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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Sean's gone. It's sad. Great guy. Going to miss him.Trump continued

971 replies

orlantina · 22/07/2017 22:26

New thread

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2977693-The-thread-where-we-meet-to-discuss-the-unfolding-Trump-administration-catastrophe-but-end-up-discussing-adoptions-from-Russia?msgid=70627530

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34
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 14:25
Grin

He can try to gaslight us but it won't succeed (he may get others though)

The mooch is going places

thehill.com/homenews/administration/343406-scaramucci-a-candidate-to-replace-priebus-as-chief-of-staff-report?amp

cozietoesie · 24/07/2017 14:39

Oh Dear. That will cause ripples. Wink

Roussette · 24/07/2017 15:03

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account
@realDonaldTrump
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Sleazy Adam Schiff, the totally biased Congressman looking into "Russia," spends all of his time on television pushing the Dem loss excuse!

How can everything have sunk so low?? A President tweeting about a serving Congressman like this? And who is he to criticise anyone for watching TV when it's where he gets his intel and what he does all the time.

Obviously Schiff is onto something and Trump is rattled.

Is this sort of tweet our new normal?

illegitimateMortificadospawn · 24/07/2017 15:04

Osborne is clearly having a lot of fun at other people's expense at the Standard, including our elected officials.

cozietoesie · 24/07/2017 15:05

Street brawling tactics, Roussette.

Gumpendorf · 24/07/2017 15:34

@JoeNBC. Our president sounds beleaguered and frightened this morning. You can sense his fear in every terrified tweet. Justice must be closing in.
twitter.com/JoeNBC/status/889476183016001536

Is it this? https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2017/07/24/jared-kushner-just-threw-donald-trump-jr-under-the-bus-bigly/?tid=smtw&utmm_term=.1b25d5b09187

Roussette · 24/07/2017 15:52

Schiff has responded

“With respect Mr. President, the problem is how often you watch TV, and that your comments and actions are beneath the dignity of the office.”

ElenaGreco123 · 24/07/2017 16:00

What does it say in the Wapo article, Gumpendorf? It is behind paywall.

Gumpendorf · 24/07/2017 16:10

Elena Its quite a long piece that repeats Kusher's statement which I have omitted from this. Basically, he's not denying the Trump Jnr meeting but detaching himself from any knowing involvement.

THE MORNING PLUM:*
Presidential son-in-law Jared Kushner is set to testifyy before the Senate Intelligence Committee this morning, and what is striking about his extensive opening statementt* is the degree to which it seeks to insulate Kushner himself from any culpability or responsibility for the problematic known* facts about the Russia affair — particularly the known facts that concern Donald Trump Jr.
Kushner’s statement takes exceptional care to separate him, with scalpel-like precision, from the now-notorious meeting that Trump Jr. arranged with a Russian lawyer — a meeting that Trump Jr. had been informed would furnish the Trump campaign with information about Hillary Clinton supplied by the Russian government.

....
*
It’s not entirely clear that the “long back and forth” that Kushner claims he “did not read at the time” is the email chainn** that Trump Jr. released, under duress, which demonstrated that the meeting was taken with the express purpose of getting information advertised as coming from the Russian government. But it seems clear that this is what he is referring to. Note that Kushner does not say one way or the other whether he had been sent this email chain before. What we do know, however, is that Kushner says he never read it. And if Kushner is to be believed, he agreed to, and showed up at, this meeting without having any idea why it was being held.
*
This, even though Trump Jr. was quite excited about what this meeting might yield (“I love it,” Trump Jr. exulted in the email chainn**), and even though Trump’s then-campaign chair Paul Manafort was also present. This was a meeting attended by Trump’s top brain trust, on the expectation that it would yield greatly damaging information about Trump’s opponent, just as the campaign was shifting into general election mode — but Kushner was unaware of its purpose.
Also note the exceptional care that went into Kushner’s characterization of the meeting. He claims he arrived just late enough to miss the incriminating part of the meeting. Trump Jr. admitted in his second statementt that the Russian lawyer brought up the campaign (after an initial statementt* claiming the meeting was just about Russian adoptions):
*
Kushner’s statement does not deny outrighteither that the meeting did address the campaign or that any documents had been offered to the Trump camp, which the email chainn appears to confirm. All it does is insulate Kushner from those facts.

It is certainly possible that Kushner’s account is accurate. But these things are now investigable: Efforts can be made to determine whether Kushner had been told of, or discussed, the purpose of the meeting beforehand, and to determine whether he arrived just late enough to miss the part of the meeting that concerned the campaign.

But whatever the truth turns out to be on those fronts, what Kushner’s statement does not do is contest any of the known facts about that meeting — known facts that are deeply problematic for Trump Jr. and even for Trump himself. The meeting, at a minimum, shows that Trump Jr. was eager to collude with the Russian government, which, he had been told, was trying to get his father elected president. Kushner’s statement denies any collusion on his own part, and claims no awareness* of any other collusion:
.....

Of course, what Trump Jr.’s email chainn showed is that the campaign jumped at the chance to collude, even if it ended up not happening at that meeting. Recall that Trump Jr.’s original statementt* covered up the real reason for the meeting, and that President Trump himself reportedly signed off on that initial false statementt*, which means the president actively participated in an effort to mislead the country about his own campaign’s eagerness to collude with Russia to help him win. Kushner’s statement offers nothing to challenge these underlying facts. It just separates him from them.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 16:14

He certainly has taken care to exonerate himself and pin it all on don jr.

Remember how scaramucci said an anonymous source told him that if Russia had tried to interfere in the elections, nobody would've known about it? (I hope so cos it was only yesterday). And remember after with very little prompting, he confessed the anonymous source was trump? Well guess which reputable source trump got that information

thehill.com/homenews/administration/343414-putin-told-trump-that-russian-hackers-were-too-good-to-get-caught

Gumpendorf · 24/07/2017 16:18

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2017/07/24/kushners-damning-account-at-the-very-least-hes-in-over-his-head/?tid=sstw&utmm_term=.c9e90c6a7399

I'm not sure everyone is convinced:

The danger for Kushner — aside from embarrassment — is that he could be contradicted by one or more witnesses or by electronic surveillance. As for failure to complete his security form accurately, one former intelligence operative says, “Perhaps one time [he makes an error or omission] but multiple times is also ludicrous. The form states at the bottom … you swear all of the above information is true.” He adds, “I’m sure he gets some leeway but I feel that by the time the executive assistant is pulled in to testify we will get an entirely different story.”

If not evidence of malicious deception, the story reveals a young man who is in over his head and out of his depth to such a degree that he does not know he is in over his head and out of his depth. The thought of summoning people who actually knew what was going on, checking with the administration as to the background of people with whom he was communicating or showing healthy skepticism about the people who were approaching him never occurred to him? Possible, but what a damning alibi.

So, he's either a liar or a fool Wink

Gumpendorf · 24/07/2017 16:26

My, there's lots of distraction happening today

Jason Chaffetz thinks Congress should be interviewing Chelsea Clinton over Benghazi not Jared.

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/07/jason-chaffetz-why-is-congress-questioning-jared-kushner-and-not-chelsea-clinton-for-benghazi/

"So every time a Democrat says ‘I gotta talk to Donald Trump Jr.,’ then go up and bring Chelsea Clinton in there,” Chaffetz continued, “because she was involved in the Benghazizi*^ situation, she was involved with the (Clinton) Foundation.”^^
He didn’t detail what possible crimes Chelsea Clinton may have committed, but Chaffetz said it was ridiculous that congressional investigators wanted to speak with Kushner about the foreign contacts and loans he failed to disclose on his security clearance forms.

PerkingFaintly · 24/07/2017 16:50

the story reveals a young man who is in over his head and out of his depth to such a degree that he does not know he is in over his head and out of his depth.

This is exactly how it struck me.

The long delay in submitting the corrected form leaves me thinking it may have been malicious and that he's happy to lie when caught.

But even if most of his statement is true, Jared comes across as profoundly naive. Easy meat for the Russians - or any other pro.

And they all seem to think that then claiming they're too inexperienced to know what they're doing MAKES IT OK! Erm, no...

Roussette · 24/07/2017 16:54

Jared blames his 'Assistant'. He said he added some bits to his Security form and said 'that's it' and she took it for meaning 'submit it' as opposed to that bit of the form is OK. I really dont think he could be so useless and slapdash as this and when he obviously has ties to Russia, I'm sure he would've gone over that form again and again. But let's blame his 'Assistant'.

Is it just me or does Jared come across as a wet lettuce. Looks it and acts it.

Gumpendorf · 24/07/2017 17:03

Is it just me or does Jared come across as a wet lettuce. Looks it and acts it.

But, but, but.... he's responsible for securing Middle East peace and government transformation! GrinGrin

orlantina · 24/07/2017 17:07

It's depressing how some opinion on Fox becomes the 'truth' by Trump

thinkprogress.org/fox-friends-is-not-sorry-about-false-attack-on-new-york-times-that-inspired-trump-tweet-24303a801442

NY Times asks Fox to apologise

www.theguardian.com/media/2017/jul/24/new-york-times-fox-news-apology

Not the first time that Fox has got it wrong and Trump has tweeted about it.

www.newsweek.com/fox-friends-corrects-story-trump-tweeted-claiming-comey-leaked-classified-634916

Fake news indeed.

OP posts:
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 17:40

That does hold up to even the mildest scrutiny roussette because once the form is submitted, someone from the FBI pays you a visit to go line by line through the form and make sure it's all correct. Hmm

SetPhasersTaeMalkie · 24/07/2017 17:41

Jared Kushner is just about to make an on camera statement. BBC is hopefully going to show it live. More self justification and wide eyed innocence?

He is certainly skilled at being plausible if his written statement is anything to go by.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 17:46

*doesnt hold up to even the mildest scrutiny

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 17:53

Julie Davis
Julie Davis @juliehdavis
Asked by pool if AG Sessions should resign & re health care, Trump tells WH interns of press, “They’re not supposed to do that...Be quiet."

Roussette · 24/07/2017 17:55

Agree Pain. Apart from an FBI visit I'd be scrutinising my form big time but there again he has something to hide doesn't he!

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 17:57

I believe so!

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 17:59

GOP just gopping along this evening

Judd Legum
Judd Legum @JuddLegum

  1. A GOP Congressman blames his party's health care struggles on ‘repugnant’ Republican ‘female senators’ t.co/10VjcRaTUK?amp=1
  1. If these 'repugnant' Senators were not women, he adds, he would challenge them to an "Aaron Burr-style" duel
  1. But alas, since they are women, he will just trash them on the radio.
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 24/07/2017 18:02

Scaramucci is quickly embracing trumpian ways

shareblue.com/new-white-house-communications-director-gives-first-interview-to-white-supremacist-site/