AIBU to not understand why "normal" people vote Tory?

[olddogsnewtricks]

OK, so I'll probably get flamed for this but am genuinely interested! All the people I know who vote Tory are pretty well off so use private schools and healthcare. As a family we need the NHS and we need a good education system - and I can't see them getting any better under the Tories. Are these just not priorities for Tory voters or do they really believe they will improve even with a Conservative government?

The left wing are a wealthy middle class globalist movement who look after their own wealth and interests first followed by migrants, the underclass and refugees. They hold ordinary working class people in utter contempt and view them as thick oiks who should listen to their betters

Absolutely spot on.
Can't understand why any ordinary working class person votes for them.

www.buzzfeed.com/emilydugan/a-woman-who-begged-for-50p-was-sentenced-to-six-months-in?utm_term=.owWvGK7kb#.ue964BbzQ

The "no money left" note was referring to the global financial crisis.

The final years of Gordon Brown’s government were tough. But his leadership of Britain and the G20 at the London summit stopped the collapse of Lehman Brothers triggering a global depression – an incredible achievement Labour never have stopped shouting about.

Oops, I mean Labour SHOULD never have stopped shouting about!

I am a floating voter who has and might vote Tory. As a probation officer I have been treated dreadfully by them when Chris Grayling was (in)Justice Secretary. I dislike that man immensely and would not put him out if he was on fire. I now work for an inept 'Community Rehabilitation Company' and the job I loved and have done for 12 years is about making money instead of helping people and I hate it.
However whilst I don't agree that criminal justice should be in private company hands, Tory governments since I have been born seem to have spent a lot of time sorting out the economy after labour have spent everything. I'm afraid money is what the world go round and even if everyone started off equal, no one would stay that way. There is not a labour government since the Second World War that has left the economy in a better place when they left power and that says quite a lot to me.
They being said, I am currently terrified that there seems to be no credible opposition at the moment. No government should be given a free rein without challenge and I wish labour would sort themselves out to do what they do best which is keep the Tories in check.

It's not just the Tories who cause issues with public services. Labour had the power for a long time to change things and didn't. Unfortunately I do think the NHS is in need of an overhaul as it is a model which just cannot be funded fully any more with an aging population, increased treatment options especially for chronic conditions etc. Yes there are things that could improve it slightly but it really is not a maintainable model. i really don't think Jeremy corbyn is up to the job. The man lives in the type of ideological bubble usually the preserve of sociology students and 1970s trade unionists. Liberal democrats can have all the ideas they like but most are unworkable in the real world. So yes I vote Tory as out of all the parties they are the only ones who I believe can deal with the issues this country faces. They are far from perfect and I don't agree with all tgeir policies by any stretch but there is no real alternative

This thread is a good example of a race to the bottom.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2899819-AIBU-to-think-this-about-working-bank-hols-etc

I and friends vote for them, none of us are rich.

For me, no party is perfect so you go with best fit. I couldnt vote labour after they introduced tax credits as we threw money at people to not work, have children they couldn't afford or to do the bare minimum knowing tax credits would top them up to levels past full time workers. To me, that doesn't help a country it just enables a generation to do very little and then the children suffer as they copy their role models.

There is only so much money to be spent and I went with the party I thought would spend it most wisely and not waste it. Personal preference is what it comes down too.

Agree surferjet. Treacherous.

YADNBU to not understand it, and I don't know why you're getting flack for asking, as you say you just haven't known any lower income Conservatives that felt like discussing it.

Different values, I guess. They "went to a shit school and turned out fine", believe in keeping everything they earn, don't see a legitimate alternative, etc. I mean, who am I to judge? I couldn't vote Tory myself, at least not the way I understand the world as a young'in, but I think that's it. Tory policies speak to them, make them feel that the country is safe and not a penny wasted. A lot of people really don't feel entitled to much extra, and it makes sense for them to feel the same way about others to some extent, that they're lucky for what they've got. What I'm trying to say is I don't think all Tories are malicious and/or stupid, by any stretch.

There is nothing being done about providing homes for all. Houses aren't being built and social housing is being privatised.

If you think the housing crisis started in 2010 your naive, I know the guardian has just jumped on the bandwagon but during the boom they heavily promoted "investments" in the northern towns and didn't give a shit about pricing out the locals

What direct, tangible action will the Tories take to improve things for the person working on minimum wage who can barely afford their rent?

The people working on minimum wage can point the finger at Labour, Tax credits had a huge impact where companies could provide 2 part time jobs instead of 1 full time knowing the state to pick up the tab, Gordon Brown went against his own back bench, not really thinking about the poor then.

Instead of asking the question of what can the tories do, maybe you should be asking what Labour did wrong, the working class are not some homogeneous group that are swayed by the "right wing media"

My dad (a pleasant chap who has travelled the world and works with and likes immigrants) is convinced not only that everyone votes for their own selfish interests, but that actually everyone should, as then that will lead to the best result for the most people. He concedes that could be bad for minorities but in the nice civilised England he thinks he's in, that shouldn't be a problem. He voted Tory until Cameron got in, but lives in a 90+% Tory area.

My experience is many people believe that if you reduce taxes (which benefit them directly, ideally), that it boosts the economy and the total tax take will be higher. Which isn't necessarily untrue, and possibly was true in the 80s. The 'nasty' aspects that we associate with the low-tax party (Tories) don't have to follow at all.

or me, no party is perfect so you go with best fit. I couldnt vote labour after they introduced tax credits as we threw money at people to not work

What, you mean, working tax credits needed as a result of wages being too low. Wages paid by companies.

Tories used to be the party of competency.

Cameron was all spin, omnishambles and poorly thought out policy.

May is showing the glimmerings of competency again.

That may well be popular.

(Labour hasn't been competent since the 1970s. Brown's brief reputation for prudence only covering the period when he was following Tory (actually Thatcherite) stated policies - and his willingness to do that being a key point of the 1997 campaign)

I think people want competency.

This thread is a good example of a race to the bottom.

No it isn't, thats your strawman, your just being hyperbolic

I believe in safety nets in our society, whereas Labour believe in hammocks
This ^

Having an Oxbridge or private education doesn't make you the smartest or "cleverest" person
Yeah, I'm sure the poly in Scunthorpe has many more smarter people. After all, Oxford is only the best uni in the UK (and I think maybe 3rd in the world?)

nor does it equip you to run a country. The last time I checked, it wasn't on the syllabus at Oxford or Cambridge
It does not need to be on the syllabus. One of the characteristics of clever people is that they can successfully apply knowledge to meet new challenges.

The "no money left" note was referring to the global financial crisis.

No it wasn't it was a bad joke, nothing more.

The final years of Gordon Brown’s government were tough. But his leadership of Britain and the G20 at the London summit stopped the collapse of Lehman Brothers triggering a global depression – an incredible achievement Labour never have stopped shouting about.

Whilst you quote a guardian article word for word, it was tough, but he did also go against his own back bench and introduce Tax credits, he also was on hand for further relaxation of banks, so he and therefore labour are still accountable in some regards.

Yeah, I'm sure the poly in Scunthorpe has many more smarter people. After all, Oxford is only the best uni in the UK (and I think maybe 3rd in the world?)

Define clever.

Being academic doesn't give you common sense and skills of judgement. And there are plenty of universities which are on a par with Oxbridge.

So, sorry, not buying it.

It does not need to be on the syllabus. One of the characteristics of clever people is that they can successfully apply knowledge to meet new challenges

Ok, so what knowledge does an Oxbridge education provide which makes one capable of running a country?

Civil servants run the country. The government of the day just chooses the policies to implement.

How are Labour going to make the NHS better incidentally? Repeal the health and social care act 2012? And replace it with what? Start nationalising the private providers (it's not renationalising btw, these are new providers. Some have v.big parent companies who would not go quietly or cheaply)? Bring back PCTs, or step back further?

The health and social care act 2012 was a disaster. But I have seen NO coherent plan to replace it, and the NHS marketplace was a thing before it. Just a lot of wah wah evil tories.

The NHS is a labyrinthine organisation which people working in barely understand the structure. It desperately needs transformation and a sensible conversation about what it provides and how it provides it. Labour have NO clue how to do that, nor do the Tories. No one wants to grasp the nettle and become really unpopular by pointing out the obvious massive issues (which have bollox all to do with privatisation btw and are far deeper and more structural). One of the areas struggling most is primary care, and they're all and always have been entirely private providers. Good luck nationalising them.

I work for the NHS, and at least the tories offer a little bit of stability while those who work for the NHS nationally and locally try and figure out the transformation side of things. Labour would herald utter chaos and in the midst of that, patients would lose out.

People can be "clever " but unworldly and lacking in common sense.

YY Beliveitornot i remember the VERY low wage jobs before working tax credit came in.

Do ppl really think employers will suddenly up their wages by £££££££££ if WTC is stopped.

What, you mean, working tax credits hmm needed as a result of wages being too low. Wages paid by companies. hmm

Yeah, labour could have looked into a different solution rather than introduce *working tax credits" going against the back bench and make the companies pay rather than the state...

Instead of asking the question of what can the tories do, maybe you should be asking what Labour did wrong,

That doesn't help us today though really. We can umm and ahh about the failures of past governments all we want but what should be being discussed is how can this...be fixed? I do find, whenever a question is asked about the current government, its always 'ahh but X did this'* and such. Its not really too relevant what fuckups previous people in power made, whats relevant is what those in power today are doing to sort that out. And it appears to be a big fat nothing.

*This was the same when Labour were in power. People asked what Labour were doing about social housing for example, and all the replies were 'Thatcher sold fof social housing!!!111' rather than an actual answer.

"
The 30 hours childcare thing though I think is brilliant. Have to admit that."

You'll be lucky to see it.

The policy is in serious trouble with many providers refusing to offer it because it was never free - the Conservatives expect us to subsidise it heavily and most providers can't afford to do that.

Providers are going out of business because of this and I strongly suspect that it will be quietly dropped from the Conservative manifesto this time around.

http://www.nurseryworld.co.uk/nursery-world/news/1160425/tens-of-thousands-of-providers-dont-plan-to-offer-30-hour-childcare

N labour didn't exactly help social housing or affordable by their immigration policies and encouraging buy to let.

What happened to their policy of affordable housing for key workers.