Lies, my DS and my DH

[JustForThis15]

We have issues with DS1 lying about things. He has trouble understanding right from wrong and lies about things if he thinks he will get into trouble. It seems impossible to fix and we are getting no where with it.
I'm working today and came home just now after a couple of hours of work. My DH is minding the children at home.
My 6 year old comes over to me and says that daddy went away and left them at home with no parents. His car was gone and his baby bother was crying a lot.
His brother is 3.
I laugh and said "thats silly he didn't leave you, did you?" while calling upstairs to DH who is changing beds (Not something I've ever see him do on his own accord before!)
DH says "No, I didn't" in a snorting, kind of astonished he could say such a thing, way.
I asked DS1 why he said that and he repeated DS2 was crying. I asked DS2 why was he crying. Then I asked DH "was DS2 crying earlier?"
DH turned back to the bed and muttered, "I was only 2 minutes". Turns out he did go to the shop (which is far more than 2 minutes away).
We've never left children at home alone. And I'm mad about it. But more than that is I am mad that he lied quite openly in front of DS1 to me.
No wonder DS1 has issues with lying when he is learning from his dad.
I am raging and DH has now said I am overreacting, look at all the cleaning I am doing. I've spent the morning cleaning, the place was a tip and you didn't even bring home any lunch.
FFS. I love the way he has turned this on me.
I am working. The place is not a tip.
AIBU to empathise the seriousness of this and how do I stop my DH from these stupid lies. No wonder DS1 is behaving the way he does.
How can I help DH to gain some morals and cop on?

Does he not realise that if anyone had come to the house and found the children on their own, he could have come back to a visit from social services - and he couldn't tell them to stop going on about it?

You're focusing on entirely the wrong thing. It's absolutely pointless for him to apologise to anybody - he left your 3 year old and 6 year old on their own, then lied about it. No amount of apologising will make up for that. He is totally untrustworthy. There is no way you can ever leave him alone with the children again. He needs to fuck right off.

There's NO point in sitting him down and telling him anything - he's a liar and he'll agree to anything now that he realises he's been sussed. OP, you cannot trust this man with your children - either with their physical care (as he left them alone) or with their emotional care (as he lied and lied, making out your son was the liar.)

I would end the relationship, frankly.

I'm sorry, but I'm struggling to understand you.

He left two very small children alone.
He lied about it.
He doesn't think he was wrong, about anything.
He doesn't respect your opinion that he was wrong.

I couldn't stay with him, or leave him in charge of the children. I'd be completely rethinking everything.

I am very angry even reading this. I think you have to carefully consider your future with this man. I don't think I've ever advised this to anyone on mumsnet before, but his approach to truth, respect and the safety of your children is appalling.

If I were in your shoes I would give it a bit of time, let things cool down a bit then try speaking to him about it again this evening when the kids are in bed. Go through the two separate issues and explain how serious each one is. I would go so far as to say that I was would not remain in a marriage where I couldn't trust my partner. Then see what he says at that point.

If his response remains the same then I'd say you have a tough decision to make.

Trouble is, if the OP does go to the ultimate solution and leaves him, then he's going to get the children for time on his own ANYWAY. And she can't trust him to be on his own with the DC now, because he's shown he's an utterly irresponsible fuckwit.

What a horror of a situation :(

You need to sit down with your husband and explain to him very clearly why leaving the children alone and lying are unacceptable and dangerous.

If he understands it and truly changes his ways, there may be hope.

If he doesn't get it and continues to accuse you of overreacting, I think you should leave him.

And never mind he would get time with the children. You would have to be the primary carer and the main moral compass. Which this twat is preventing you from being right now with his lies.

Firstly, no-one ever thinks that leaving a 3yo without adult, or at least teenage, supervision is ok. No-one. There's no room for misunderstandings, mistakes or 'not thinking' there. He, you, everybody knows it was never ok.

This isn't helpful but, it sounds as though he believes home and children are your responsibility and he's angry with you for working.

Neglecting the children sounds like a 'fuck you OP, they're not really my responsibility, if you're not here you can't expect things to be done properly'. Then the bed-making - your absence, so abandonment of your domestic responsibilities, has forced him to debase himself by performing feminine tasks (in an effort to show you up as a slattern).

He's lost all respect for you because you are not performing the role he's allotted you. You don't know your place, so he's damn well going to show you. Who cares if less important people than him are damaged in the process?

Did you have any hint of this attitude before you married, or had children?

His willingness to endanger his children to enforce his ideas about gender roles and his own supreme importance is extremely worrying.

If your DH thinks leaving a 6 and 3 year old home alone is no big deal, then I suggest he phone SS and asks them what they think of this situation

Apparently the massive urgency, he told me when he was trying to explain himself, was that he had to get milk at the petrol station.
I just checked the milk in the fridge and its from Lidl.
Confronted him with this and he says he went to get a cigar. That the truth and he had one the other day too, no more lies, he said.

So now I'm like a grown up that he has to hide smoking from. Not sure why, I have said before I don't care if he smokes or not, its his own business. I really don't care and have expressed that.

So even when he is telling me the truth about going out, he still slipped in another lie about the reasoning. For what purpose? I have no fucking idea. Why not give the real reason. His lying is out of hand, he doesn't even seem to realise its another lie, its like he can't help himself.
Is that what you call a compulsive or pathological liar and can someone professional deal with that?

Too right Thumb, I don't want to leave him alone with my children as it is going to damage them.

What thumbwitch said. OP is damned if she leaves him and damned if she stays with him

If your husband is reading this I've a message for him "you're a pathalogical liar who accused his own son of lying to avoid being caught in a lie. Essentially you're a first class twat."

Yes, he's pushing you into the 'Mum' role - to him too.

He'll be delighted when you say you can't ever leave him alone with the DCs again.

His massive, fragile ego is a huge problem. There might be therapy available but he'd have to want to take it.

You're going to need to record his neglectful behaviour, and organise life so he isn't in charge of the children solo. Would a short sharp shock make him face up to the problem and change, do you think, or is it very much ingrained?

Start logging absolutely every incident you can think of, including those in the past. Divorce and ask for supervised visits because he's a risk to your children.

Although it sounds as if he wouldn't be that bothered with visits and so on, to be honest.

Oh, and start supporting your son. Obviously, it's his father who cannot be trusted, not him.

You need to sit down with your husband and explain to him very clearly why leaving the children alone and lying are unacceptable and dangerous.

If you have to do this to an adult then I would question their ability to ever be left alone with children .

Sorry, just re-read some of your answers more carefully, OP.

If you can't trust your husband and you don't think he will change, you don't have a relationship, and I don't think you ever did.

Time to end it as best as possible.

I think what I'd do - and yes I think, however horrible it would feel, I would do this in these circs - is call social services and talk through the incident. Get a record that it happened, find out how they would respond if it happens again.

Partly, this would give your DH evidence that it isn't just you (and your MN cronies) who regard this as serious. It should be a wake up call.

Depending how much he's invested in his delusions, it could indicate to him that the whole nanny state is against ordinary delusionally egotistical blokes like him (in which case he'll join F4J and feel very angry and very sorry for himself after you split).

Also, it would start to build a body of formal evidence, to be taken into account in deciding future care and contact arrangements, if and when you split.

My dh left my two alone for 5 min when they were 7 and going on 5.
He told me about it, I was not happy, told him never to do it again (until the point at which we both agreed they were old enough to be left), he didn't.

I have to say I agree with lottie's analysis, OP.

When he said he went out for milk, fuck where he went, or whether he smokes, or lies about that.

WHY ARE YOU PREPARED TO RISK OUR DC FOR THE SAKE OF MILK? Is what I would be shouting at him?

If you left DC with babysitter, and they left them alone, what would you feel like saying to them?

Report him. Does he get that he's committed an offence?

Years of being on MN I thought I'd read everything but this takes the motherfuckin biscuit.

I'd have spontaneously combusted over this.

How can you EVER have sex with this lying horrendous excuse of a man??

Lottie I agree with you on a lot of that. There always was a certain element of my role in the house and feeling as if certain tasks are beneath him.
His family background is the same where his mother does absolutely everything in the house. He or his father never needed to lift a finger.

He looks after the children quite a lot while I work and I am very worried about that now. I'm working at home this afternoon and can keep an ear out but can't always do that.

OP, you do know, that you cannot trust this lying buffoon ...🤔

Well that's that, OP.

Your last post makes it clear - he's a liability, plus a partner who isn't really a partner at all. A compulsive liar with a nasty blaming streak and a huge ego is err... not much of a catch really.

Yes to advice above saying take this further, if only to protect them later on.

Sadly I doubt he'd want much access that isn't organised to make his life as easy as possible so you might not have a problem with keeping them safe.

Way to go OP's H - hello lonely life mate!