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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think it's wrong that Dance and Drama students get so much help with degree costs?

257 replies

Serin · 25/04/2017 19:31

When everyone else has to pay £9000 a year and then living costs.
If the government has money to fund some courses why not use it to fund nursing students?
www.gov.uk/dance-drama-awards

Do we have a chronic shortage of actors?

OP posts:
grannytomine · 26/04/2017 13:47

Devilishpyjamas but she did it and went on to other West End productions. She is only in her 20s so not talking about the dark ages and she was doing the 8 shows a week. My point was they don't have to go to expensive drama schools. They can do drama at university as well and of course music and dance.

My main objection is if its a bursary, student loans fair enough and like everyone at uni if they never make much money they don't have to repay it but if they are a big success why shouldn't they have to repay it? Same for sports people who get grants and then become millionaires and clear off to live abroad and don't even pay taxes let alone repay their grants.

I think the OP is talking about a fair playing field.

TinselTwins · 26/04/2017 13:51

With art, you either are talented or not. Schooling in it is pointless

That is complete nonsense, it's like saying "you're either born good at maths or your not" - rubbish!

You can have all the aptitude (i.e. natural talent) in the world but if you're not going to put in the graft you'll get nowhere, same as anything

FWIW I know a few big names who have had long singing careers since childhood, they didn't always have great voices, they trained HARD and had commitment and drive and the voices you hear today on the radio were LEARNT! They spent all their time outside school at voice training or practicing

TinselTwins · 26/04/2017 13:52

They can do drama at university as well and of course music and dance

How many PPs have to say this: learning the theory of dance/drama/music is not the same thing as learning the trade

KatyBerry · 26/04/2017 13:55

Britain's creative industries (music / theatre / tv / film etc) are a massive contribution to the economy adn we substantially over perform on the global market relative to size. It's something that we are really, really good at and which raises revenue money and generates tourism. You can play the NHS nurses card on just about any expenditure of tax revenue but it doesn't alter the fact that our economy doesn't simply run on nurses

grannytomine · 26/04/2017 13:56

Well learning a trade usually involves an apprenticeship not an expensive private school.

TinselTwins · 26/04/2017 14:00

Well learning a trade usually involves an apprenticeship not an expensive private school. didn't a PP say that there are only 3 touring companies that do this?

BasketOfDeplorables · 26/04/2017 14:02

granny You actually won't study acting if you're on a drama course. You don't have to go to a drama school to go into the industry, but you're leaving a standard university with a degree in drama you might as well have a maths or history degree, or have been an electrician. It's not the same sort of study. Of course people can do that, and do, but you are not prepared for the industry in the same way.

If you train to be a nurse then your degree is funded like every other degree. I would bring back bursaries for nursing, personally. However, if you train as a nurse and then go off to work in the private sector? Do you give your bursary back?

I've worked full time in London in an admin role and not earned enough to pay my student loan contributions. Are you suggesting that the tiny amount of people who qualify for these awards, and the even smaller number who go on to be super rich are the problem with the NHS?

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:06

granny, but do you work in theatre? You seem to be avoiding the question.

I do. I and others who know this world well are trying to explain to you what it's like. Drama school IS where you learn the trade. You can't learn it on the job, not properly.

I worked a LOT as a child. Still went to drama school before I worked as an adult. But don't worry, this wasn't in the UK, so I didn't get a DaDa Hmm

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 26/04/2017 14:08

And every parent and student in the field wishes it was possible to get an apprenticeship! Seriously, no-one on this thread is going 'yay, it's brillo that performing arts training is so bloody expensive'.

What they are saying is given it's so expensive and London-centric, it's a good thing that some very talented young people get a bursary or else they'd be too poor to reach their potential.

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:09

Oh, and I would love to see a comparison between the average salary of a university graduate vs the average salary of someone in theatre. I'm having this row with my ex's new partner right now. She thinks I shouldn't get maintenance for DD because I must be loaded, I work in theatre. Lol.

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 26/04/2017 14:10

And on the apprenticeship point: I'm on a reunion group for a huge bunch of people who trained at a now defunct local arts centre back in the day, which was council-funded and kicked off the careers of some amazing household names (most of them also went to drama school too mind you).

On the back of joining the group I went off to see if that kind of arts centre still existed. It doesn't.

grannytomine · 26/04/2017 14:11

No GaelicSlog and I'm not a nurse either. I know people who do both.

So can you explain why they shouldn't have to repay the funding like everyone else?

grannytomine · 26/04/2017 14:12

What they are saying is given it's so expensive and London-centric, it's a good thing that some very talented young people get a bursary or else they'd be too poor to reach their potential. But why a bursary not a loan?

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:13

Yes, granny, I just did.

Have you seen how much people in theatre earn? I'm not talking major TV shows, huge shows like wicked, I'm talking regular theatre actors.

ShatnersWig · 26/04/2017 14:15

There is no point those of us who actually work in the industry carrying on trying to explain things to Granny as clearly she's never going to get it. She has her fixed position and that's an end of it.

BasketOfDeplorables · 26/04/2017 14:17

They don't repay it because it's not a loan from the Student Loan Company, which is set up to handle degree courses. Lots of conservatoires are now degree awarding institutions but not all have changed over as it is an incredibly expensive process.

Maybe the generation who got free tuition should start replaying it now.

LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett · 26/04/2017 14:18

Because you can't give loans to 16 year olds.

And I suspect that bc somewhere in Whitehall someone has enough of a sense of humour to realise that a hoofer is never going to be able to earn enough money to pay a loan back.

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:21

The problem with people like granny and my ex's new partner is they assume we're all on David Tenant's salary.

The reality is you either get insanely lucky and you make a fortune per episode/film/whatever, which is the minority, or you make very, very little and do it for love, often with a second job on the side. Hardly anyone would ever pay any of it back, so what's the point? Might as well just write the money off rather than pretend it might be repaid.

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:21

Lonny, glad we're on each other's wavelength!

grannytomine · 26/04/2017 14:22

GaelicSlog, no you didn't. The fact that people in theatre often earn very little doesn't explain why they get bursaries instead of loans. If they earn very little they won't repay the loan just like all the other graduates who don't earn alot. If it was a loan then the ones who do make alot of money would repay it, then there would be more money in the pot for the next generation to enable them to study.

BasketofDeplorables, yes we know its not a loan that is why I, and others, are saying why should it be a bursary when for pretty well anything else you want to study you have to have a loan and then if you earn enough repay it.

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:23

granny ^

Aside from sending you my paychecks, I really don't know what more I can do... Hmm

grannytomine · 26/04/2017 14:23

GaelicSong, I am well aware that not everyone in theatre is making alot of money, you are sounding quite bitter. Why shouldn't the ones who make it big repay the money? Why a different rule for one area?

GaelicSiog · 26/04/2017 14:24

The alternative is some kind of government enforced raising of theatre salaries and then we pay it all back. Would you like to pay more for theatre tickets?

gettinfedduppathis · 26/04/2017 14:24

Every council and local authority in the UK has sports centres, tennis courts, football pitches, swimming pools, skate parks etc, etc, all of which are heavily subsidised by the taxpayer.

How many local authority-funded dance studios are there? How many council-funded drama training schemes? How many council music departments have had their budgets slashed?

grannytomine · 26/04/2017 14:25

GaelicSong, you are taking this very personally. Sorry you aren't earning a fortune but that goes for graduates in other fields as well. Can you just explain why graduates of these schools shouldn't have to repay if, I repeat if, they are earning enough?