to ask how you feel when someone is at the opposite end of the faith spectrum?

[Morphene]

I've recently discovered two separate people I have been getting closer to (professional/friendship wise) are at the other end of the faith scale from me. I have actually felt a little upset and unbalanced by it.

IABU? I mean I know I am, but do other people get this? Does it make a difference if you are the one with or without faith?

I am sure I will still get on just fine with them, but I feel a little sadness that in this important respect we are very far from each others wavelength.

cvbn - PS My religion makes me happy.

That's really not the impression I'm getting from your posts. Happy people don't generally lash out as you have done throughout this thread.

I'm a Mormon who is friends with atheists, agnostics, a Satanist, a Wiccan, people of various other Christian denominations and a Muslim. We're all children of the same God, it doesn't matter what you believe, he loves you anyway. (While I try squaring this with the suffering in the world, and some of the LDS church's more controversial beliefs that I disagree with.) I think being friends with people from other faiths or none at all is a good thing, it helps you open your mind and think about things in a different light.

I wouldn't have any type of relationship with homophobics, racists, sexists or disabilists as it is 2017 and to hold any of the above views is ignorant and shows a lack of thinking clearly and logically about things. Just deluded really.

Same goes for religion. Just an evil cult. I see religion like I see all of the above. So, yes, I work hard to keep all this nastiness out of my family's lifes. Do I try and convert religious people? No! I just make sure we have nothing to do with them. Same as most of the first list... I wouldn't actively seek these people out to "convert them" but when I come across their bile in real life or the Internet then I will stand up and speak out.

I'm curious about the bile that is the automatic consequence of religion. Especially Quaker bile.

I'm interested that there seems to be a bit of an assumption on here that sexist, homophobic, intolerant and generally rather nasty people are the true believers, while the ones who believe in equality, love, justice and inclusion don't really believe in God but just like to do a bit of singing in Sundays.

We're all children of the same God, it doesn't matter what you believe, he loves you anyway.

See this is the sort of (well meaning) thing that pisses me off as an atheist. It's like when someone says 'I'll pray for you' and you say 'please don't' and they say 'yes well I will anyway'. It's like when you're baptised at an age too young to form a coherent thought. It's obtrusive.

I know logically it's just a thing people of faith say sometimes and it has no actual effect on me and they mean no harm, but either we are respecting each other's belief / lack of belief or we are not.

God does not love me because god does not exist.

Halobean, that's ironic. You despise homophobia, racism, etc bit you seem quite okay with prejudice against those who have a belief in God? Some people don't even want to continue otherwise good friendships when they learn their friend believes in God. We see from this thread that some atheists ostracise their friends, deny grandparents time with their grandkids, consider their friends and family inherently stupid all because they feel that people who believe in God are somehow lesser beings. Racism, homophobia, sexism, etc not okay but this is okay?

CVBN, from the beginning I realise Ollie's approach to this discussion was rather juvenile. Moreover, it was clear that she knew very little about what she was criticising. It was never going to be a productive discussion.

Most atheists can't fathom why, after we have gone through the educational system, learn about evolution, study science, become doctors, scientists, etc we still hold on to a belief in God.

OP "It feels really uncomfortable to me when someone says they 'thank god for their recovery' because I can;t imagine feeling that way"

Really key point for me. I was in a major accident and I would say that that is partly why I couldn't make a new friend who thought like this. I was really uncomfortable with some friends views on their faith and my recovery. I also know my parents see it that way but they don't really talk to me about it.

I think there is a hardness to the world that I feel my religious friends don't acknowledge. I'm not extrapolating that to other people btw, just saying my friends don't feel that hardness and it creates a little gap between us.

Thank you Loup

halo, you sound quite bigoted yourself. Do you actually know any Christians? Chances are you know several who just haven't mentioned their Christianity to you. There may well be racist, homophobic ones etc, just as there are racist, homophobic non - Christians. I wouldn't be friendly with anyone who was openly racist and homophobic and I haven't met anyone like this at church. I am part of a congregation which has an openly gay vicar in a town where the only refugee housing has been provided by the church. The refugees have been subject to abuse, but it wasn't from members of the church.

I've been cut off by christians a few times for being an atheist (after conversion attempts have failed). When I was a pagan, being cut off by christians was the norm, as soon as the topic of religion came up. Christains IME cope better with atheists than they do pagans.

I have also cut off a few religious people in my life because they have actually been homophobic, anti-abortion or have held horribly sexist views and have used their religion to justify those views.

Not all views should be tolerated just because an old book supports them.

Generally it doesn't bother me if someone has a different belief to me - I am an atheist.

However, my opinion of a person may change if as someone with whom I once worked informed me that the Earth is 6,000 years old and when I asked where the fossils came from, said that god put them there. Now to me that was such utter nonsense that I pulled back from what might have been a friendship.

I just could not be friends with someone who believed something so absurd.

I also have to disagree with you, OP, re those with religious beliefs being in a majority in this country. When filling in a census form, eg, many put christianity because they were brought up with it even though a considerable number no longer believe. Also I understand the number of people who put jedi as their religion increases every census

Can I ask a question. Is it OK for me not to want to be friends, for example, with Tories or Socialists? Or is that bigoted too?

I think Creationists are less intelligent than me.

Do you mean to sound as arrogant as that statement comes across?

The inventory of the MRI scanner was a creationist. Have you invented anything as brilliant as that?

No, I didn't think so.

Just to clarify, for me it's not a "can't be friends with full stop", it's more of a "can't be besties" and sorry for using suc a word but my friends are my family so if I'm really close with someone I do tend to feel like I want to be on the same wavelength.

You can be friends with whoever you like Bert, but I do think that people who restrict their friends to only those who share their religious or ideological views are missing out. However some people struggle with diversity.

"I think Creationists are less intelligent than me.

Do you mean to sound as arrogant as that statement comes across?

The inventory of the MRI scanner was a creationist. Have you invented anything as brilliant as that?

Well, he was a much better medical
Physicist than I am, certainly.

Bert "Well, he was a much better medical
Physicist than I am, certainly".

But you are more intelligent by your reckoning because he believed in creation. I would still like to understand what your criteria are for determining intelligence. I suspect you are a wind-up merchant.

One of your criterion and that of many other atheists is not believing in God means you are more intelligent in every possible measurable way than those who believe in the creation.

I suspect you are a wind-up merchant. The stuff you write here is just too ridiculous.

There are a couple of types of people: Decent people. Some decent people have religious beliefs, some don't. There are also arseholes. Some arseholes have religious beliefs, some don't.

I favour being friends with decent people. Their views on religion whether they are similar or different to mine will be irrelevant to my ability to form a friendship with them because they are decent.

What does grate on me is the hypocrisy of some atheists who cite the terrible behaviours associated with religious activity, but end up demonstrating those qualities themselves. That's not because they identify as atheist, just that hypocrisy is an ugly characteristic. Being intolerant of other beliefs isn't nice behaviour whether it's done in the name of a God or in the non-existence of a god.

One of the best conversations about religion I ever had was with a friend who was very Catholic and very thoughtful and bright and me an atheist. We ended up agreeing on something that was neither recognisably Catholic or atheist. So, no, I don't understand why different religious/atheist labels should stop people being friends as long as the religious/atheist discussions are be mutually agreement and not forced on anyone.

Sorry for that comment - some atheists really upset me but they are NOT all cunts - as evidenced by the PP

"Why are so many atheists such cunts ? Not all

But so many seem to think it's acceptable to make vile prejudiced comments about
People who have a (quiet) faith"

Blimey. Not sure where to go with this.

"But so many seem to think it's acceptable to make vile prejudiced comments about
People who have a (quiet) faith"

As an atheist that's how I felt about my catholic friend slating scientologists but I was a dumbass and just kept quiet. I have a policy of not speaking against religion because I feel like it's not my territory

Chatting on here has been very informative ( I mean MN generally).

I am an atheist. My best friend is a Jehovah Witness, although not a very good one.

We have great healthy discussions and debates about religion. I find it hard to understand why she believes what she does but she is an amazing friend and person and that's all I care about. Her husband is an atheist as well and we all remain respectful and enjoy the discussions.

As long as no one tries to convert me I don't care. I must admit that in the past I was quite closed minded and would have said I wouldn't have been friends with someone who was religious but I no longer feel that way obviously.

I retracted my comment

It's an Emotive sensitive topic for me-and regret posting that comment !

Forgot I said it