Re the way our finances are separated

[FaithLoveandHope]

So I've never really had an equal relationship before (several abusive relationships prior to this one) and tbh I've never been able to talk about money properly. DP has a DD, 5 from his first marriage. We've been living together for just over a year and currently no plans to marry as he's not ready.

We've tried to split our finances as best as possible - we each contribute an amount relative to our income which goes into a joint account to pay all bills, fuel, etc. Then separately I'm paying for a counsellor, we each pay our own phone bills, he's paying off a loan and credit card bills. He currently takes home 2 and a half times what I do and has 10k plus in a savings account. I have no savings and am -£1200 in my current account. I'm constantly stressed about money and it feels like we're not very equal. In my eyes in an equal relationship we should either both have these stresses or neither of us. We've recently had to move which has cost a lot, we're going on holiday soon (our first since Dec 2015) and now DP wants us to take DSD camping at the end of the month. I feel like I've got so much going out and I'm gradually getting further and further into my overdraft which makes me feel so rubbish.

Also, I feel like I'd be up shit creek if he lost his job or died (awful thought but it plays on my mind a fair amount). We each have quite a substantial life assurance scheme through work which gets paid to our named person upon our death. His goes to his DD. I'd like mine to go to his but then I think what's the sodding point. He can afford quite comfortably our current house if I wasn't around. I on the other hand would probably end up losing the house before the tenancy runs out. We've previously discussed changing it so most goes to his DD and a small portion goes to me to at least get me through until the end of the tenancy. But nothing has ever come of it and it doesn't feel like he even wants to change it.

I just feel often we're living very separate lives. I don't even know what would make me feel better tbh. I want us to commit to each other, to join our lives together but I feel like I'm the only one who wants this. Am I BU in feeling this way? What on earth do I do about it?!

Could we get more detail?

Your salary, his salary, what % you both put towards rent and bills, what % of spending money you get?

Are you expected to pay for your camping trip cost? Do you feel able to tell him you can't afford it?

Is he tight with money or is there little left over when bills and rent are paid?

I wouldn't have thought it fair if it was a 50/50 split given he earns more than you? If we did a 50/50 split then I'd be in minus each month with no spare money

I sympathise, but in many ways I don't think your arrangement is at all unusual for a couple who are not married and who don't own a house together, particularly since your DP has a daughter. I think it is natural that, at the moment, he wants his life assurance policy to be for her benefit. I actually think it would be quite unusual for him to leave some of it to you, given that you currently have no plans to marry.

Would one way of resolving the financial difficulty be to say that you need to change the amount you contribute to the joint account? Maybe the bigger issue is that you are actually contributing proportionately more of your disposal income. You need to retain a higher amount to pay off your overdraft and to start building up some savings so that you have financial security if you split up. After all, he would probably have to pay much more than his current contribution if you split up and he was living alone.

It sounds as though the real issue is that he is "not ready" to marry and to combine your lives financially. Ultimately only you can decide how long you are prepared to wait for that, and at what point you make the difficult decision that he may never be sufficiently committed to you. In the meantime, however, you need to start building up your own fund of savings so that you will always (financially at least) be able to walk away if that is what you decide.

Fire says it very well OP...that's good advice.

In my eyes in an equal relationship we should either both have these stresses or neither of us.

Perhaps. But my financial control is very poor and still has a lot of negative history to it. My DP needs for their employment a crystal clear finanical record so we are not in anyway linked. My credit history is mine to deal with. My financial problems are mine to resolve (mostly by giving most of my money to DP to manage as I am pretty much zero impulse control when its in my account). I get money I need when I need it and can by things that are now thought through rather than just being an interesting shiny thing.

Unless your DP is forcing you to spend money on something you dont want or he should then its not his initial problem to solve that your expenses are more than your income.

We both contribute to household bills relative to income. I used to provide most of it as I was earning a lot more. Now DP is qualified and experienced has been earning more than me for a few years now.

You could ask (which is way different from expecting that in a relationship his money is now yours) if he could help you reduce your debts in the short term which would then help you save. Perhaps meeting all of some of the bills. For example, I pay more for the internet that the income split because I wanted the faster speeds.

So does he pay 2.5 times more than you into the joint account for rent and bills? If he does then you can either move somewhere cheaper, he can pay more or you will have to cut back on everything else. How long have you been together?

I don't think this sounds particularly unusual for a couple that have only been together for a year, don't have plans to marry or any children or mortgage in common. And paying amounts in proportion to your income into the joint account is a way that is often suggested as "fair" on MN. So it sounds like the basic problem is the "other" expenses. If you can't afford to go on holiday and pay in proportion, then I think you and DP need to agree that he pays more or you do something cheaper. Does he pay all of his DD's costs?

Does he know you are so far into your overdraft? Is there a specific reason why you are struggling i.e. are the bills too much or can you not afford the holidays etc so he's expecting you to live a lifestyle you cant actually afford whilst he can?

I don't think its unreasonable that you each pay a % of your income towards bills and that you are each responsible for your own debts. But it's not clear where this is going wrong if you are struggling. I don't think his savings are relevant as these were likely formed before you met and you haven't been together that long yet and I wouldn't be giving a partner of a year a payout from a life insurance policy either tbh.

We've not been together for a year, we've been living together for a year.

He pays 2.5 times the amount into the joint account. Re his DD he pays his ex maintenance and then all other costs come out of the joint account - including recently doing up her room, clothes, days out etc.

Re camping trip it's expected to come out of the joint account. And since I also needed to buy something in the outdoor shop at the same time I ended up paying for most of her camping gear as she had none.

I wouldn't say he's particularly tight, he just never really buys anything so always has lots left over at the end of the month.

I would be totally stuffed if we split up tbh. I couldn't afford to take on our current house and as I'm in negative figures I have nothing to put down as a deposit elsewhere.

I think you're at quite an early stage of your relationship and it sounds like a fair split as you're contributing relative to income. DH and I are married with a DS from an earlier relationship, but we only combined finances fully once we were married. I had my life insurance arranged to be paid for the benefit of my DS before we were married so I think that is fair enough. I think as you are both working and have no disability issues or childcare or other reasons that affect your earning then it seems fair enough. DH is currently supporting me as my disabilities mean I can no longer work so he pays the mortgage and all the bills but that's something that would happen in a longer term relationship or marriage I think. Is there any other reason why his earning capacity is much higher than yours?

purple about half of his savings have been formed as a result of me moving in and for about the first 6 months I lived there we were each contributing 50:50 which doesn't work when there's a huge discrepancy in salary. That contributed a lot to me getting further into my overdraft plus then this holiday - we booked before we found out our landlady wanted to sell up so we were forces to move - and have all the costs associated with that.

If you are in debt and getting worse each month then you can't afford to live where you do. So you need to move. Which means you need to talk to him about moving to somewhere cheaper so you clear your debts. And either he agrees to move or agrees to pay a greater monthly contribution to joint costs. You could also get a small insurance policy to cover his contribution until end of tenancy in the event of the worst happening

OK, it's fair but badly organised. His DD's expenses should ALL come from his money. It's fair because he understands she is special to him (hence the life insurance going to her). You can't afford holidays at the moment. So say that and save the money. If he wants to go, again, it comes from his money.

Even in our house with equal money for everyone (married though so it's different) we discuss what is 'personal money' and what is 'household money'. Holidays may or may not be depending on who is going and what they are.

Talk to him, properly.

In that case you need to tell him that you simply cannot afford to carry on the way you are, you can't afford to go on holidays or contribute towards his daughter. You need to focus on reducing your out goings so that you can clear your over draft and start saving. I suppose it's up to him if he's prepared to increase his share of the pot. What did you do/where did you live before you moved in together?

I do find this strange. We pool our
money, it's all jointly held. We save up for things together.
It helps that we have much the same attitude to being careful with cash.
It's crazy that you are paying overdraft fees while he has cash in the bank.

Ok sorry, how long have you been together?

I would suggest the joint acct money is literally for household bills, shopping, electric, water etc. That way you could both reduce how much you pay into the joint account, you'll have more and he can pay for his dds stuff from his own money. Holiday funds can be discussed as and when. It sounds like the joint account money currently covers a lot more than your bills.

I think that equal disposable income/shared financial worries/being each other's beneficiaries etc are things that would be expected in a long term committed relationship/marriage. Currently you are a relatively short term relationship/not ready to commit (him, admittedly)/no shared children/no property owned together etc. Nothing else in your life seems particularly joint, so I'm not sure that in this case the finances should be joint. I don't think he has any responsibility to support you financially. I do think he has financial responsibility towards his daughter, and that should be his priority.

If you weren't living with him, would you actually be better off financially or worse?

Why is stuff for his DD coming out of your joint account?? That's not fair if you're going to split things like you are currently doing. Either you pool income and then it's fine for DD's stuff to come out of your joint account, or you keep it separate and therefore his DD's stuff comes out of his own account.

It is madness to be getting into your overdraft.

Tell DP you can't afford the current standard of living. Either you need to look for somewhere cheaper to live, or he puts more £ into the pot. Same with holidays - tell him you can't afford to go. He either pays more £, or takes his child on his own.

Why is stuff for his DD coming out of your joint account?? That's not fair if you're going to split things like you are currently doing. Either you pool income and then it's fine for DD's stuff to come out of your joint account, or you keep it separate and therefore his DD's stuff comes out of his own account.

^This.

I would suggest the joint acct money is literally for household bills, shopping, electric, water etc. That way you could both reduce how much you pay into the joint account, you'll have more and he can pay for his dds stuff from his own money. Holiday funds can be discussed as and when. It sounds like the joint account money currently covers a lot more than your bills.

I think this is a good idea too.

He's paying 2.5 times as much into the joint account though. Perhaps he feels that covers the spends for his DD?

I must admit, all the couples I've known the financial arrangements of have kept their finances separate/paid shared bills 50:50 until property purchase, marriage or children i.e. when they made an active commitment to each other. It doesn't sound as though this relationship has reached that stage yet.

You need to sit down and talk to him. Tell him that you know the money split is fair mostly, but that since you've started contributing to his daughters costs, you are in debt and can't afford holidays for a couple of years. And also that the joint account needs to be better budgeted. Do you have access to the joint account?

There are so many ways to work out finances and what works for one person doesn't work for another so it can often be an area of conflict in a relationship.

At the end of the day money needs to be shared, what you and your DP deem equal is up to you both.
But if his savings are going up, whilst you're getting into more debt clearly your system isn't working.

I understand and agree with him that his DD should be taken care of in the event of his death, but clearly you also need some financial support in that event too. Can you take out a life insurance policy that is paid by the joint account, assuming he's young and healthy it's not even £10 a month, could you afford that?

I can fully sympathise with your thoughts, I'm in the same boat. On PIP (and hopefully ESA soon), if my DP lost his job or had more than a week or two off work we would be well and truly screwed, or if we split up. If he dies then at least the insurance should pay out.

No - his DDs stuff is not your expense. That should not be coming out of the joint account.

So he puts in 2.5 times the amount you do in to the joint account and you believe he shouldn't use this money to pay for joint trips (such as the camping), or his daughter?
How much are your joint outgoings and how much/what percentage does each party cover?

If you want the joint account to only cover joint expenses such as rent, bills and food then the amount needs to be readjusted and you both pay a percentage in, even if it means he also pays in less than he currently does as the overall expenditure will be less.

However this will then mean you each pay your percentage of the joint trips out, including holidays. If you cannot afford them then tough.

His savings are his, his money is his. You are not married nor in a long term committed relationship (as defined by the other posters).

My OH and I have a similar income, we each contribute towards 50% of joint expenses. We then keep our own savings, our own private bills (phone, fuel, car etc) and pay a split of holidays.
I pay for all my sons stuff as I recieve child benefit and maintenance. We take turns to pay for days out, meals etc and don't keep track.

You cannot want him to contribute more than the 2.5x to the joint account to lessen your expenditure but still want him to pay for his daughter separately.