Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To tell the dc about ex's infidelity without discussing it with him?

106 replies

theduchessstill · 09/08/2017 20:38

We split three years ago as a result of his infidelity with a mutual friend. They are no longer together – she was also married and she and ex have never been a ‘proper couple’. The dc knew her and her dd but we moved to another area of the city just before he told me, so ds1 remembers her vaguely and ds2 not at all afaik. They were 7 & 5 when we split.

When we split we just told the dc we weren’t getting on well and didn’t want to be arguing anymore. Unfortunately there were a lot of loud arguments as there was a period of 3 months between ex telling me about the affair and finally moving out. He had been a sahp (took advantage of that to shag the ow in our bed, sometimes leaving ds2 behind a stairgate Angry) so the dc had always been close to both of us – I always sort of over-compensated for not being there by kind of ‘leading things’ at weekends and during school holidays (teacher) when ex would take a step back. He wanted to move out and never wanted to be left with the dc.

The dc seem to have coped well with the split and we share custody about 70/30 to me. Ex has never had a career, which was why he was sahp, and, aside from his infidelity, we were arguing a lot over his work plans, or lack of them, at the time of the split. He wants to be a writer (but never finishes anything), or a musician (plays in bands, mainly for beer money) and since the split receives £700 per month from his mother and works part time through an agency. He has no work ethic and will walk out of places if he deems the boss to be an ‘arsehole’, or the role to be beneath him for whatever reason.

Today, looking through ds1’s school books from last year, I found some autobiographical work they had done. In it ds1 wrote about the split and how horrible it was to hear us arguing and how it has affected his life having to live between two homes. It was obviously hard to read, but not really surprising. However, twice he stated that the reason we split was that ‘dad wanted to get a job, and mum didn’t want him to.’ He also writes that I ‘wouldn’t stop teaching’ as if it was my burning desire to teach that had come between me and ex! This version of events is so far from the truth as to be laughable, especially the first bit. I asked ds why he had written that and he said it’s just what he thought. Thinking about it, ex first got a job of sorts after moving out, so I can see why ds1 has confused cause and effect in that way.

The comment about my work I feel may come from ex, as I suspect that he denigrates me to the dc and, if I am ever late from work to collect them from his, will rant about how I put my job first. Ds1 complains about my job a lot – in terms of the fact I am sometimes busy at weekends, can’t ever come to sports days etc, and, worst of all, it causes him to attend before and after school clubs, which he hates. I always explain how it pays for everything (and I mean everything – ex buys them absolutely nothing except for what he feeds them on his days, and pays me nothing) but he obviously resents it.

I just feel awful and that I have failed ds (and his brother) twice over- by giving him a shit life where he heard us arguing, has a split life, I don’t have a good work life balance and his dad has no money and lives in a pretty shitty environment – and, because we failed to give him a proper explanation for what happened and now he has made up a spurious explanation that is potentially dangerous for him to believe, in a way, because it is so far from the truth.

And no, I don’t want to be cast as the bad guy, because I’m really not, and it’s just not fair. I deal with all the shit – ex doesn’t really parent when he has them, and I can’t cope with thinking ds1 sees me as this crazed career woman who pissed everything up the wall because she was so addicted to marking.

I know if I ask ex he will tell me not to tell them, but WIBU, sometime over the remainder of the summer, to give them a highly edited, non-emotional version of the truth?

OP posts:
Berthatydfil · 10/08/2017 10:26

In relation to most things I think it's important to tell children as truthfully as possible as otherwise they either fill in the gaps themselves or accept what others may tell them which may not be the truth. Shielding them from the truth can lead to bigger issues down the line when they realise.

I would tell them as much as possible in a frank way that they understand without totally blackening your ex.

So in this case I would say that mummy and daddy really loved each other and promised to be best friends (use real life example eg like dc's school friends and bf etc) and they lived together and had (dcs) but then some things changed and daddy decided he wanted some new (best) friends (again if you have a real life example) this made everyone sad especially mummy and this meant had broken his promises and he couldn't live with mummy and them any more because it made her too sad.

When some grown ups get very sad they can also gets very cross and they argue so it's best to go stay somewhere else.

Some daddies would like to have lots of best friends and stay living with mummies and their children but that's not fair because it makes everyone (mostly mummies) too sad, but the daddies can get angry because they don't want to get a new house/ miss their dc so sometimes they say mean things or make things up when they are sad and cross. If daddies go to live in a new house that doesn't mean they don't love their dc.

Because mummy now lives on her own without daddy to help she has to go to work to get money to pay for their house. Daddies do help to pay for some things but it's not the same. Sometimes this means they can't do/have things they used to, but it's very important to work because if she didn't they wouldn't have the nice things they have now like living in their home here near their school and friends, nice toys on birthdays/Xmas, treats etc. It makes mummy sad sometimes that she has to go to work and can't do (whatever) but she has to go.

stopfuckingshoutingatme · 10/08/2017 10:34

Mummy and daddy split up because daddy is a very lazy man, and he also decided to sleep in the same bed as Mummy's friend (who Mummy isn't friends with any more)

Its a minefield, and op there is no right or wrong answer, or easy solution

also elder child is 10 which is that funny age when they pick up ALOT, and really hero worship their dads, and cant be spoken to like a baby!

WhooooAmI24601 · 10/08/2017 10:37

DS1's Dad and I split up when he was 5 months old. Ex had cheated throughout my pregnancy and continued once DS1 was born. I'd had enough and packed his bags for him.

DS1 is 11 now and a few years ago asked Ex why we split up. Ex made a joke along the lines of "Mummy had a bit of depression when you were born, went a bit mad and chucked me out". DS1 came trotting home, worried himself silly that it was his 'fault' we'd split up and then repeated it back to me in floods of tears because he was in the phase of "why can't you be together". The fact was, I probably was depressed; the person I loved was off out shagging other women and living the life of Riley while I was adapting to being a Mother. But the way it was worded meant Ex took no responsibility; a theme throughout his life.

At no point have I explained "your Dad was a cheating dickhead who fucked anything that moved". At no point will I ever say those words (or anything along those lines). Instead I rose above it and explained that Daddy and I weren't making one another very happy and we decided to split up and try to be happy without one another.

It's difficult not retaliating. It's difficult not defending yourself. But I genuinely believe that dumping previous grievances on children's shoulders can do untold damage. Ex will have to live with the fact that he lied to our son (a lie which even now our son still recalls). I also think that the fact that Ex needed to lie about the past means he's still ashamed of it. He'll have to live with that shame, too. My head is high.

justkeepswimmingg · 10/08/2017 10:47

I'm all about being honest with my DC. That's not to bash anyone else's parenting style at all, but I was lied to for the majority of my childhood and find it hard to trust people. I also lied a lot to my family, as I felt it was the only way. My DS is only 2, but when he asks a question I tell the truth. I want him to be able to speak to me about anything, and know that I will be honest with him.
Of course like others say it should be age appropriate, and not a straight out 'daddy slept with another woman'. If it's done right, there's no reason why it should cloud their view on yourself or their father, but will simple help them understand more. If they were not happy with your first explanation, that they made up their own version of events, they may be holding in other feelings that they didn't write down. I don't think YABU at all OP.

RidingWindhorses · 10/08/2017 11:12

I don't really know why some women choose to immolate themselves on a pyre of self-sacrifice of doubtful validity.

I don't think it helps the children.

No-one likes being lied to, everyone wants to understand what's going on around them.

Information has to be age-appropriate, but needs to not be bollocks.

RidingWindhorses · 10/08/2017 11:15

But I genuinely believe that dumping previous grievances on children's shoulders can do untold damage

Telling a child age-appropriate truth is a completely different issue to dumping grievances on them. The two are not related.

heliumrising · 10/08/2017 11:32

My DP were in this situation. Me and my siblings were told very little as were under 12 when DP split. The truth, or versions of the truth came out in dribs and drabs over the years, and led to all of us kids losing respect for DP for not explaining at the time why our lives were being overturned. I never fully trusted DM after that, much to her confusion. Confused

Your DC are of an age where they can understand the general facts of what has happened. You are not going to get a medal or any kudos for sacrificing the truth to protect them. If OH has cheated they have every right to know, and he has to bear the burden of what he did - its too late for crocodile tears now.

WhooooAmI24601 · 10/08/2017 11:35

Telling a child age-appropriate truth is a completely different issue to dumping grievances on them. The two are not related.

In an ideal world, you're right. But often they are related. When Ex told DS1 his version of why we'd split up, my first reaction was anger, along the lines of "who the fuck does he think he is to tell our child a bullshit version that leaves him coming out smelling of roses?" Had I immediately corrected DS1 and told him the actual - angry - truth there and then, I'd have dumped more shit on his shoulders for him to worry about. That wouldn't have helped him one bit.

People react in the heat of the moment in ways they perhaps shouldn't. So yes, dumping truths onto the shoulders of children unable to deal with it does happen. Often. And no good can come of it.

Even an honest account of a relationship ending is still too much for some children to process. It depends on their age, understanding and maturity levels. DS1 is 11 but absolutely wouldn't understand me telling him that his Dad had chosen to have sex with other women. No matter how nicely I padded it out it would still hurt him to have his eyes opened to who his Dad really is.

There's a world of difference between immolating yourself on a pyre of self-sacrifice (which is the most patronising shit I've seen on here in a long time) and protecting your children from something which, frankly, wouldn't add an ounce of happiness to their lives.

Justwaitingforaline · 10/08/2017 11:39

They don't need to know. They are too young to understand and actually, it's irrelevant.

I am in a similar position with DD's father. He treated me awfully and his family still don't know why I left him. But in front of her, we are a united front who's aim is to co parent her as well as we can. When we are in front of her, we get on and slap a smile on it because she doesn't need to know that daddy was shagging other people for 18 months and paying for chat sites.

Motherbear26 · 10/08/2017 11:52

Firstly op, I can't imagine how horrible it must have been for you to read what your ds had written. It's heartbreaking for you both that the poor kid thinks that. However I'm not sure that the truth will do the dc or you any favours.

Biting your tongue will be the most difficult thing you have to do, particularly given the unfairness of it all, but I promise that as the dc grow up and become adults, they will understand the situation clearly. They will remember which parent ranted about the other, made them feel guilty and never managed to hold down a job. They will also recall which parent worked hard to support them, loved them unconditionally and kept a dignified silence about the other parent, even when the other parent tried to turn the dc against her. These things always become apparent when the dc grow up and start to see the world in real terms, and they will love and respect you more for being the adult in this situation and putting them first. It won't be easy, but in the long run it will be worth it.

NotMyPenguin · 10/08/2017 11:52

There are plenty of things that they will realise for themselves as they get older (e.g. Daddy's attitude to presents, how he behaves with them, etc). You are right to think that there is no point in framing these things to your DC yourself; they will come to the realisation in their own good time.

I don't think you should feel you have to lie, or censor the truth, though. I would strongly advise you to stick to the absolutely factual truth and reserve any judgement -- he is after all their other parent. But I think it would be healthy to be able to tell the truth if it comes up in conversation. (e.g. "Daddy left because you work so much!", "Dearest, although I do enjoy my work and do quite a bit of it to make sure that we have a nice life as a family, Daddy left because he had stopped loving mummy and had begun to have feelings for somebody else.")

RidingWindhorses · 10/08/2017 12:19

No-one has said it doesn't happen, I just said the two things aren't related.

Everyone has said that the truth needs to be age-appropriate - but all you come up with is 'daddy had sex with another woman' which is clearly not. So it's a bit of a straw man.

It's not either angry grievance dumping, age-inappropriate information, or nothing. There is a third option.

You can't actually protect your children from the fallout of divorce and if they are given false information they will build theories and explanations to themselves based on things that are not true. When they find out the real truth they will feel betrayed. A poster above who experienced just that said she never trusted her mother because of it.

ItsNiceItsDifferentItsUnusual · 10/08/2017 13:08

I agree with age appropriate explanation. It's doing your dc no favours to believe ex's version, that basically you don't care enough. That's horrible. And as much as I would want to protect my children, I wouldn't be willing to take the fall for his shitty behaviour.

My Dad had an affair, I was told the truth. My mum totally fucked it up though and did it the spiteful way. Still pleased I know the truth though.

NotMyPenguin · 10/08/2017 13:24

My dad had affairs. I was told the truth, but in an age appropriate way. My mum was never horrible about him, though, just factual. I really think her approach is the reason that I have good relationships with her, my dad, and my step-mum now as a grown up.

TiredMumToTwo · 10/08/2017 13:28

To quote Michelle Obama, "They go low, we go high".

One of the things I am most proud of is I have never said anything derogatory about my ex to my son even in the face of my son telling me he preferred Daddy. There are many reasons why we split but the straw was my ex lied to me but the ins and outs of our relationship are nothing to do with my son.

A friend of mine constantly makes little sly digs about her ex to both her sons and it makes me cringe, I'm sure it makes them feel bad and she only does it to make herself feel better.

milliemolliemou · 10/08/2017 13:29

Leave the infidelity out of it. Just sit your older DC down and ask him how he's feeling. Don't push it any further.

You could say you're feeling sad too because DH couldn't get a job and you were very happy for him to do so. But because he can't get a job that pays much you're having to work extra hard to make sure everyone has a place to live and things to eat.

BTW have you chased him for income support? He's getting£700 pcm from his mother?

milliemolliemou · 10/08/2017 13:30

Leave the infidelity out of it. Just sit your older DC down and ask him how he's feeling. Don't push it any further.

You could say you're feeling sad too because DH couldn't get a job and you were very happy for him to do so. But because he can't get a job that pays much you're having to work extra hard to make sure everyone has a place to live and things to eat.

BTW have you chased him for income support? He's getting£700 pcm from his mother?

OhHolyJesus · 10/08/2017 14:13

I agree with PPs - a kid friendly version which explains why the split happened. I strongly believe in telling kids the truth, I think they deserve it and can make own their own minds. It doesn't need to be to ask them to take sides or make them feel bad about loving the bad party. He's still their dad.
The fact you work and provide for them will make them proud of you. As a SAHM with a DS I intend to show him how I made the sacrifice of my career to care for him in his early years and his Dad worked to pay for food and nice things. You were done wrong and have worked hard, you deserve the credit for that, whether your DS realised it now or not!
Another PP is right, you are raising men and it sounds like you're doing that mostly alone.
A tricky situation - good luck OP xx

theduchessstill · 10/08/2017 15:24

Well, I'm still very torn tbh.

I totally get that making derogatory comments about ex is a complete no-no, and despite what some may think, it would bring me nothing but sadness if it turned out my dc ended up with no real relationship with their dad . I don't, however, want him to be on a pedestal either - not healthy in any case, and certainly not deserved in this one.

Some people seem to assume there is no way to go about this other than by giving tmi about our sex lives or by spewing forth a lot of vitriol, and that was never my intention. What about a simple factual account along the lines of "Dad had another friend he got very close to and I know he didn't mean to hurt my feelings but it did and, sometimes, when people's feelings are hurt very much they can't be good friends, or husband and wife anymore ' etc etc I was thinking something like that, perhaps with some talk, if ds seems to be receptive, about how we were perhaps very different people with very different interests and that's maybe why in the end it didn't work out and dad found someone else for a while. Followed by emphasis on the fact that we both love him and ds2 more than anything and are both happy now etc etc? Would that be so awful?

My concern with not mentioning it at all is, as I have seen already, and as some pps have suggested, if the explanation is not convincing the dc fill in their own gaps and I may not even realise this is happening internally. I totally get what people are saying about dc blaming themselves and needing to see their parents as good people, but I feel like if I talk about my job and how it's needed for our well-being (I say that all the time anyway) and I had to do it because dad couldn't get a job etc, surely ds could see that as a criticism of his dad (it kind of is!) and as being his fault as we wouldn't need so much money if we didn't have dc? Also it sort of implies work is a necessary evil, which isn't really the message I want to give.

It seems whatever I say is potentially harmful and hurtful, so couldn't it at least be honest - as long as there's no vitriol?

OP posts:
Loopy567 · 10/08/2017 15:35

This is tough. Both my DC (11 and 9) know about the OW and have done for a while, but that is because they have read her text messages to STBXH when I asked him hundreds of times not to contact her whilst he was in the house or with the DC (he is still in the home whilst divorce is finalised). Obviously he has never stuck to this request. OW has a young(er) child than my DC (they started seeing each other when her DC was about 18 months old). As a child of divorced parents myself (my mum left for someone else) it was horrible but my dad never spoke to me about it. I know who it was (I knew who it was - I worked it out). I don't know whether I would have wanted my dad to talk to me (I doubt it) . I would imagine they may know more than they are letting on. Be strong and brave for them. They will know who cares for them, even if they don't show it or say.

Huskylover1 · 10/08/2017 16:03

Ah. This is so hard.

No though, you simply can't tell them about his cheating in a "nice" and "child friendly" way. It simply won't work. Because you'd be saying something negative about their Dad, who they love.

I think all you can say at this point, is :

"I appreciate that you would like Mummy to work less. I would like to work less too. But, we need to earn money for all the things that we need, like food, clothes, toys etc, and because Daddy doesn't have a job right now, Mummy is having to work extra hard to earn more money, to make sure we don't go without anything. I'm really hoping that Daddy will get a job soon, and then Mummy will be able to work less"

It's very, very frustrating, because you are the one working your arse off, you didn't cheat, and yet you feel that you're getting the blame somehow.

I still haven't told my kids the extent of their Dad's cheating (10 x OW), and they are aged 18 & 20. I know it would not be received well, because they love their Dad, so I just leave it well alone. They think he is a great Dad. And, on the surface he is. But, there are things that go on underneath that they can't see, for eg. him lying to the CSA about his income, in order to pay far less than he should. I think these things are slowly surfacing....they can see he is far wealthier than me, but treats them less...my day will come!

Sorry you are going through this.

I'd be tempted to take them to Florida or Port Aventura which he would never be able to afford

WhooooAmI24601 · 10/08/2017 16:16

I'm only responsible for what information I give to my DCs, and for me there is nothing to be gained from DS1 knowing that people cheat or have affairs. None.

As he gets older if he asked direct questions I wouldn't lie. I simply don't see anything to be gained from telling him that his Dad was capable of something so unkind. He adores his Dad. I wouldn't want to be the person to disillusion him.

HungerOfThePine · 10/08/2017 17:19

I think a child friendly explanation would be fine but I would also say let the children ask the questions so that you can tailer the answers and information that is going on in their heads and not freely giving them information that that they might not be ready for or able to process.

Most important of all is assuring them that they are your no1 priority in life and anything you do is for them.

RidingWindhorses · 10/08/2017 17:27

The children will find out in the long run and the less they know from the get go the more impact it will have.

A friend of mine wasted years in her childhood trying to figure out why her parents split and whether it was her fault. The truth came out eventually that her dad buggered off with the woman he eventually remarried. She spent so long blaming herself - it was such a waste of time.

Equally Husky - tbh - if I we're your kid and I found out the extent of what you hadn't told me, I would be furious with you. Children have the right to a good relationship with their father, but they also have the right to know who he truly is, and have a relationship that is based on reality. I hate being lied to, and I think that's quite a common sentiment. I see no excuse for withholding truth from adults.

Haffdonga · 10/08/2017 18:19

Your child friendly explanation is great. (Daddy wanted to spend a lot of time with a different person and not with me. That made me very sad and we couldn't stay together because we argued a lot about it.)

it's absolutely NOT damaging for dcs to learn this. However it is damaging for them to have some kind of warped opinion of you fed to them by their father that you were controlling and unreasonable and somehow kept him without a job at home.

For those posters saying the truth out their dad would be damaging for them to hear - why is it better for them to believe a destructive lie about you?