To be at my wits end about our financial situation and not have a clue what to do?

[Endofmytethernow]

I'm feeling so low and worried about our situation so please be kind with replies.

Basically DH is the main earner, is self employed and for an amount of time a few months ago he did a huge amount of work for one company. He invoiced the company once he'd finished the work, the amount was in excess of £15k, and as yet they haven't paid him. He has chased the money multiple times but has had a varying response from the company ranging from 'Well, you should have savings to cover you for times when you're waiting for money' to telling him that he's been in the privileged position of doing a huge job for them and he should be appreciative of that and be willing to wait. He, understandably, doesn't want to piss them off as they have said there will be a lot more work in the future, and he doesn't want to burn bridges, so isn't willing to do much other than wait for the money and politely remind them from time to time.

The problem is, since this large job DH's industry has gone pretty quiet and he has only had tiny dribs and drabs of work since. He was banking on this money to keep him going for a few months. He has not paid himself a wage now for 4 months; we are at our overdraft limit now, have used up all of our savings, and to be quite honest are fucked!

I have my own small business which I have been building up during this time and to be fair I'm earning ok from it, and am earning enough to buy food, essentials, etc, but nowhere near the level DH earns! Also everything in the house and with the DCs is left to me so it's a real juggling act building it up whilst doing everything else.

It's getting me down so much and today I feel like I've hit a brick wall in terms of it all. We are talking of putting our house on the market and moving somewhere smaller as we have a good amount of equity, however DH decided the other day we needed a new kitchen floor and put a latex leveller on the floor, fucked it up and now it looks awful and we can't put the flooring down, so there is no way it can go on the market until it's done!

I am on long term antidepressants on a very low dose, which my GP refuses to increase. DH is in a constant bad mood because he's owed the money. The kids, especially our 13 year old, play up constantly. We're not entitled to any tax credits due to DH's income over the past year. We are screwed!

What the fuck can I do? I just want to curl up into a ball and go to sleep until it's all sorted.

I work in the arts- both as freelance sometimes and as processor of freelance invoices. Any company that can't pay promptly is not one you should be doing business with...

@nosquirrels so do I. I agree. I also think that not every self employed person is brilliant at credit control (although I would argue you learn, delegate or don't stay self employed that long). It's only really in the last few years that my boyfriend's been confident turning down work, which is what you have to do sometimes if you won't work with late payers.

It sounds like you are already doing everything that you can do OP and its up to your DH to bring more cash in.

Fk that attitude. He's just done work worth £15,000 and some twat's refusing to pay him - and HE'S the one who should be bringing more cash in? Christ. As an aside why do people have work done if they can't afford to pay for the finished product or are reluctant to hand over the cash? You wouldn't do that in a shop - walk out with some goods and tell them you'll pay later. So why is it acceptable if someone's self employed? You can't afford, you can't buy it/get it done. Simple.

"Someone else has said it, but are you SURE there isn't more to it? That they aren't refusing to pay on other grounds e.g. Non delivery of services etc?"

I know someone who used to be fairly high-up in one of the bigname highstreet kitchen/bathroom places - they said the company attitude was to almost take pride in seeing how long they could delay paying so that they got the interest and sometimes the small companies went bust and they never paid at all.

I'm really sorry OP, it sounds very tough.

Re this company: They will not pay unless they have to and (let's be honest), there's no relationship to save. 1) Letter to them setting out factually what services were rendered, when, and for what price. Better still if DH had payment terms on there. Request full payment in 7 days. 2) "Letter Before Action" - go to the CAB if you can, if not use a template online. Again, setting out facts in full. 3) Court claim.

More generally - can he pick up other paid work, of whatever kind, to tide you over?

If you look online tax credits do something where if you make a loss from one partner you then take that off the other's earnings, then this is the figure for tax credits. Or it can come off the next year's total. maybe that would be helpful. I'll try and find the section for you.

Have a look here, the example is helpful for what to do if a couple.

revenuebenefits.org.uk/tax-credits/guidance/how-do-tax-credits-work/what-is-income/income-from-self-employment-or-trading-income/

See the example where "Bill" made a loss of 15K one year,

2015/16
Bill (15,000) loss
Emily 10,000 earnings
NIL income

So in that situation the tax credits that year were calculated on a nil income. Which would mean a higher award.

Your dh needs to send an overdue reminder then a legal letter.
If he's uncomfortable chasing payment then perhaps he's not cut out to be self employed. He has to do this and get the money, no other option

Don't hold out for more work that he won't get paid for either. Get a solicitors letter off quick.

Definetly chase the money owed. But equally you need to be prepared to write it off. And I wouldn't hold out for any more work for them either.

What industry is he in? We are in the construction industry and it's bloody awful when you aren't paid. But he needs to have a zero tolerance on bad payers.

I would send a letter stating payment in full within 7 days. Then if it remains unpaid seek legal advice. He also needs to get on the phone and ask for it to be paid immediately. He needs to be firm and polite but not accept any bullshit. I do the chasing of outstanding invoices and have found that those who shout loudest get paid quickest. You don't have to be rude or aggressive, just pin them down and then be prepared to chase again.

And if his contact starts saying shit like he is privileged etc he needs to close that down. 'It's not really a privilege to not be paid for work is it?'. 'I am sorry you feel that way, however as it stands I wouldn't be looking at further contracts with your company due to problems with your accounts not being settled'. 'This account is x months overdue, it needs paying in full. When is this going to happen?'.

If he can't do phone calls like that (my dp can't either) then maybe it's worth asking a friend to do it posing as his accountant. Or you do it. 'Hi it's Mrs EndofmyT. Am just doing Mr Endofmyts books and we have an invoice dated on x date that is x months overdue. When will this be paid?'.

Phonecalls are always more effective than letters imo. And always follow tje phone call up with an email confirming what has been agreed.

I don't know why people are finding this so difficult to believe, or implying there must be more to it.

My husband works in IT/new media, and used to be freelance. It is standard for companies to pay months late - he used to hear MDs laughing about it. There were no cash flow problems in the company, they just enjoyed being dicks.

He mostly worked for a small group of agencies that did pay quickly, he cultivated relationships with their accounts depts, and he invoiced fortnightly (usual contract was six months). It was still an almighty pain to get paid each month.

Yes, it is the case when self employed. DH was talking to his dad about it (who is also self employed but in something totally different,) what a nightmare it can be. Late payers. One company my DH works for is reliable but such a late payer- they can take up to 6 months. Because we know they will pay in the end, he waits but it is not easy when you are a sole trader with a family. I empathise, it is not easy. We find bigger companies sometimes seem better, it is the smaller ones can be tricky.

It's not the late payment in itself that I find unbelievable, it is OP's DH's attitude towards getting to paid - if you're self-employed you accept your cashflow could be a bit shit, but he can't accept just getting fobbed off forever. He is entitled to be paid, and he really won't ruin anything by insisting on it. Either A) the company are dicks who enjoy ruining small traders lives or B) they have cashflow issues themselves.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease - you have to chase chase and chase again. In these situations it is better to steer away from the emotive "my bills need to be paid, my family need feeding" approach and just keep reiterating terms and conditions and the outstanding bill. If you threaten to escalate, they will pay if they are variety A). If you threaten to escalate and still nothing then they could be variety B), which is a much greater problem, and when you'd want to get your claim on the money in quick...

Find a small local debt collector, is your husband part of any trade groups? He will be able to find one there, might cost around £500 but will have the desired effect.

I know, I get the same with my DH. It's like a kind of pride of something. I think they should just have some system in place where they sent X letter after X weeks to chase up. Mine is a nightmare, he hates even invoicing them.

I'm hoping mine gets some kind of online accountancy programme to help with it all.

Yes I agree with @NoSquirrels - I've been a freelancer, I know getting paid can be like getting blood from a stone but to be reluctant to chase when you're at the point where you are thinking you'll have to sell your house - that suggests to me there could be something else going on.

With a stance like "you're privileged to work for us" and the impertinent remarks about your savings - plus the usual shut-you-up trick of dangling future work - my patience would be exhausted by now; after all, where's the value in this "future work" if they don't pay?

I've run my own business and would recommend some urgent digging into their finances. If they're shaky you might as well try to get something before they disappear leaving lots of creditors who've all received the same attitude, and if it's safe there's nothing to lose by taking a much stronger approach

Be aware, though, that their next gambit may be to claim the work was substandard - and in future make sure you insist on staged payments instead of allowing a huge bill to run up

I worked for a big company, but the insistence of the credit control clerk chasing us only affected speed of payment, not the commercial relationship with the vendor

This is also a very good point. If it's a major company those who give out the contracts will probably never know what's been said to the payments department, and if it's a small concern ... well, see my previous comment about looking into their finances

where is the OP ?