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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To think the 'information' the midwife gave me is almost propaganda?

999 replies

ethelfleda · 29/07/2017 21:14

Recently had 24 week appointment. This is our first. Midwife asked if I had thought about feeding yet. I said I plan on breastfeeding. I say 'plan' because (as with everything else baby related) I am trying to keep an open mind as from what I hear, things don't always go according to plan! So I will try hard to breastfeed but I won't beat myself up if it doesn't work out for us.
She handed me a 20 odd page pamphlet thing and said it contained useful information on caring for a new born.

I started to read it today thinking it would be basic NHS info on how to feed, wind and change your baby etc. It was actually 20 odd pages of info telling me basically that if i don't breastfeed, my baby is more likely to develop cancer (as am I) as well as be admitted to hospital in their first year of life etc etc among other very scary statistics.
The language used was shocking IMO! And seemingly designed to make women who don't/can't breastfeed feel awful! Has anyone else had this information handed to them and thought it was way over the top??

OP posts:
batteriesgone · 30/07/2017 09:32

"No amount of support would ever have made it possible for me to BF. And to compare what I went through to seeing skinny models as a size 14 person is just belittling."

You seem to have had a horrendous experience, which is still haunting you. As I emphasised in my post, you did what you could and had to make tough choices. It sounds to me like you could benefit from talking to someone with more experience about your disappointing experience to move past it and feel you can accept what happened.

No birth or bf experience is perfect we all have our battles and challenges. I personally feel ff marketing is much more full on in terms of suggesting a happy serene perfect experience. The NHS not so.

HollyHollyHo · 30/07/2017 09:33

You sound like an idiot just looking for something to piss you off.

Not sure you can be annoyed that facts are true things Hmm

BertrandRussell · 30/07/2017 09:33

"How is any amount of support to me going to change that?"

It isn't. Of course.

But your situation is very, very unusual.

Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed · 30/07/2017 09:34

Batteries. I had no choice. None. I didn't make a choice. I had no choice.

It isn't a choice for some people. Can you understand what I am trying to say?

Ktown · 30/07/2017 09:34

Propaganda is the wrong word as this means lies.
Everyone knows about improved immunity and various positives from breastfeeding. However not everyone can do it.
There are a significant number of people (I think) who are just embarrassed, perhaps because breasts have been sexualised for so long. Either way, it is linked with good health outcomes at a population level so it needs to be encouraged.

Sparklingbrook · 30/07/2017 09:34

Where is all the FF marketing? Admittedly I have teenagers now and I don't watch much TV. Is it in the baby magazines?

Tabymoomoo · 30/07/2017 09:35

Definitely more understanding from HCPs would be great!

Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed · 30/07/2017 09:36

That is true Bertrand - but I'm not the only mother who never had a choice and the way the literature is worded was and is spectacularly unhelpful to people like me.

For some people it isn't and never will be a choice - not because of them or anything they did or did not do - but because of the baby.

And to say Breast is Best or Bf is the healthiest option without a disclaimer of "not always" is part of what contributed to my massive PND.

Writerwannabe83 · 30/07/2017 09:38

Where is all the FF marketing?

You won't see it now as it's been banned. Follow-on formulas can be advertised but it can not be advertised as a method of feeding babies younger than that.

ohlittlepea · 30/07/2017 09:40

Its evidence based information...to help you make an informed choice...it is nothing compared to the constant barage of formula advertising women are subjected to...

batteriesgone · 30/07/2017 09:41

Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed Yes that's tough but that sort of thing is thankfully rare. More support would have enabled you to recognise what was happening sooner and feel empowered to feed your dc with the correct formula as well as doing certain things such as skin to skin to enable closeness. Skin to skin is really great not just for bf but als ff because it releases a whole range of amazing happy hormones for baby and mother. There could have been support to teach who to feed responsively rather than by schedule an a whole load of other things.

You cannot however realistically expect the NHS to change their communication approach based on your individual experience with a child that wasn't able to feed breast milk or off the shelf formula.

ohlittlepea · 30/07/2017 09:42

The ff marketing is for all the follow up and number 2 milks whcih are a completely unnecessary product that formula companies invented due to the ban on advertising first milks

Tabymoomoo · 30/07/2017 09:43

I'm interested to know - all those who are claiming these leaflets are propaganda or do not approve of the breast is best campaign - a question:

How does an organisation like the NHS (massively cash strapped) go about trying to get more mums breastfeeding (as a whole population it being the proven healthier option - although clearly not always on an individual basis).

I'm not saying I think the NHS is currently doing the best thing but I really can't answer this question - I'm not sure there is a perfect way 

limon · 30/07/2017 09:44

No. The benefits of breast feeding are undoubted.informing people avout them is not propoganda. Such a small minority of people breast feed and it would be the default if it had not been for all the propaganda spread by the formula companies.

Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed · 30/07/2017 09:44

Batteries. Quite simply you are wrong. The condition was diagnosed as early as is possible

I know it's rare. And telling me I should have done skin to skin comes across as patronising.

I was doing the best for my baby. Don't you think I did everything I could? I will absolutely guarantee I know more about their condition than you do.

And I still maintain, yes, I get that in general BF is. Best, but the publications should have a line in them to say something to the effect of "but not always".

Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed · 30/07/2017 09:47

Even here I've said clearly my child could not BF.

Why not just take my word for it? Why tell me I should've done skin to skin or got more support or tried to get condition diagnosed earlier?

Why not just trust what I'm saying that BF wasn't best for my particular baby?

Writerwannabe83 · 30/07/2017 09:51

And I still maintain, yes, I get that in general BF is. Best, but the publications should have a line in them to say something to the effect of "but not always".

I completely agree.

I'm very pro breast feeding but in my line of work I see many babies for whom breast milk isn't best and I am exposed to a lot of mothers guilt and tears and it's really upsetting to see.

I think the NHS should put across the message that in optimal circumstances breast milk is best, list the reasons why, but then also include the fact that for a lot of reasons some babies may not be able to have breast milk or breast feed and that in those circumstances formula is a perfectly fine way for the baby to be fed.

BettyOBarley · 30/07/2017 09:52

I think it's important to have all the information on breastfeeding out there as obviously breast is best etc, but I did find it ridiculous at the antenatal classes that the midwives weren't even allowed to discuss or advise on formula feeding even if asked a direct question (I was planning to breastfeed anyway at that point but it didn't work out with both DC).

However once both babies were born I found that the encouragement / support for breastfeeding was there if you needed it but no one made me feel bad or guilty when I couldn't carry on.

MorrisZapp · 30/07/2017 09:52

I hate these threads. I know breastfeeding is great but I didn't give it up at 12 weeks because of formula advertising, I gave it up because I utterly fucking loathed doing it and my mental health was suffering.

I'm educated, supported and have access to great health care. But I still loathed breast feeding. I feel that if breast feeding hadn't been the default amongst my peer group, I could have switched to formula earlier and maybe suffered less.

Facts are facts, but it's the wider culture of treating formula like poison that led to many of my problems. I'm sick of hearing the word 'support' as if support makes it all ok. For me, it didn't.

batteriesgone · 30/07/2017 09:54

Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed

Here, loads of NHS information about ff.

www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/Could-my-child-be-intolerant-to-cows-milk.aspx

www.nhs.uk/Conditions/pregnancy-and-baby/pages/bottle-feeding-advice.aspx

www.nhs.uk/Conditions/pregnancy-and-baby/Pages/making-up-infant-formula.aspx

www.nhsinform.scot/healthy-living/pregnancy-and-baby/your-newborn/bottle-feeding

www.nhs.uk/conditions/pregnancy-and-baby/pages/combining-breast-and-bottle.aspx

A quick google would have shown this information.

The NHS can hardly be accused of encouraging mothers to bf as bf is beneficial for babies' growth and development. It's a fact. Should the NHS stop promoting exercise because a few individuals suffer a cardiac arrest when they run? I'll stop engaging with you Mychildcouldnotbreaatfeed as I feel you are wilfully misinterpreting my posts, which isn't conducive to a discussion.

IAdoreEfteling · 30/07/2017 09:57

It's not just feeding it's birth as well... Going for the natural way etc.

batteriesgone · 30/07/2017 09:57

"Why tell me I should've done skin to skin or got more support or tried to get condition diagnosed earlier?"

It's advised to give skin to skin a go even if you ar ff because it's nice and helps mums and babies, not with the intention bf but to ff and experience closeness etc. But as I said you have your views and I have mine i leave it there.

IAdoreEfteling · 30/07/2017 09:57

It's not just feeding it's birth as well... Going for the natural way etc.

NotMyPenguin · 30/07/2017 09:59

Propaganda is information that is biased or misleading. This isn't, I'm afraid -- it's true. A shockingly low percentage of women in the UK breastfeed and I'm glad that this is being addressed.

My sympathies for those who can't breastfeed.

HeteronormativeHaybales · 30/07/2017 09:59

'Breast is not always best' would not help. It would set bf support and education back years. I think (I know some PPs have made this point better than I am probably going to) a lot of people are not aware of just how hard things can be made for bf mothers, particularly when things are not or seem to be not going smoothly. I had small, light children, all perfectly healthy, just not necessarily obeying centiles in the correct manner. The amount of suspicion heaped on my (perfectly fine) bf relationships with my dc and (perfectly good) milk made me feel, at times, like a pretty shit mother too, tbh. And then the notion that our sleep issues could be solved literally overnight if I would stop being so silly and 'finally' get that baby off the breast, after all it's 'had enough' now. Mothers who have started down the road of bf and are committed to seeing it out in natural term get a pretty rough ride sometimes.

I struggled for a month with dc1 through expressing, breast refusal and topping up after a difficult birth, PPH, jaundice and enforced test weighing in a backward hospital. I got so much stick for making things difficult for myself by wanting to establish bf. I was accused of failing to 'relax', which would 'damage' my baby. We finally got bf established, came off formula by 5 weeks and went on to bf for four and a half years. But if I hadn't been so bloody-minded, we wouldn't have, and my two subsequent dc might have been FF too.

'Breastfeeding is the best option for you and your baby, all other things being equal' would work. It would cover cases where essential strong medication precludes bf, or situations like yours, mychildcouldnotbreastfeed.