead and smoke.

you can't possibly know the vast majority of smoking mothers give their children life long medical problems. I imagine it's the complete opposite, especially as everyone I know who smoked during pregnancy only had a few a week

jordan how exactly am I being sexist? Can you provide me with the quotes where I've been explicitly sexist?

-calling women hysterical

• claiming women who smoke don't care about their unborn child
• advocating continual punishment of women who smoke during pregnancy

None of those are quotes.

Points two and three aren't sexist.

Point one didn't happen. I called one person's argument hysterical. The only people to bring gender into it are subsequent posters such as yourself.

Stress is proven more harmful than cutting down on the cigarettes

This is rubbish.

Women have the right to smoke while pregnant if they want to butets not pretend there's a medical defence for it.

I'm sorry but I don't have the time or inclination to go through 17 pages finding quotes to use in the hope a man will admit he's been sexist- and furthermore I am not obliged to do so because you told me to.

You'll never agree that it was so what's the point? Men don't recognise their ingrained sexism because you know, patriarchy, so they then just add to the sexism by telling women they're wrong about that too.

Just like you are :)

Ah I see. So you're right just 'because' then? You don't have to prove anything, but then if you take umbridge with something I've said and accuse me of something the burden really is on you to prove it.

Falling back on the argument of 'ingrained patriarchal sexism' is lazy at best and disingenuous at worse.

Of course I don't have to prove anything. Have you proved anything to back up your ridiculous ideas? We're not in court, this is a chat forum.