'But what about Syria'. Would I be unreasonable to tell this woman to go and fuck herself?

[Runny]

I have a Facebook friend who I think it's fair to say has some very extreme political views that she's not afraid to air. Normally I think live and let live, but she really gets her knickers in a knot over things like the Western bombings of Syria, refugees, Israel etc. I should say I'm also against the bombings in Syria and have donated to refugee charities.

Since the Paris terror attacks she's become very vocal about how Western media organisations ignore the terror attacks that happen in the Middle East, lots of 'why don't we change our FB profile pics to Palestinian flags' and the like. I let that go, even though I think she's talking out of her arse and it's blatantly obvious why our media focus on stuff happening in Europe. Since then with every terror attack that's happened she's posted similar stuff, even when the Westminster attacks happened the other week. This person lives in Central London so it bloody happened on her died doorstep and she was still at it even then!

Then yesterday arrived, my feed was full of comments about how awful and horrific the events in Manchester were. She was uncharacterstically quiet for most of the day, then late afternoon she posts a status 'I weep for the children, children everywhere'. What followed was a load of guff implying it was a 'false flag' designed to rig the election in the Tories favour. I hate the Tories as much as the next person, but come on that's just lunacy!

She's been at it most of the night, posts about fucking Syria, don't forget about Syria. Seriously, there's a time and a place for her crack pot opinions, and I really want to comment telling her she's a fucking insensitive idiot for spouting this now. WIBU to do this? She seems to have a complete empathy bypass. I'm so angry reading her posts, she posts this guff just hours after children have been blown to bits at a pop concert. What the hell is wrong with her?

While I broadly agree with the points made by your Facebook friend, the 'false flag' stuff is crack pottery.

I don't deny false flags have happened throughout history and will again. But it's nuts to suggest this is likely to be one of them.

The Tories are in a strong position and I can't imagine how they'd be in the frame of mind to pull out a heinous tactic like this.

So yanbu to call her out on that point at least. It's a horrific suggestion.

It would be harder to lay blame at out feet but it wouldn't stop people wanting to blow us up?

When Western governments invade countries and fund terrorist groups to overthrow foreign governments they dislike then we have to accept this as blowback because our populations sat back and allowed them to do it.

This is a global problem and these terrorists are funded by the West and our Arab allies when it suits them. If we don't care about the genocide, millions of refugees and purposeful destruction of Syria and Libya by the funding of these vicious terrorist groups to overthrow non puppet governments, then we can't complain when those same trained terrorists come back to Europe and blow us up.

Why is murdering a bunch of innocent Syrians/iraqis/libyans... ok but to murder westerners a special tragedy? All loss of innocent life is a tragedy and an outrage. The pain of a Syrian parent is the same as the pain of a British one.

Indifference to the 'other' is the root of all evil.

Hilda, your last point is very profound and gets right to the heart of it.

Countries such as Belgium, Germany and Sweden have also been (and are being) targeted by this kind of extremism. I have many issues with British foreign policy (not that I'm any kind of expert) but such attacks would be a risk regardless of it, it seems. The responsibility for these abhorrent attacks is solely that of those who choose to plan them and those who carry them out.

Why is murdering a bunch of innocent Syrians/iraqis/libyans... ok

It's not. However I think it's natural for many to become more upset about things closer to home, people you can identify with, see yourself or your children as being. I have struggled not to be tearful about this week's attack perhaps in part because I know how exciting it is to attend a concert, one which for many will probably have been their first, see a band or artist you love, the joy you feel as you come out with their songs ringing around your head, and to see that ruined for so many young people is horrific. It's probably not right but I admit that I am far more affected by this than when I see tragedies elsewhere (not that I don't find them upsetting). This might say something about me but I can't help that being the case.

I still find it so enraging that someone carried out this attack. To choose to target somewhere knowing it'd be largely full of happy children. The footage of largely young teenagers panicking in the aftermath is very sad to watch and thinking of those who've been killed, seeing their faces and how senselessly their lives have been taken from them is something I find particularly upsetting.

This happens with other cases as well. For example, a murder will affect the community the victim was from more than it would those in another area. Some (maybe most) people are more affected by something which happens in greater proximity to them.

Hilda and Laurie

Absolutely no-one said violence against 'a bunch of innocent Syrians/iraqis/Libyans' was ok. Less reported, yes, less horrifying because it happens in an unstable, war-torn region beset by violent conflict for decades, yes.

Western governments invade countries and fund terrorist groups to overthrow foreign governments they dislike

So what do you suggest they do?
Stand back and allow Assad to continue his murderous regime? Should we have allowed the Taliban to continue their murderous rule?
Stood back and left Saddam in power (just like Western countries did with Hitler 1933-39)?

Do we leave them all alone or pick a side and fight with it? If we leave them all alone with people /children stop being murdered for the cause? No I didn't think so.

If 'our' actions were wrong, what would the right cause of action be?

OP I don't think getting involved in politics is for you. Stick to memes about kittens on Facebook and unfollow your friend.

So much wrong with your posts but seeing others trying to explain things to you, I can see your just unwilling to listen.

NoLove; Belgium, Germany and Sweden have allowed terrorists to brainwash masses of youths, allowed those youth off to train in Syria... Where they raped their sex slaves and murdered masses of innocent civilians... They allowed them back without consequence or care. They silenced everybody who pointed out what was going on and the grave danger posed. Then they get attacked themselves. Blowback.

I remember a female Somali journalist living in Sweden who had to move back to Mogadishu because she was placed in so much danger by reporting on Al shabib openly brainwashing and training youths after school! The Swedish establishment went after her along with the extremists who wanted to silence her. Let's stop pretending that those at the top haven't created and supported this situation. They have and innocent people pay the consequences.

Tell her to go to Syria and report on it then? I'm sorry but if I was a journo, no amount of money in the world could make me want to go to a war torn country just to write a story. The media feeds what the public wants to read, that's it really.

But we didn't sit back and allow them to do it - millions of people marched against war in Iraq, it happened anyway.

What political party can I vote for that says we won't get involved with any of it?

Belgium, Germany and Sweden have allowed terrorists to brainwash masses of youths, allowed those youth off to train in Syria... Where they raped their sex slaves and murdered masses of innocent civilians... They allowed them back without consequence or care. They silenced everybody who pointed out what was going on and the grave danger posed. Then they get attacked themselves

.... and the evidence for this is........?

here language like the OP's 'fucking Syrians' is very telling in terms of how she views these people and the respect she affords them.

Which was why I thought Hilda's final point about indifference to the 'other' was so important.

Why are the children of Syria less deserving of attention than the children of Manchester?

They are all innocent and didn't deserve what has happened to them.

OP, your friend is, in the main, right.

Herethere; you're denying it? Go look it up. It's a fact. There are thousands of fighters from all over Europe. 3000 are back on the streets of Britain according to the security services. That's a conservative estimate.

What political party can I vote for that says we won't get involved with any of it?

Labour is slightly less warmongery with Corbyn at the helm

I'm not sure who it helps to, in the immediate aftermath of such an abhorrent attack in which children attending a concert were killed and many will be injured and otherwise affected for a long time to come, point out that more children in other parts of the world suffer. So many awful things happen around the world. How many children are starving in East Africa now? But it wouldn't be relevant to point that out in the context of how many children are in food poverty here with families needing to use food banks.

Tragedies closer to home will always impact many people (including myself) more than ones further away.

Indifference to the other is the root of all evil

That sword has two edges, doesn't it. The opposite sentiments, those of decent hospitality to the other and a wish to strenuously avoid appearing prejudiced, are abused by the enemies of European countries (including the UK) to great and evil effect.

Any virtue in excess...

I'm uncomfortable with the public brow beating and anxiety-inducing scare-mongering all over social media to be honest. Friends panicking about going into their local town today, friends having kittens because they saw an armed police officer.

But your friend has a valid point - every innocent death is a tragedy, wherever they come from.

Labour is slightly less warmongery with Corbyn at the helm

Lol. Except if you happen to be a Jewish kid. Then he's pretty warmongery.

I think it's perfectly natural to be scared when something awful like this happens on your doorstep.

Sorry if Ive caused offence, but I feel quite personally upset by this atrocity. Ive been in that foyer, Ive sat there, stood there. It hits very, very close to home when you see a graphics photo of the aftermath of a suicide bombing and it's somehwere you've been many times.

I think first of all, your ´friend´ is just insensitive. It is inevitable that people care about people closer to them even if you don`t know them personally. When a big public figure (imagine the Queen) dies it would be insensitive to say "so what, do you know how many people died yesterday in China?

For the second point, I think the far left has a real problem when it comes to these kind of issues. I think its perfectly sensible to think about what is going on in Syria. What happens there is really horrendous. There is an argument that the west's intervention has played a role in terrorism, but it's complicated, and theres no counterfactual. Would there be terrorism in the west if we hadn`t got involved in Iraq or Libya? We simply don't know. However, far too many on the far left do verge into sympathy for terrorists by saying "we bomb children too". That argument is nonsense.

Runny I feel you as my FIL is also posting a lot about false flag shit and I'm so angered by it but as he has form for kicking off viciously to anyone who disagrees with him on Facebook I'm not responding even tho he is also private messaging me his crack pot ideas

With the "false flag" thing she probably means the "we stand with Manchester" meme that is doing the rounds that was issued by a racist, extremist anti-Muslim group called British Freedom. They are taking advantage of people's horror at the atrocity of the attack for their own political purpose, which is sickening. Anyone who shares it should check out British Freedom first, to make sure that they're happy with what it stands for. I know a number of people who were shocked when they found out and took it down (or replaced it with another meme from a different source).