To fear of a deliberate repeat attack on a tower block?

[MissionItsPossible]

I know it's not good living in fear and that anything can happen at any time, but honestly, look at how quickly the building went up in flames and look at how much chaos it has caused. I don't know what the solution is, to strip all big tower blocks that have flammable cladding? This was an atrocity on a huge scale and a terrorists wet dream. It just seems so easy and obvious and I would be so scared living in a building like this. I know it's not good to feel like that and it's what the terrorists want but I'm just watching the grief and frustration in the families eyes of dead or lost relatives and I'm just so upset and sad for them. Sorry this is has turned into a bit of a ramble really.

Terrorists don't care wbout muslim families. Most people who die worlwide from terror attacks are muslims

YANBU at all. They will see there are simply dozens of these towers that are vulnerable to horrific damage and loss of life. Coupled with visually horrific images that the media loves because they make for good viewing / click bait.

I would be shitting bricks if I was living in a clad tower block right now.

'You know fuck well this is about austerity of the Tory Govt. who don't give a fuck about the working class, working people living in London.
Or anywhere actually in UK.'

This is misleading. Millions were spent refurbishing the blocks. However the building regulations at the moment seem to be obsessed with CO2 emissions and insulation. Yes, those are important, but personally I think the money would have been better spent on sprinklers and fire alarms not insulating cladding. Building regs however disagree with me. What is more no one broke the law because the cladding was classed as safe. I find this horrifying. So technically the person who authorised the cladding was complying with building regulations. WTAF. Building regulations need to change.

Most people will be horrified to know that houses, flats and extensions built under current building regs are stuffed full of that foam. It is illegal NOT to use either the same or an equivalent insulator. OK, so it has to be behind something like fireproof plaster board, but should that be breached it will ignite. It doesn't take a genius to work out that in a serious fire walls etc will fall, exposing the foam.

We have it in our extension. That scares me. You probably have it in your home too.

HeyRoly possibly but I've seen enough footage of similar tower block fires that took hold to make me feel it is a valid concern. It would be incredibly easy to do, and to do it now whilst the government is unstable, and tensions are high amongst the entire population would delivery exactly the kind of turmoil they seek to exact.

There is a council estate in central London (The Brunswick centre) that was a concrete pile for years and years. Then they painted it white and it looks great. I don't understand why they have all this cladding when a lick of paint would do pretty much the same aesthetic job and wouldn't be flammable.

*Oh. And BY THE WAY...

We are all working class - Yea. We go out to work, no?!*

If that's what you want to believe

Millions were spent refurbishing the blocks. However the building regulations at the moment seem to be obsessed with CO2 emissions and insulation. Yes, those are important, but personally I think the money would have been better spent on sprinklers and fire alarms not insulating cladding. Building regs however disagree with me. What is more no one broke the law because the cladding was classed as safe. I find this horrifying. So technically the person who authorised the cladding was complying with building regulations. WTAF. Building regulations need to change.

^ YES it beggars belief I have read this cladding ticked lots of nice eco boxes

No need for terrorists, it's self-inflicted (not by high rise tower occupants, of course, but by their irresponsible landlords on the ground). And those supposedly in charge are not stepping up to the mark, by a long chalk.

stripey I agree -= a lick of paint.

I just have a feeling something dodgy has gone on here and back handers - passing through this crap when other countries have banned it - doesnt ring true to me....

Stripey because they could sell it as beneficial for the residents and the environment as insulating with aesthetics just as a bonus even if it was the main driver this would be seen as giving value for money. Possibly lower maintenance in theory too.

I'm not sure a terrorist could easily spot a building that has the weaknesses that were at Grenfell - there seem to be many failings - not just the cladding

Eg a building near me is on the list of those with the same cladding but there was a fire in a flat a couple of years ago and it was contained in the flat. Despite coming out the window and seriously burning the cladding around the window the cladding itself did not catch fire and spread.

So if a terrorist picked that building they wouldn't get very far.

Until Tuesday night, the cladding of tower blocks was considered a tremendous success. It is a very effective thermal insulator, and previously cold flats were transformed. Damp was largely eradicated, illnesses associated with damp, cold living conditions were reduced, and residents' heating costs dropped.

The problem is that the cheapest possible cladding is used. The fire-retardant version costs £2 more per sq m. The total additional cost for the Grenfell tower would have been £5k. There are close neighbours of that block who wouldn't blink at spending that much on a boiling water tap for their kitchen.

They could just replace the cladding with fire-resistant material
Choosing the cheaper material at Grenfell only saved 5k - and it burned. Dreadful way to cut costs.

Blocks have insulation because far more people die of the cold in the UK - official figures about 45,000 in 2010-2015 - than from fires.
Obviously they were almost all poorer people who couldn't afford more heating bills.

However there have been several fires in highrise blocks, no terrorists involved

There were deaths in 2009 which resulted in recommendations to avoid this happening again, such as sprinkler systems, fire-resistant materials, updated wiring of old systems.

Ignored of course, because the govt "didn't want to discourage housebuilders" and insist on abolishing 2 regulations for every new one they make

Terrorists would have to know which blocks have the inflammable cladding and which don't
Wait, they can guess: poor people aren't worth inflammable cladding

"Today 20:22 HeyRoly
"No aspiring terrorist arsonist could hope to replicate the chain of events that lead to this fire.

And, not to mention, the sheer number of Muslim families who lived in that block and similar blocks all over London."

Do you really think that terrorists give a shit what religion their victims are?

How naive of you. These are people, as I said, jumping on a bandwagon and dressing it up as ideology. It's not about religion.

Terrorists could go to any crowed place.

I feel very sorry for anybody with anxiety who lives in a high rise right now.

I was having this exact conversation with some people this morning. Terrorists seeing the terror and tragedy of this incident may be inspired to set some of these cladded buildings aflame. Much easier to set fire to an apartment within a tower block that is covered in flammable cladding that causes the whole building to ignite in minutes than it is to make a bomb or shoot as many people up. This could have a tremendous amount of casualties and cause maximum terror.

The media and politicians have done a brilliant job of having us downplay deaths from poverty, isolation, disease, and no one giving a shit. And playing up deaths from terrorism. To the point where we see probably over a hundred preventable deaths and we go 'what about terrorism'.

They do this because a population scared of an external enemy is massively easier to control. And, ironically, to make poor, isolated and have no one give a shit.

Paint would need to be redone every X amount of years therefore an ongoing maintenance cost whereas these panels are fit and forget

You know fuck well this is about austerity of the Tory Govt. who don't give a fuck about the working class, working people living in London.

Yeah like in Harriett Harmans Labour constituency with a Labour council after 12 years of Labour rule?

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p055wsk3

And oh how I laughed at the PP who said we are all working class! Just because you go to work does not mean you are working class ffs

Austerity wasnt responsible for this incident.

Poor people being ignored by their local council was responsible for this incident.

I should think that all of the councils will panic and start the process of removing such cladding from tower blocks to save their backs.
But maybe I'm just too optimistic.

It's not easy to pick a building with it on though and until the investigation has been completed you can't say that it was just the cladding. It sounds like the fire separation between floors wasn't effective either.

*The media and politicians have done a brilliant job of having us downplay deaths from poverty, isolation, disease, and no one giving a shit. And playing up deaths from terrorism. To the point where we see probably over a hundred preventable deaths and we go 'what about terrorism'.

They do this because a population scared of an external enemy is massively easier to control. And, ironically, to make poor, isolated and have no one give a shit.*

Excellent words