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AIBU?

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Original poster

to let DS do school project on Jack the Ripper?

379 replies

soupforbrains · 15/08/2017 14:25

DS is 10. he is bright, loves reading and is a huge history buff.

Summer homework project is "Choose a famous Victorian to learn about and present what you learn in a creative way".

DS wants to do Jack the Ripper, DS is already aware of Jack the Ripper from the Horrible Histories books and some other kids books/shows which have discussed great unsolved mysteries.

I think this is a fun idea, and together we have discussed presenting the finding on a big board like and investigation/crime board. Obviously there will be some glossing over of the details and clearly we're not about to stick crime scene photos up. We've also discussed looking into the living conditions in the east end of london at the time to give more social history learning to it than just the crimes.

I'm not an idiot and I know that this idea is perhaps a bit risky but so long as we do it in an age appropriate and not over gory manner would IBU to let son do this. Additionally would any teachers out there consider it to be interesting and a bit different from the no doubt countless Isambard Kingdom Brunels which turn up, or a step too far?

OP posts:
Dustbunny1900 · 15/08/2017 16:25

I very much understand what it's like to have an intense fascination with the macabre and gruesome..even as an adult. And even as I find myself revolted with serial killer worship and the violence done against females and female sex workers in particular.
I'm just not sure at ten it's appropriate for an entire class of children. I'm sure your son is a great kid and it does NOT mean he's some kind of sicko-in- waiting good grief! I was very much that child fascinated with horror and death and the sick chill up my spine , and was STILL very empathetic and haven't killed anyone yet Hmm
I just think maybe, since it was SUCH a gruesome set of murders that to be safe I'd choose someone else

Rightpivotturn · 15/08/2017 16:25

It's a vile idea.

And just for accuracy, there's no evidence that Florence Nightingale ever personally stopped Mary Seacole joining her nurses.

Icantreachthepretzels · 15/08/2017 16:26

Mary Anning - but I think she was regency period, very early Victorian if not.

starsorwater · 15/08/2017 16:30

Beatrix Potter was also a rejected natural historian as well as being in on the foundation of the National Trust. Bit of a leap from J the R though.

Early exploration?

histinyhandsarefrozen · 15/08/2017 16:32

Hertha ayrton was also refused entry to ra- a fascinating life but ltd appeAl to a 10 yr old.

Harriet Tubman and resistance to slavery could be interesting. I still think race to the Antarctic is brilliant.

starsorwater · 15/08/2017 16:33

John Franklin and the North West passage is a good detective story, and plenty gruesome enough at the end.

Original poster
soupforbrains · 15/08/2017 16:33

pretzels drat, I like her story, I was hoping I could promote her to DS...
oh well many other options. Burke & Hare are a great idea, the body snatchers of the victorian era were very prolific in general Burke and Hare just ran out of bodies to snatch.... Perhaps there's a physician we could also look at. Maybe look at the enormous developments in medical science and about how they learned a lot through disections, then lead into the body snatchers and then Burke&Hare?

OP posts:
Icantreachthepretzels · 15/08/2017 16:33

And just for accuracy, there's no evidence that Florence Nightingale ever personally stopped Mary Seacole joining her nurses.

Well no there's no evidence, but she put the corps together and Mary Seacole was rejected... twice.

I have a lot of time for Florence Nightingale, i think the rewrite of history treats her very unfairly- she knew she didn't set out to achieve what she wanted and she spent the rest of her life making up for it. the doctors wouldn't let her do what she needed to do as a nurse, they only let her clean (which she did) and wouldn't let supplies out of the cupboard (she hacked the cupboard down with an axe). But it was a racist time and she was a product of that. No one in the Victorian times will stand up to our own morals - claiming some people are worthies because they did a often means ignoring that they did b.
True Villains are more straight forward and don't involve whitewashing.

Original poster
soupforbrains · 15/08/2017 16:36

tinyhands the race to the antarctic could have some legs will add to list.

stars Beatrix Potter I love and so does DS but he's used her as a topic for a different project before about authors. Will add John Fanklin to the list though.

OP posts:
Icantreachthepretzels · 15/08/2017 16:36

. Perhaps there's a physician we could also look at

The horrible histories song is sung from the point of view of the doctor (Mat Baynton in a moustache, as someone scathingly referred to earlier), I can't remember if he has a name and was truly integral to the plot or if he's just a generic doctor (though I think he 's a specific doctor) - it's a first season song and I'm not that into the first season, but I think its the last episode of the first season, if that helps you find it.

sonjadog · 15/08/2017 16:37

Exactly, Ican.

Original poster
soupforbrains · 15/08/2017 16:38

Oh and if anyone has any creative presentation ideas to accompany their suggestions of other Victorians these would also we welcomed. Grin

OP posts:
Polly85 · 15/08/2017 16:39

Hi, I am a history teacher, and while we don't study Jack the Ripper in our school, I know lots of schools that do. It's in the textbook we use with year 8. I'd say go for it x

Doowappydoo · 15/08/2017 16:44

Sorry but I don't think it's appropriate for a school project. I can see why he is interested but I think you'll put his teacher in a very difficult position. I'm not sure I'd be impressed if my 10 year old came home having learned about Jack the Ripper.

I'm also not sure how far you can go with the unsolved murder and cleaning up the East End aspects without the context of who the victims were and what happened to them; e.g. how do we know each woman was murdered by the same man, why did the women stay out on the streets when they knew a serial killer on the loose? Those things require a level of explanation to make sense that aren't appropriate or understandable for most 10 yr olds.

OneOfTheGrundys · 15/08/2017 16:49

The subject can be fascinating but save it for when he is older and is able to appreciate and respect the horror and wider cultural context. I have covered j the r in Y9.

Charles Darwin?

AtomHeart · 15/08/2017 16:50

Personally, I would discourage a 10 year old from doing Jack the Ripper. I just can't see how you can "cover up" his crimes. It will get the kids talking, I'm sure. I imagine that the rest of his class are allowed to use Google unsupervised. I wouldn't want my child to be introducing this to other children, who may well go home and start talking about it to their parents. You might not be very popular!

I have to say, I have 3 children, and I have never put so much thought and effort into their homework that you seem to be doing. I don't know if I should feel bad about that.

OneOfTheGrundys · 15/08/2017 16:50

Appreciate and respect sounds all wrong. I mean-treat it with the respect and seriousness it warrants.

OneOfTheGrundys · 15/08/2017 16:53

Creative ideas for Darwin.

Model of The Beagle?
Present info on a map of The Galapagos/illustration of ape to man evolution?

Original poster
soupforbrains · 15/08/2017 17:00

Wikipedia "reliably" informs me that it was Robert Know who Burke and Hare sold their erm, wares to. Robert Know was the most popular lecturer on anatomy in Britain and a leading doctor in developing the modern science of medicine. so we can look at him, then maybe Burke and Hare. Perhaps we could draw around my DS's body and present it like that? Or use the crime board idea still given that Burke and HAre were arrested?

OP posts:
5foot5 · 15/08/2017 17:01

My initial reaction was YANBU as I think most 10 year olds would find a gory, unsolved murder quite fascinating.

Given the reaction of the majority of people on here though it seems you are right to be cautious. Not because of the risk of traumatizing the children but because of the potential outrage from other parents if they hear their children discussing it. FWIW I think most 10 year old's could take this in their stride and have very probably heard of J the R already. The Horrible Histories are very popular so I would be surprised if any of what he said came as a huge shock. The presentation ideas sound good.

dollydaydream114 · 15/08/2017 17:02

Burke & Hare would be a great one.

Original poster
soupforbrains · 15/08/2017 17:03

*Knox not know.... autocorrect.

grundy don't worry I knew what you meant but the respect/appreciate thing I don't suspect you of being a serial killer sympathiser Grin I would love for DS to do Darwin but I have tried before to interest him and he just doesn't light DSs spark. I hope that perhaps when he is older and learns more about genetics he will become switched on to it.

OP posts:
ProfessorBranestawm · 15/08/2017 17:04

I did a self directed project in year 6, I loved the London Dungeons and knew a lot on the subject of JtR, and torture methods Blush teacher was fine with it though, happy I was enthusiastic about learning stuff and she shared her own theories about the culprit with me.

I was far from the only one interested FWIW.

We weren't expected to share our research with others though so that is a big difference, it wouldn't have affected anyone else. I'm not sure how I'd feel if DD (10) heard about it, she is much more sensitive although she would probably look on it in a horrible histories way as she loves the show

Icantreachthepretzels · 15/08/2017 17:12

how do we know each woman was murdered by the same man,

Surely, technically, we don't do we? He was never caught. There was no DNA evidence back then, and I don't even know how good they would have been at checking it was the same knife that was used (especially if the cuts were jagged and brutal) Its perfectly feasible that some of the 8 were killed by a copycat killer. Anything known about JtR is just best guess -we assume it was the same person because he used the same methods in the same area over a short space of time, but it's deduction not fact - and my last sentence would answer the question satisfactorily for a child. (or and Adult-' we don't know' is a perfectly adequate answer)

why did the women stay out on the streets when they knew a serial killer on the loose?
Because they still had to live their lives, they were poor and had to work. Unless OP's Ds stops for questions at this exact juncture, nobody is going to ask what the women did for a living - its a presentation on JtR not his victims. Even if he does ask 'any questions' at the end (and there's nothing to suggest there will be a Q and A session, they'd be there all day if 30 kids did that) no one will remember to ask for the profession of the victims (after all, a child isn't going to assume that they all did the same job!)

BabychamSocialist · 15/08/2017 17:15

I don't see the issue with it. I'd be happy with it being submitted as a piece of work. We do Oliver Twist with our year 7s, and Bill Sikes is a very unsavoury character!

As long as he doesn't go further than you'd get in a horrible histories book, he'll be fine. Most people will be doing Queen Victoria and Florence Nightingale, so I applaud him for thinking outside the box!