To contact sons teacher and make her feel as shit as she has made him feel!!

[cherryberrymum]

I'm bloody furious and I'm counting on the Mumsnet massive to make me see perspective here.

Son is doing AS levels. One of his teachers who has been laid back to say the least all year has suddenly realised her entire class are not going to pass!!!!

I have done the subject previously and have been helping him the best I can but after a recent disaster in a class test I sent him to ask her for advice.

He said she sat back in her chair arms behind her head and just said he had written a crap answer and it only deserved 3 out of 20 but she felt generous and gave him 6 out of twenty. 😟

Who the hell is that benefiting???? He is home now feeling crap about the first exam which is next Tuesday! She didn't give him any guidance on how to improve his answer. Just told him to read the question in future. He finished tomo for study leave but I'm so bloody cross!!!

WIBU to contact her tomo morning and tell her she's a Knob! Or should I wait till parents meetings in October (assuming he passes AS levels and gets back to do A Levels)

He is studying for the other three subjects independently now but I have been helping with Sociology.

His other subjects are Maths. Business Studies. Physics plus he's doing PE BTec in evenings with a fitness group he attends. The Sociology just seems to be a different way of thinking for him.

I have found a load of old essay questions and we have been practicing reading them and establishing what they are asking. Hoping this will help as he has a decent grasp of most of the theories now.

Your son is old enough to ask for clarification in or after class. Goodness he could be in a job/apprenticeship and would you be running in telling his boss what you want to do to the teacher. Sounds immature so perhaps he didn't read the question. If inadequate teaching the overall results will show this up.

Grade boundaries for Summer 2016 may help you to gauge.

Good luck with that! See earlier posts on totally new way of assigning grade boundaries.

cherry-thank you for coming back! The problem with using old syllabus past papers is the styles of questions have changed. I think it is great you are doing past papers with your son but I have had to advise a parent for my subject not to do that for two reasons:
The syllabus is different so some things are the same, some things are no longer needed and other topics are totally new. Just be aware of that.
The other is that the style of questions have changed-they used to be direct-for example, what is this? Now, they involve higher order thinking and skills using scenarios. That is the new philosophy for the new Linear exams.

Ok, so your Grammar School (I too teach in a Kent Grammar but not your one as we don't offer Sociology) has specified all students are to take the public exams for AS and then choose which ones to re-do in Year 13 (it will be re-do as they will have to give up those grades to do so) so it is important for school progression but not for the actual qualification. Hopefully this can take a little bit of the pressure off and probably explains a lot of what your DS has told you and why the teacher has done what you have said.

This is why, knowing all the full facts first is always better than charging in head first like a bull in a china shop, so that you can understand some things and question others. It really does sound like your DS has expected more than could probably have been given but at the same time, does also highlight that your school as a whole, has been pretty poor in communications with parents what these new Linear exams are all about.

OP - Why don't you e-mail the teacher and ask her why she thought it was acceptable to be blasé about your son's mark and using the word CRAP when speaking to him.

That way at least you will have both sides of the story.

I am sorry to say this but I can imagine a 17 year old coming home and saying that his teacher acted like that but from experience I know that when you ask them directly if their teacher really used bad language then they usually say that they didn't.

For example my son will say that his teacher said something he did was shit.

So I get angry for him and say, so Mr X actually said to you "PersianCatBoy your work is shit".

Then he will usually say "well, no but that is what he meant"

I assured she said his answer was crap. She often uses crap and when I have spoken with her before she uses language like this freely. She is less formal than his other teachers and dare I say less organised. My one of my other sons had the same teacher for English and we had no issues with her like this. Maybe it's just the subject. I admit my son probably does not ask for help on a regular basis but when he does surely it should be given.

Maybe it's just the subject. I admit my son probably does not ask for help on a regular basis but when he does surely it should be given.
Depends.
If it's 'I don't get the question you set for homework. Can you go through it with me at a convenient time? (on the Monday and it's due Thursday).' Or in class, or at the end of class to get things clarified. Then I'd say yes, it's a given.

If it's 'I don't get the question but I've left it until the night before and have bashed a half done version and have handed it in and when it's rubbish I'll say I didn't understand' / 'I've not been proactive all year and now the exams are close I want lots of extras' then no. It's not a given.

Students are not entitled to lots of extra help outside of lesson. Many teachers do (me included!) But I don't bend over backwards for students who have wasted time/think last minute panics are my problem etc

E.g. I've just had a gcse student ask for a list of quotations to learn for their exam. 3 weeks to go. My answer, no. I've taught them all and it's in their books. Why should I do more because they've been disorganised? I told them to make their lists and come back for the ones they need help. They've done the hard work and now I'll gladly give them extra help after school

I admit my son probably does not ask for help on a regular basis but when he does surely it should be given

Really? Even if he has been given said help many times in the past through lessons or assignments or revision sessions but hasn't bothered to take it in until he thinks, "Oh, I have exams soon, can the teacher bail me out?!"
Especially as you said she taught English to your other DS and never did any of what you have accused. So it is nothing to do with a teacher who is lazy or unprofessional or anything you have accused her of. It is most likely down to the fact all Grammar schools have severely reduced funding due to not having many Pupil Premium students very tight budgets that they have asked an English teacher to teach Sociology. Again, this is down to your school's procedures not helping your Son, not your Son's teacher. This is why I hate the rants and raves of some parents who don't think there may be more to it. Your initial posts, OP were extremely harsh.

I really think you need to take a step back and give the teacher a break.

As for the good percentages. I don't think the percentages in the 60's are good.

Even I feel that is often an A or B grade at A Level?

Seriously, if parents realised what the UMs grade boundaries were for subjects, they may well not be so pleased with their DC's results. For GCSE, for example, 55% has been an A grade in the recent past...

That was meant to say Even if that was often an A or B grade at A Level?

Autocorrect!

Kitty I totally take all your points on board. I really do and while when I first posted I was angry I still think he hasn't done anything wrong asking for help here.

He doesn't normally ask for help because he is by nature a quiet kid and would rather work it out himself. And probably wouldn't have asked for help here only I felt that a score of 6/20 was soooo low that he needs to ask for help here.

He is a good kid and a diligent student and I'm not going to go into again how the asking for help came about.

I don't care how it came about that she was teaching Sociology. The fact is she does and I expect the same level of teaching for this as for her main subject.

He doesn't normally ask for help because he is by nature a quiet kid and would rather work it out himself.
So he has CHOSEN not to ask for help.
6th form is where they are treated like young adults. They are expected to be independent and proactive.
You can't say "my son doesn't also for help and I don't want to go into it but now he's not getting what I want the teacher is rubbish and the class are failing"

The fact is she does and I expect the same level of teaching for this as for her main subject.
I'll remember that if I ever have to teach science, maths or geography or any other subject that I haven't done since GCSE.
Plus and I repeat, you don't KNOW that she can't teach the subject. All you know is your child has made comments about the "whole class failing" etc. If it's that bad and you've had concern for that long, why didn't you make him swap options?

I had sympathy on some of your points raised but I'm quickly losing it. You're clearly out for this teacher and aren't happy with anything other than confirmation your child's version is gospel truth and that you're right to go after the teacher.

There's no talking sense to you.

I'm obviously not going to agree with everyone.

My issues with the teacher are not individual to me. As I said earlier at least two other parents are dissatisfied.

I am not going after her. My efforts over the next week or so are
Concentrated on getting him through the Sociology exam.

In fairness as I said he's a quiet kids and yes! He chose not to ask for help but I have to say I can see why now I look at her reaction when he did ask. However I know some of you will say that's his fault for not asking for help every time he gets stuck.

I think teachers on here need to take a step back and stop taking OP's comments so personally. This is not about you.

It's perfectly possible to have a crap teacher in an otherwise decent school. I went to what is supposedly one of the most academic schools in the country and I had two lousy teachers for A level, one of whom was fired, the other received the lowest grades in the subject in the year. Luckily I had objected to the latter teacher and swapped classes.

It sounds, between the lines, that she's a bit of a lazy teacher, happy to encourage the students who get it, and maybe not doing enough to help the others get up to speed. They do exist. And sure maybe OP's son didn't work hard enough, but it sounds like he not really sure what's expected.

I'm concerned with your son's A level choices as much as anything. A grammar school should be steering bright pupils towards 'hard' subjects the the good unis take seriously. He's doing two soft and two hard. If he had been doing 3 hard, he could have dropped the sociology altogether without any major issue. At this point if he drops it he will be down to two hard, one soft. Could he do double maths, for example?

I think you need to go and talk to the head about overall strategy.

I went to parents evening with my mother whilst studying AS/A Levels. She defended me to the earth.

My tutor from secondary taught me Psychology at AS. She sent a referral about me to my Sixth Form tutor. I had apparently been talking inappropriately and stormed out of the class at the end of a class. None of this was true. She used to pick on the children that weren't popular. She used to feel her connection with the popular kids allowed her to control the class. I wrote a letter of complaint to my head of sixth form year (also happened to be the head of psychology) and got her suspended for a few weeks. I got a great deal of satisfaction out of it.

It's not about him asking for help every time. It's about the way you talk about the teacher that sounds very much like you're interested in being vindicated in your view.

I can just say from experience that some 6th formers (especially in high performing schools) get their hand held through gcse do don't really get the independence and proactive thing.
They can be very quick to go on the "tell mam and dad that the teacher is bad" approach.
I've had at least 1 student try this every year I've ever taken an a level group. Some of my favorite complaints: maisy is unreasonable because she wants us to work in our frees, maisy was rude about my child's work (reality was it was an excellent example which I shared so others could learn and I mentioned how it could be tweaked to get an A), maisy hasn't given proper coursework feedback and the entire class is failing their coursework, I don't think maisy should be teaching a level because she's not giving my child 1-1 on their coursework in her own time when the child has asked for zero help in class, maisy is mean for telling students that if they don't do X y z then they will struggle to pass the course, everyone in the class thinks maisy isn't a suitable teacher.

Of course, those complaints were from a tiny minority of students/parents because the rest of the group were just getting on with it and doing well. The complaints cake out of students worried and aware they weren't doing enough.
As soon as they did what I expected of them, I was more than willing to help them.

It's perfectly possible to have a crap teacher in an otherwise decent school.
Completely agree.

What my issue is with the OP is that she is very quick to suggest that this teacher is crap based on hearsay from a student who has admitted not seeking help and her response isn't "should I make contact with the school to reasonably raise my concern in good time and in a productive manner". It's "I want to humiliate a teacher and kick off". It's simply not helpful or productive

I been on the receiving end of parents displaying OP's attitude and the student was talking total rubbish because they thought I'd back down.

If there's actual concerns there's a process. OP should follow it instead of trying to target somebody based on the hearsay of teenagers.

I should add that I'm not suggesting sociology can't be saved at this point, I'm sure it can. Either with help from the school, from your input and possibly with the help of a tutor, if necessary

I thought alicatte's posts had been sensible, she can see the issue from both sides.

A good teacher should be able to see if a pupil needs help. Particularly if they're only getting 3/20 in a test.

I don't think telling a teacher they're a knob is particularly helpful, but I don't think OP was being serious.

Depends Nancy.

One of mine got a U on a test earlier this year. They're gcse. I didn't need to give him lots of extra help. He needed to revise the material I told him to. When I asked him he said he didn't look over most of it.

I agree that teachers go round and give help in class etc. But I can see how if you've got a student who's very much 'I want to work on my own' might give the impression they don't want help so gets bypassed.

I'm amazed at the rush to protect the godlike teacher. If a pupil who can understand something doesn't, the teacher is failing. Who cares if its 'right' to upset the poor professional paid teacher. He or she has a conveyor belt of pupils that whether they do well or badly will have very small individual effect on them, whereas pupils have only one chance to go through school and develop when they do, so of course it's more right from the pupil/parent perspective than from the teacher's, and bad teaching for one pupil, but not for rest would be MORE concerning not less so the 'oh well it's bollocks because the whole class hasn't complained' argument is worthless...

A teacher saying work is 'crap' us the same as aboss saying work is crap, ie useless and unhelpful.

If a student gives the impression of wanting to work alone but is handing in low scoring essays, then there's a problem. Even if they don't want help, it needs to be pointed out that they're not likely to pass at that standard.

There are students who are bright and sincere who simply haven't switched on to the subject and what's required; then there are those like your U grade pupil who have no interest in the subject or in doing any work.

I don't mean it's either or - there's a broad spectrum, and we don't know where OP's son falls. It may be a bit on both sides - perhaps his teacher's not that brilliant and he's not worked that hard either.

If he is sincere about wanting to do well then all the help required to bring him up to speed should be offered.

With your latest updates, he is doing too much. 4 A levels plus a btec is a huge workload and usually ( nearly always) leads to diminshed results.
If i had a quid for every parent who told me their kid could cope i could sack off the day job.
We routinely get kids into oxbridge, medicine, vet school etc with 3 A levels (and an EPQ usually)
Let him drop something
I would suggest sociology and the btec tbh

scaryclown
It's not about protecting a godlike teacher at all.

It's a simple case of saying 'be aware that students must take responsibility especially in 6th form and that students of all ages are liable to give a version of events that can present themselves in the best light possible. If you have any concerns there are procedures to follow. Follow them'

From a teacher perspective, I'm always more than happy to chat to parents with concerns, provided they are polite and don't come into the conversation with the sort of attitude the OP had earlier of "my child is brilliant and you are crap". If they start off my pointing out all the reasons I'm crap at my job because their darling child said x y z then I'm naturally less inclined to want to help.

If he is sincere about wanting to do well then all the help required to bring him up to speed should be offered.
At what cost? Should the teacher be expected to stay back until 5 because now it's convenient for a child to study? I've had those requests. It's not a reasonable request. Happy to provide help when children are working hard and want to do well. I'm not giving "all" the help someone might want because that would mean taking more time away from my other students who are doing everything they should. This idea that students can not work and then teachers should swoop in and rescue them at the end is exactly the reason why there's so many a level students who lack the independence and resilience.

I agree, I think the PE btec is a waste of time. He'd be much better off investing that time in his A levels.

If he's good at maths, I'd do double maths, physics and business studies, personally.

It's not just the OP's son who hasn't been doing very well, according to her a couple of his friends are similarly struggling, and another parent with a daughter in that class is also concerned.

In that situation, I'd expect the school to provide extra group lessons for them together within school hours, in lunch break if necessary. It's for the school to sort out.