AIBU to not understand why "normal" people vote Tory?

[olddogsnewtricks]

OK, so I'll probably get flamed for this but am genuinely interested! All the people I know who vote Tory are pretty well off so use private schools and healthcare. As a family we need the NHS and we need a good education system - and I can't see them getting any better under the Tories. Are these just not priorities for Tory voters or do they really believe they will improve even with a Conservative government?

I vote Tory, because l believe that a strong economy benefits all, more than a weak one and the Tories are (IMO) better at creating that economic future. Of course it is not perfect, far from it, but much, much better than the other options.

Not sure how SCARYCLOWN would categorise me in her charming diatribe......Left school at 16, trained as a hairdresser.......not exactly the stereotypical Tory.

Though oddly, many of my self made friends also vote Conservative and all came from poor working class backgrounds, although not a hint of entitlement anywhere, more a can do attitude....

I don't vote Tory, I didn't vote for Brexit and I don't like Trump - thought I'd clarify that before I say what I'm about to say.

I'm getting really tired of the demand or expectation that we'd all share the same opinion. And if people don't subscribe to such homogeny, then they are fair game for the most base accusations. It's getting really very wearing to observe in the media, in my office, in the attitudes of everybody I know.

Needed to get that out of my system.

That's true, headofthehive, but you will find this everywhere. Including, the goriest, except, when they scrounge, they scrounge a lot more. But funnily enough, we always concentrate on the more vulnerable.

Mrs Beamish exemplifies the Conservative Party traditional wing, for me.

Dragon, you can be working class and not vulnerable. Again, just because you are working class doesn't mean you know what it is like for all working class people.

*tories, hehehe

I think when you're not in power it's easy to tell the people what they want to hear because you don't have to actually implement your ideas and demonstrate how economically challenging, if not impossible, they are.

Nobody except a monster would deny that services like health, education and support for the disabled and disadvantaged need more funding but, despite what many people here seem to think, there is no magical, bottomless pot of money to fund these.

Also many people swallow Daily Mail myths. The Daily Mail may be a pile of shite but it's not responsible for everything evil in the world.
The comments section is full of frothing loons just like the Guardian comments sections (when they open them that is)

Yoga...I understand exactly where you are coming from, most want to express their views, without vitriol and hatred, from those with opposing views.....some comments even here are so extremely hate filled.

The media has a vested interest in upping drama to sell papers and try and push its own agenda, we should be able to discuss, disagree ( and maybe even learn something ) without resorting to insults.

Schools and the NHS are ticking over

Are they? Including all the ones in special measures?

I'm getting really tired of the demand or expectation that we'd all share the same opinion. And if people don't subscribe to such homogeneity, then they are fair game for the most base accusations. It's getting really very wearing to observe in the media, in my office, in the attitudes of everybody I know. Yes.

I will be voting Tory. Not because I've read some biased rubbish in the Daily Mail. I'm a Remoaner but it's exactly as Theresa May said in her speech yesterday. I expect she'd rather put her feet up instead of running The Evil Empire.

faffette....l do not proffess to know what it is like for all of any class, we all speak for ourselves, but l dislike the venom from some posters assuming certain stereotypes which simply are not true...

FAMILYSPARTAN...l could not agree more with everything you have said, I am sure many of us have though long and hard about where money should be spent, but it is not an endless supply..

hence my view that the more wealth creation, higher taxpayers and effective company taxation the bigger the pot to begin with....

Boffin, love it - sent it to my son ( he and I are very glad there is none of that awful shaking hands and touching - we were glad of its absence on Easter Sunday......) More seriously the back bone of England and just because we Tory voters may not be shouting out loud about things does not mean we are not there and have massive support for Mrs May.

Tory policies are sensible principles very like most of us manage a home - you try to keep your spending within your means to ensure that you can provide in future and ensure you don't hand over a country with the cupboards bear when you lose power.

Aw, did the tories get offended by my incredibly insightful post?

Sorry for upsetting my masters. I forget one of the basic rules..

dragongirl10
'oddly, many of my self made friends also vote Conservative and all came from poor working class backgrounds, although not a hint of entitlement anywhere, more a can do attitude...'

That's the 'if I vote conservative magical thinking will sort of make me rich' / association with 'what rich people do' will sort of make me one of them eventually' camp.

hth
.

What are your solutions SCARYCLOWN?

Why did that post get deleted? It was pretty accurate AFAIR

'when you're not in power it's easy to tell the people what they want to hear because you don't have to actually implement your ideas and demonstrate how economically challenging, if not impossible, they are'

Its the same in power - in fact the conservatives are monitoring social media and saying what opposition supporters are saying to shore up the reasons why people move away from voting conservative.

This is where the 'we will deal with the economic elites who are ruining the country' stuff came from,, even though all the factors that insulate against the damage of the 'elites' are being whisked away.

In fact what the conservatives are doing is everything they can to weaken the negotiation position of the country's most poorest workers - taking away health care, low wage protection, protection from exploitation in the workplace (massive fees for Employment Tribunal) and an inpenetrable benefit system. This means that people will be more desparate to take on jobs that INCREASE their poverty.

The sad thing is that the tory's ideas of business 'ug, do it cheaper ug' are so unsophisticated that they think this will make the country richer. We have a low wage culture already, and we are becoming the most unproductive workforce in the world (though partly this is due to class-based and outdated management practices as well).

So they are not a force for good in any direction I can think of that improves the whole, or the individual. What they DO do is increase the size of some of the fish in a dwindling pool, but that also increases the pollution.

I always want to know what deleted posts say. I prefer nothing to be deleted. We need to know what we are up against on both sides.

It is by our posts we are known as it were......

there are good poeple on both sides. I may be a strong May supporter but I also think Corbyn means well. He's wrong but he means well and works hard. I hope the left can believe the same about Tory politicians too.

Aw, did the tories get offended by my incredibly insightful post?

Nah, too busy laughing at you to be honest 😭

I don't think either side should laugh at nor be offended by the other. We can respect alternative views. I support May. I think my older son would vote for Corbyn. It makes discussion interesting at home. people are not evil or nasty for having a different solution from someone else to the UK's problems.

I repeat what are your solutions SCARYCAT?
You have a lot of opinions on what the Conservatives are doing wrong and on some you may be right, but what is the solution?

BTW your comment about me made me howl with laughter!

Not read the whole thread but just wondering why people would vote Tory after the election fraud they have been fined for and some 30 MPs could be prosecuted although knowing Torys in the old boys club it will never happen and it will be hushed up.

"Also many people swallow Daily Mail myths. The Daily Mail may be a pile of shite but it's not responsible for everything evil in the world.
The comments section is full of frothing loons just like the Guardian comments sections (when they open them that is)"

This is strangely untrue.

Have you read the Guardian comment section recently?

The guardian comments section seem to have an unreasonable amount of right wing trolls which is very strange for a left wing newspaper.

They also seem to have way too many Putin bots for me to bother reading them anymore.

My solutions:

Tax recovery from larger businesses (hard)
Shaming low wage brands overtly and continuously, including from the ballot box
Making the case as an overall service offer/generic offer for the COUNTRY's development, not one type fighting against another type, ie, If we raise and insulate the performance of the poorest, we improve the business offer and productivity of the whole.
Restrict banker bonuses
Communicate an ideal target percentage of CEO income v. entry level workers - so that for a CEO to increase their income, they need to make the case for the poorest and most disadvantaged workers to have conditions and pay improved (this is the most no brainer - it will dramatically improve business performance, and reduce social problems in areas reliant on big business, low wage employers).
Raise minumum wage
Universal income benefit system - get tons of civil service out of unproductive employment into the world they are creating.
Take town centre and central government expenditure and grants and focus it exclusively on low rent areas.
Similarly with central government funding - spend it on the really shitty areas of the country and city and not just on the main centres
Impose a limit on foreign and investment company ownership of land and property - either by development (say max 30%) or by proportion of whole.
Increase social housing requirements as a result of residentical development to 40% or more.
Take away 'building a family' premiums and culture from our national narrative and benefits system and increase free birth control - when our factories killed people and reduced lifespan considerably, we needed a fast-breeding working class - we don't need one now, its too expensive - build in a benefit for later family developments
Compel Mortgage companies to develop a share-based model of communal property ownerships to a. reduce single person households b. improve collaborative and collective thinking and inject it more into our culture c. minimise single family wealth distortions by increasing clever shared investment initiatives to also gain 'ladder' places. - Also this will magnify the progression of the price of property in the larger properties, which will minimise the 'step up to elite' level activity - because five-eight young professionals might be able to buy a million pound+ house rather than two millionaires. Introduce a national competence exam at age 16 and use this as the basis for filtering into top universities, rather than the application or interview bias.
Perversely, perhaps, I would like grammar and practical schools, but with scholarships both ways - for academic kids who want to accelerate a hands-on career too.