AIBU to ask Wtf Is 'Child Led'?

[JustDanceAddict]

Seeing this a lot lately - what does it actually entail.
If my DCs didn't want to get up for school cos they're tired, is it child-led to keep them off school?
Mine know unless they are illthey are going in, as I have to go to work when tired, etc.

I will listen to my kids' reasons to do x,y or z but if I don't agree they will not be doing it.

I have let DD (15) off a couple of optional things and have regretted it as in the end it wasn't right in the circumstances that she didn't attend.

Surely it's all about compromise, but some things: school, family events, etc. are non-negotiable (barring mental health issues around school before I get flamed).

I see it used as a phrase for floppy hippy mums who's little Tarquin really needs a kick but they call him spirited and they prefer a 'child led' house expanding in this they eat kale wraps with hummus and rice cakes, never watch tv save their pee to put on the compost and use washable sanitary towels..... just off to take my tablet xx

Scaredycat said
Shit Red, I can't listen to my dc and respect them because they go to school? Really?

Well, of course you can. But if you want to use child led parenting and your DC want to go to school at 11 and won't listen to your careful explanation as to why this isn't appropriate, then sending them to school is clearly not going to work.
Equally if your DC wants to do maths at a given time, but the teacher has decided that the whole class is doing phonics, then,unless you are home educating it's highly unlikely that the teacher will allow your DC to do maths.

(My child led parenting friend went through genuine anguishes when her DC started school as having to follow strict structures went totally against her principles - for a while after her DC started they used to wander into class at whatever time, take them out of school when they felt like it, and encourage the DC not to bother with homework unless they wanted to do it- so they never for example read at home as DC didn't want to. Unsurprisingly this didn't really work. If my friend had been in a position to home ed,they most definitely would have done.)

My DS' Reception class took photos of a day spent exploring water - where it runs and why, how it can power toys/waterwheels, floating sinking etc. It was tipping it down, a few children asked some questions, and the staff set up a whole exploratory environment in the playground for them. That's child led.
And it's also why those "unschoolers" who say they are the only people who can possibly do child led education are just plain wrong. It's not just possible in mainstream education but it's better in some ways - as the children not only have each other to bounce things off, but have qualified and experienced staff and a whole load of equipment that you don't have at home, so they can explore what the children want to find out in a really sophisticated way right there and then.

As a Guider I also do girl-led Guiding. Given our limitations of time and equipment, this is more along the lines of "here are some options for this term, you also tell me what else you'd like to do and we'll try and put together a programme that suits everyone [but also stretches the girls]".

I do child led bedtimes. We have a bedtime routine, and from a time set by me she is quiet, in her bedroom, no screens, and dimmed light.

She can read, listen to quiet music, do her doll's 'bedtime routine'... when she's sleepy she gets into bed and goes to sleep. She always wakes up easily in the morning and has more than enough energy during the day.

I think the lack of anything to 'push' against means she listens to her body and there's no excitement about staying up late because it's not forbidden. If she was tired the next day I'd have to try a different technique.

It's about giving age appropriate choices isn't it?

(And no, not everything can be child led. Brushing teeth, taking medicine, being strapped in the car and not hurting other people are all non-negotiable, among other things. And some things cannot be child led some of the time - if it was their end of year assembly I don't think the Reception teachers would have switched the curriculum for the day).

It's always been used in an educational context for me having worked in nursery for 20 years.

It stems from our observations of the children. Eg, was doing group time one day about something and a child said " Mrs Groovee, why do we never have broccoli for snack?" Nothing to do with the topic we were doing. Told 2 members off staff and within half an hour the school kitchen had provided us with broccoli. That was a fast one for us 😂

Other times they could be playing with the playdough with leads to a baking activity or they may have been to deep sea world and we put the sea animals in the water tray or a child may have been measured which leads on to us talking about measurements in various ways.

Red, you seem very confused. What you are describing is shit parenting. It's an extreme example. But just continue to ignore the facts you don't like.

Ha ha! I posted about "baby led living" on here as a joke a few years ago!

Now I see it's a real thing!

'Because I said so' was my dads mantra and I'm not sure I've ever said it, but children aren't always right and also have to listen to the more experienced adult. As I said, I have allowed my teen to opt out of a couple of invites and actually it ended up looking bad on her: 'where's X' etc.
I truly have never heard 'child led' IRL in a parenting context.

I think when people describe their parenting as child led though it's more all encompassing.

Hmm, surely child-led parenting is somewhat of a paradox? I'm kinda in the 'parenting should be parent-led' camp. Children lack the experience to input into the parenting process. That's your job, guys. I opted out. Sorry: sounded too much responsibility for too little pay

I'm genuinely intrigued now how one manages to keep things in check. How does one ensure listening to their bodies 're bed time and having no novelty at staying up etc remain as peaceful as it sounds and not be like those ones who end up on supernanny running riot all night sleeping outside doors and refusing to get dressed or leave the house on time etc

Girty999
I think you'll find those "floppy hippy mums" who eat kale etc are not truly child-led because they don't allow TV/screens etc.

Yes, even within the child-led world, there are bitter rivalries of who is right, lol

Red - of course you can't wander in and out of class etc. Would you wander in and out of your job as the whim takes you? No. You'd get the sack in 5 mins.
There are schools that cater for less conventional parenting styles, but I'm sure they all have structure of some sort, otherwise anarchy!

Stevie - parenting - it's in the name! Kids can have some say, of course, but within boundaries.

There are balances aren't there? My upbringing was mother adult led. She chose my clothes, my hair style, the colour of my room, my bedtime, diet (being forced to eat food I loathed), my toys and my interests. She also chose my schools and tried to dictate when I'd be leaving school and what I'd be doing as a career. She also chose my school subjects. Much of this was based on outdated gender roles. I hear about some child-led families that I think are ridiculous. But I also think that to some degree children should have a significant say in things that affect them and should be able to decide thing slike what they want to wear, etc. (withing reason) and for Goddess' sake if they fecking barf at liver don't make them eat it.

OFFS I listen to my dc, they get an input, I respect their right to have an opinion. Depending on the situation their opinions may or may not affect the outcome. But they understand and respect when I say no and comply because they know they get a fair shot at getting there way if practical. We have mutual respect. I don't want to go back to the seen and not heard days. Learning why and how too comply with social norms is part of preparing them for life. Blindly following orders leads to it's own problems, now bend over nicely for Uncle Bob, this won't hurt........

To me it means letting DD choose what she fancies doing in terms of play, giving her appropriate choices and doing things at her own pace. But I do think some people interpret it in more of a letting their children do what the heck they like at all times, whereas I have firm boundaries and no issues with the word "no"!!

scaredy - what facts that I don't like am I ignoring? Most child-led parents don't like a formal school structure, because they feel it is forcing their child into a routine that they may not have chosen. Some compromise their principles and send their DC to school anyway - others choose to home ed, so their DC can set the pace of lessons.
The word "no" is not used as the child is encouraged to come to their own choices (with guidance from the parent, but not in the way that a child is "forced" to make a choice).

I'm totally anti fully child led parenting by the way, and I don't think such lack of structure does the child any favours ... I'm simply telling you my experiences of a friend who was almost militant about following it!

To me it means letting DD choose what she fancies doing in terms of play

This is pretty much it!

It's like so many people have to take things to extreme - child lednlearning has led some parents to child led parenting when it was only ever a way of 'learning'

We are learning about plants and growth -
We are going to plant seeds - what shall we plant? (Always green beans!!) but the choice was there...

windy yes we are home educating (for now). I don't think you can mix a strongly child led home life with school tbh. If you have to be up and functioning at a certain time because of school then you need to get that done!

I think its also hard on children to understand that they will have very different experiences at school than at home.

DD couldn't even cope with it being 'eat if you are hungry, stop when you aren't' at home and 'sit there until you've eaten your lunch' at nursery.

op The comparison to the world of work is bogus. The majority of jobs are not as authoritarian in their mode of operation as a primary school is. Most (though not all I will concede) people get to choose what to wear to work, choose when to go to the toilet, choose what aspect of what they need to get done they will work on next. Some are fantastically more permissive and unstructured, in my job I certainly can wander off every 5 mins if I so choose.

So the whole idea of school 'training' people for the work environment really only applies to some very specific jobs that are highly repetitive, involve uniforms and almost no agency on the part of the employee. These are actually the kind of jobs most likely to become unavailable in the near future due to people being replaced by computers/robots....so not actually the kind of jobs we should be training our children to do!

In terms of play, I get the child led stuff and can get on board with it.

If my DC led in all areas of their life, they'd live off chocolate, go to bed at midnight and never brush their teeth! So I do feel that for most things I know best.

For example, I signed my ds up to an activity. I knew he'd love it. He whinged about going...I completely understood because starting something new is scary and daunting. I told him if he went once and didn't like it, he wouldn't have to go again. In the end, he went, he loved it, he's been participating for a couple of years now and has made friends. If it had been up to him, he probably wouldn't have gone that first time. If he had attended and hated it, I wouldn't have insisted he go again. It's all a balance really.

DD couldn't even cope with it being 'eat if you are hungry, stop when you aren't' at home and 'sit there until you've eaten your lunch' at nursery.

But that's not a difference in how school and home must operate, that's just rubbish management around meal times at nursery, and lack of teaching consideration for others at home. Children shouldn't be forced to finish a meal if they are full but they also need to learn that if you're eating with others, it's polite to wait for them to finish. Other children, and adults, that you are eating with feel rushed if you dash off from the table when you, personally, don't feel like eating more.

Thanks for the astute analysis there....

Actually stop eating =/= leave the table and start dancing....but whatever.

Children shouldn't be forced to finish a meal if they are full

Yes but I've lost count of the number of times my DC tell me they're full up, then two minutes later, "mum, can I have pudding?!"