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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To expect a French teacher to be able to speak french

277 replies

SandyY2K · 09/05/2017 19:34

Why would a school get a supply teacher to replace the French teacher who can't speak the language?

My DD mentioned that prior to her GCSEs last year, they had some lessons with a supply teacher and he didn't know a thing.

Same thing with my other DD. She's mentioned having a chemistry teacher and a teacher for another subject who didn't know the subject and just handed out worksheets. When anyone asked a question, the teacher said they didn't know the answer.

Would it be unreasonable of me to contact the school about this? Any teachers? What do you think?

OP posts:
witsender · 10/05/2017 11:16

Teachers have been saying for the last decade that the situation is unsustainable. Unions have been pushing it. The press, and the vast majority of the public have continued to go on about how teachers need to enter the 'real' world, they get such long holidays, they shouldn't be allowed to strike and disrupt schools etc.

And now it has come back to bite on the arse...in part because teachers are fed up with being undermined, over worked and not listened to.

BinarySearchTree · 10/05/2017 11:42

I agree with one of the posters before - Cover Supervisors don't need a degree or A-levels.

An ex-boyfriend of mine (who has neither, and actually I'm not sure he has great GCSEs either as he was so high all the time when he was at school) was employed as one - essentially just crowd control and handing out worksheets.

He thought he was more than appropriately qualified, and couldn't understand why I felt it devalued the teaching profession and shortchanged the kids.

Kokusai · 10/05/2017 11:51

I don't think this is about salaries - it's workload.

I also think it is about being undermined all the time and feeling undervalued.

Also the feeling that education is not being thought through in a child-centric evidence based manner, and that policies are designed for headlines and vote wins rather than for the good of children's learning.

The feeling of being caught between govt plicies, SLT, parents etc.

Having large classes with a huge range of abilities, SEN and behavioral issues and being expected to cope with it all.

The Govt did a pretty sustained campaign of hatred against lazy teachers and their long holidays. Who would want to work in that environment?

I'm not even a teacher and I can see how fucked up it all is.

Tw1nsetAndPearls · 10/05/2017 11:57

I agree kokusai the Daily Mail has a lot to answer for in terms of scapegoating teachers as workday and inadequate. As does every MN poster who has enabled the lazy teacher discourse to continue

niangua · 10/05/2017 12:09

Well, yes, because language education in this country has been in the toilet for decades, we can't recruit native teachers because we're a xenophobic backwater, we can't recruit ANY teachers because the education system has been defunded and ... well, yes. Now it's touched you. Don't vote Tory. Don't let your friends vote Tory.

My kids are taught by a nice but dim teaching assistant who hands out worksheets and looks out of the window a lot. My son hasn't learned a word of French. We tutor him in Spanish privately, because pretty much if you want your kid to be taught something, you pay.

Tw1nsetAndPearls · 10/05/2017 12:24

The MFP debacle is another ill thought out policy. Encouraging all/more to take a language GCSE may have been admirable but there was no preparation for it. No time given to train and recruit more staff. So we ended up with classes who don't really want to be there with teachers who are not always specialists. Then they bought in the the new tougher GCSEs before resources were made and teachers fully understood what was expected.

Tw1nsetAndPearls · 10/05/2017 12:26

MFL sorry

Lynnm63 · 10/05/2017 13:38

None of this has been thought out. It all started with Blair wanting 50% at Uni when 20% going was working ok. Then the everyone needs a MFL well no you don't really.
My ds was being taught French in y6, he came home and spoke to me French. I replied back in French dragging it all back from my o level 30+ years ago. That's wrong Mum he said, I was confident I was right but as I hadn't learnt French in such a long time we googled it. I was right. I wonder how many kids and their parents didn't know they. In the end I went to the HT and French was quietly dropped.
Im lucky my dc are at a Grammar and they have good teachers and continuity of staff but even they struggle to recruit good quality teachers and I think they get the pick of the crop.

Eolian · 10/05/2017 13:48

It's crazy. Parents get up in arms and complain to the school, but obviously schools employ the best person they can find and afford. Why wouldn't they?

I'm an MFL teacher with 20 yrs experience and now I just work as a cover supervisor and private tutor, because actual teaching is a mug's game these days. I've also taught English (unqualified to do so - didn't even do English A Level) and Spanish (never had a lesson in my life).

Yes, don't vote Tory. But tbh I'm not sure any other party will do much better. None of them seem to understand that they need to actually LISTEN to teachers instead of just shouting about money.

Eolian · 10/05/2017 13:49

Because there are so many things you could do to improve schools without spending a penny.

HelloPossums · 10/05/2017 13:54

None of them seem to understand that they need to actually LISTEN to teachers instead of just shouting about money.

Eolian I couldn't agree with you more. I think Nicky Morgan's 'workload challenge' survey for teachers was a step in the right direction, but it was a drop in the ocean to be honest. Much more needs to be done in this country to proactively and effectively support teachers.

Tw1nsetAndPearls · 10/05/2017 14:03

If the grammars round here are anything to go by they don't employ the cream of the crop.

Eolian schools are increasingly employing a teacher they can find and afford - after that they will consider how good they are.

ilovesooty · 10/05/2017 16:34

In some schools now someone with a pulse and a DBS will do.

Orlantina · 10/05/2017 16:38

It's almost tempting to try secondary...but I am primary trained.

I know there's a massive difference. But can a primary teacher get secondary jobs?

GallicosCats · 10/05/2017 16:42

I was taught O-level Chemistry by a teacher who had never studied the subject at all (tiny independent school, 1980s). So it's not a new problem. It was a miracle I passed.

cricketballs · 10/05/2017 16:57

I'm a teacher at the highest achieving school in my L.A. - we can not recruit! We are lucky just to have an adult in the same room with some lessons

rollonthesummer · 10/05/2017 17:39

tes

A depressing read but an insight into what it's really like at the moment.

Whatthefucknameisntalreadytake · 10/05/2017 19:28

Why don't teachers strike more? They did it in Chicago or somewhere, and because the schools/systems were in such a state the pupils and parents got behind the teachers so it became like a full on community action.
I think a series of strike actions might be the only way for teachers, pupils, parents and communities to make their voices heard that this cannot go on. Our children are being failed.

noblegiraffe · 10/05/2017 19:31

We tried striking a couple of years ago, didnt change anything. Teachers now just quit instead.

When we strike, people moan about how they have to look after their kids and call us workshy and grabby.

Orlantina · 10/05/2017 19:34

Because people think it's about teachers and their issues.

It should be about pupils and education.

MaisyPops · 10/05/2017 19:35

Why don't teachers strike more?
Because too many people seem to view us as glorified baby sitters for their kids and wouldn't support us.

All we get is "it inconvenienced me" but then when their child hadn't got a qualified teacher or a subject specialist then they care.

Because people turn a blind eye and think it won't affect their children, but really it's totally fine if it's somebody else's.

Just like the nurses and midwives, and the doctors etc. It's fine for somebody else, and it'll always be somebody else until it's not. And then when it's your relative on an unsafe ward you care.

People don't give a shit about public sector workers and think we should keep taking the crap. And they only care when it affects them.

Whatthefucknameisntalreadytake · 10/05/2017 19:40

But if enough kids are going home and telling their parents that they are not being taught by teachers who know the subjects, and if the teachers say to the parents 'yes it's true, but we can't change it without your help' then surely grandparents and parents would support the action?
A one day strike will never achieve anything but a prolonged series of strikes must have more of a chance of making a difference than just doing nothing. Teachers still have strong unions, if they all got involved with their unions and took collective action maybe things would change?

noblegiraffe · 10/05/2017 19:44

Teachers still have strong unions

There is a problem with the teaching unions in that there are too many of them and coordinated action doesn't usually happen. The NUT are about to merge with the ATL to form a larger union, but there's still a huge number of teachers in the NASUWT, who don't always see eye to eye with the NUT.

Trifleorbust · 10/05/2017 19:44

Most parents say striking teachers should be fined like they are for not bringing their children to school Hmm

noblegiraffe · 10/05/2017 19:47

Also, we're only allowed to strike about pay and conditions. When we went on strike a couple of years ago, most teachers I know voted to strike because of being totally pissed off with the government changes to the curriculum, academisation and so on, but officially the strike was about pay and pensions, because that's what we're allowed to strike about.

So a load of parents were going 'Education is going to shit and all teachers care about is their pay...'

I don't think I can stomach another thread going 'if teachers can take a day off in term time, why can't I take my kids out on holiday?'