Ex taking DC abroad to Tunisia

[Eilasor]

Ex is Tunisian living in an EU country. DC have been visiting him twice a year and he has been visiting us in England once a year for the 5 years of their lives. DC have met ex's mother and a couple of cousins once, but apart from that haven't met any of his family. Hence why Ex wants DC this accompany him to a family reunion/gathering in Tunisia in September. It doesn't sit right with me (I think I am being unreasonable, probably), it doesn't seem like a safe place to travel to and I'm terrified of simply allowing my children out of the EU without me. I don't know what to do. I want to be fair and understanding, but the idea of it really upsets and unsettles me. AIBU?

I would flat out say no. I would say to him that you will revisit the idea in a few years after they have had more occasions where they have spent time with him.

If he is anxious that they get to know his family - why not start with skype and move up to visits in the future.

For me - at their age - I would just say No. Offer to let him come visit them more frequently if you really feel they deserve more time with him. There is plenty of time for them to get to know his family.

But I really am so concerned about safety.

And rightly so. Show him the FCO advice. Visiting family is not "essential".

No. It wouldn't be happening.
Why cant they come over here?
What if he doesnt bring them back?
Not a chance in hell.

What's your legal set up OP? Do you have shared PR? Is zero chance I would agree to this but I have sole residency (for good reasons clearly, as the Family Division otherwise goes with the 'Principle of No Order') and am thus in a permission to say a flat out no if I don't believe it to be in the interests of my child and that be the end of it. What is your *legal position' here?

Separate to the above, he is proposing actions which ignore clear FO advice. I find that concerning TBH. I also would not be blase about the risk of abduction, it happens. Further, your DC are incredibly young for the leap from a couple of days relatively nearby to many days much further away.

Finally, current DH needs a head wobble. I'd be telling him that the combo of my being solely responsible for his child - to the point where I could not act in best interest of my own child (IE going on the trip yourself) - AND him copping out of discussion/support vis this is one that doesn't work other than for him

Good luck. Stay child-centric and you're unlucky to go wrong.

Tunisia is no more dangerous than England and is crawling with tourists from other European countries again. Areas that aren't touristy are even less of a target. The foreign office advice is because of Libya.

No way. No show. No how.

Not. A. Hope.

Just NO.

Tunisia is a hotbed of terrorism and few that have been caught here are from there. A friend said you can go outside of the resorts so I would make it a blanket no for any travel there.

Your primary job is the keep your children safe. You would have fuck all chance of getting them back if he decides to keep them there. Do NOT underestimate his family's influence to do that.

You are not stopping his family meeting them. If it's that important to them they can come here.

It would be a monumentally stupid thing to allow him to take them.

The FCO says no. You may even ave issues with travel insurance as a result. I would say no based on the FCO advise and be adamant.

A woman I knew had no worries about abduction and they were in this country, not even travelling abroad.
she had no idea he would take the kids and do what he did.
neither he nor the kids are here today, he was a lovely man, I grew up with him. He came from a lovely family, well brought up etc.
He just snapped when he had the kids.

I'm not suggesting he would do anything like this, nor abduct the children. However, nobody knows what somebody will do under stress or pressure.
This added to the problems of the area, no way can you let them go.

Please op, think about it carefully! I used to work with the lady whose Tunisian ex husband (who worked and live in Europe for years and was very much involved in their child life) during one of the visit just abducted the child. They got on very well. He came to visit them few days before child's 3rd birthday. They decided to cancel childminder for that day so he could spend some time with his child. When my friends got back from work they both were gone. She never managed to bring her child back to the UK and lost fortune trying to fight custody in Tunisian court, not to mention that it literally ruined her life and health.
I'm not saying this will happen with your children, I hope your ex husband is decent human being, but before making any decision I would strongly advise you to check where would you be legally, if for some reason your ex husband would decide to keep children in Tunisia.

Could you offer to put some money towards flying some of his family over? Or offer to put them up? I'm just trying to think if you could help promoting the relationships in a way other than letting them go to Tunisia.

Foreign Office advice is not to travel. That would be enough for me to say no and I'm not paranoid about these things.

If he decided not to bring the DC back there's shockingly little you could do.

If you let them travel to visit him where he lives, do you trust him not to take them to Tunisia against your wishes?

I don't think there's anything wrong in the children being abroad with one of their parents for a few days. There are some insular views on this thread! (Volcano?! Please... )

However, given where he intends to take them to, the FCO advice on travel and their ages, I wouldn't be too happy. I'd also want to check whether wherever he takes them to is signed up to The Hague Convention.

Do the children have the Tunisian citizenship and would it have been possible for your ex to get for them (eg my dcs have my own citizenship because they were registered at the embassy at birth - that meant they also had my own citizenship wo any of DH involvement iyswim)?

How easy would it be for your ex to get a Tunisian passport for them?

I wouldn't let them go.
For safety reason (see the advice from the foreign office), and because of the fact he might welll decide not to bring them back.
I wouldn't tell him that though.
Just that you are following the foreign office advice and the dcs just aren't going.

Go with your instincts. Is he on birth certificates? If their is a slight chance he may not bring them back the it's definitely not worth the risk.
He may of waited till this age as he knows judges all children away from their mum from this age.
Sure his family are welcome to visit them?
Or I would go with them.
Definitely not worth the risk.

There is no way I would feel comfortable about my ex taking my children to Tunisia.

I can understand that you want them to know their extended family, and once it's deemed a safe place to travel to you can accompany them there in the future. I know you also say you are not 'overly concerned' about abduction, but neither was Sally Faulkner.

Allow* children away from their mum

Some of the posts on this thread are bordering on hysterical. Also, it is extremely difficult for most Tunisian citizens to obtain visitors visas for most EU countries, Britain probably being the toughest, so the option of his family coming to visit instead is probably not actually an option.

No way no how. The risk of abduction is too high. I've read all too often how this happens with no warning. Family and parental influence can be to much or it can be prearranged. And not to a non eu country. The fathers parental rights will be enforced if he decides to keep them in Tunisia and you will have lost your children forever.

Tunisia is a signatory to the Hague Convention. Only you can judge, OP, but I sent my dd to Mexico to visit her father and grandparents when she was eight. Abduction is always a worry, but I reckoned I had a 95% chance of that not happening and no problem. Now, many years later I am so glad that my dd was able to develop close family ties with her grandparents, uncles and aunts.

Stateless

Countless times children have been abducted and taken to counties where they aren't returned.
There are men who lose all sense of what is right and decent and lose sight of what is best for their children.

Each time they are reported the community and remaining parent/ family are shocked and had no idea this would happen, showed no signs etc. They don't advertise what they are planning on doing.

It's hardly hysterical to urge the OP to be careful and not to go against government advice not to travel.

Tunisia is NOT a party to the Hague Convention on abduction:

travel.state.gov/content/childabduction/en/country/tunisia.html

I am not sure how it is "hysterical" to recommend that someone follows the advice of the Foreigh Office not to travel to a country.

Do you think they put those recommendations up just to amuse themselves?

The risk of abduction would definitely worry me. More so than the general risk from terrorism, even taking into account the FCO advice, but I'm a fatalist and anyway it seems to me we can't exactly be relaxed about it in our own country.

Not the point of this thread, but to whoever said upthread that Tunis is closer to London than Rome, it isn't.