To wish the drive drive laws were clearer

[Kindoline]

Or just do away with them and have a zero limit?

Reading the Kirsty Gallagher articles. She was still three times over the limit 7hrs after she stopped drinking. How can anyone really know when they are ok to drive the next day? I always struggle to work out if I'm ok to pick my car up the next afternoon or not. Trying to do unit/hours maths whilst hungover isn't easy either. Plus everyone's metabolic rate is different. So presumably a big fella who is use to drinking heavily may not be over the limit whereas a slight woman would be.

It's all as clear as mud

The problem with breathalysers is that they need frequent calibration to ensure correct readings, without this they can be more dangerous than using a 'rule of thumb' calculation as they may incorrectly say you are safe to drive.
Personally I think the real problem is people who (often habitually) drive when they are obviously over the limit, rather than the law itself, so the focus should be on enforcing the limit more stringently. A good start would be regular random testing of drivers, however policing is inadequate to do this- how many times do you see people blatantly on hand-held mobile phones while driving? It's plain to see, totally against the law, but the chances of being caught and charged are minimal.

Whenever this is discussed I get the feeling that some people would like the right to drive around legally while pissed but, you know, not arseholed.

There's a sense that some people resent being held accountable for their own choices/actions.

I always thought they were pretty clear. It's don't drink and drive. At all.

The aim isn't to 'allow' people to max up to the limit. It's to give some lea way to people who might consume products with small amounts of alcohol in. If you go out on a bender and expect to be able to drive the next day, then more fool you. Unfortunately though, it isn't just your risk, it putting the rest of us at risk too.

DH messed up once (well he has messed more than once, but only this one example is relevant) and forgot he was taking DS to his Saturday morning activity. DH, to his credit, realized he was probably still over the limit and took DS by bus, two buses there and two buses back as opposed to the 10 minute drive if he'd been sober.

So it's simple, you either skip the drink or skip the driving.

I rarely drink so it's never too much of an issue. My DH has used the calculator prior to drinking if he knows he will need to drive the next day. He's not a big drinker either but if we are out with friends and staying over then he'll work out when we are leaving and calculate back when he can have his last drink. That might be the difference between having an after dinner drunk or not. He always allows enough if a gap for error.

It's not about trying to beat a charge but more about ensuring that you don't drive even though you feel perfectly fine.

Just get one of those alcosense breathalyser things. DH has one and uses it if he's been out the evening before.

As above though, it's usually one unit per hour. Personally, if I've been drinking after about 8pm, I usually leave it til after lunchtime.

I wish they'd just say zero and that's that

Nothing to stop you doing that yourself though is there? You could have decided not to drive the day after a heavy drinking session.

But then, there's another problem as to when will your body have processed all the alcohol. For some it may be the next lunchtime, for others the evening, so having a zero limit doesn't actually help does it?

The limit should be as much as the body can generate from fermenting fruit and the traces from mouthwash added together.

Eighteen months minimum disqualification, not twelve.

Seven years, not three, for a repeat offence at any time, not just within ten years.

And do away with these courses which just allow people who can afford the fee to get a quarter off their disqualification.

The limit is fine currently.
If you are over the limit, more fool you.

I'm upset she didn't get a custodial sentence.
'Stress of her divorce' - yeah right...

Drink drive limits are evidence based though, not based on say, ability to understand or whether or not you have a hangover. There is evidence that ability to drive is impaired after x level- there is no evidence that your ability to drive is affected after say, half a pint of shandy. I think the zero tolerance laws are infantilising. It will be interesting to see whether they result in safer roads, although my understanding is this isn't the case in many zero tolerance countries and there are many factors far lore critical in keeping the roads safe (the laws around a cars roadworthiness, the standard of driving test, speed/ driving rules enforcement, general Road safety education, all of which are excellent in England and Wales)

Far more, not lore

@Neutrogena
I agree, I was very disappointed in her sentence.

Anyone who can afford to go on the swill to that extent can afford a taxi. Or sleep in a gutter and get the bus home the next day.

Or maybe just drink less?

She was stopped at 11am. If it was 7 hours since she stopped drinking then that was 4am! Quite the party.

Yeah... really not hard to work out that you're still going to be over the limit and tired as fuck to boot!

She had no business driving at 11am when she was still drinking at 4am.

She is a twat.

Actually loads of people dont drink and allow 24 hours before driving. My dad would not drink if he was driving the next day.

I never drink on a sunday when i am doing the Monday school run and/or working.

And dont drink during the week. Loads of people at work do exactly the same. We only work in an office.

Not killing someone and keeping my license is important to me.

You don't have to be teetotal in the evening to ensure you won't kill someone the next day

Who said you had to be tee total?

Demented, but if you've had a few glasses of wine and then spirits and maybe a few shots where do you even start?

I'd say with a trip to the GP to talk about an obvious alcohol problem. Nobody needs to drink that much in the first place, let alone think about driving the next day.

You did. You said you, your dad and everyone in your office doesn't drink if they need to drive the next day

Why does anybody need somebody, or some omnipotent organisation, to tell them not to drink and drive? Are some people so lax and weak now that they can't make a sensible decision themselves not to drink and drive, to treat it as Zero regardless of what the legal position may be?

If you're going to drive, don't drink.

The drink drive laws are perfectly clear. You can't drive drunk, first thing in the morning. KG was 3x the limit I mean FFS I'm surprised that she could walk tbh.

And it brings out the MN weird attitudes to alcohol 'If you have 2 glasses of wine you may be over the limit the next morning'. Well yeah maybe if you drank them at 3am. If you have with your dinner at 7pm you won't. But the point is that KG had clearly drunk about 3 bottles and was drinking till 4am. It is hardly the same thing.

If you've had a few glasses of wine and then spirits and maybe a few shots you already have a drink problem.

Eh...?

You said you, your dad and everyone in your office doesn't drink if they need to drive the next day

No i said 'lots of people at work'. Not all.

Pls read what i wrote. That doesnt mean being tee total. Plenty of us drink. We just dont drive for about 24 hours after. We travel for work and its common for someone bot to drink as they are driving from the train station.

No one said be tee total. I am simply saying its not that difficult or unheard of for people to not drink the day before they need to drive.

The fact that some people think saying no to a few drinks isnt possible is quite worrying.

When drinking at home loads of people arent sure of measures. Especially when they arent making their own drink. My choice is to not drink if i know i am driving. Some people at work make the same choice. So did my dad. Its not that shocking really