To feel like I've failed and raised horrible children

[Justalittlelemondrizzle]

My dd's (8 & 9) attitudes have got progressively worse over the last year. They have no respect, they treat me like rubbish. They don't listen to me, use my car and the house as a bin, constantly answer me back, fight with eachother every ten minutes and expect me to run around and clean up after them. Today my eldest said she hated me three times in as many hours. My youngest said she was going to kill me twice. I wasn't nagging them or anything I just called them down for their tea.
I really don't know where I have gone wrong, i've taught them respect and they know I expect it. Dh is a pushover and constantly undermines me when I try to punish them. They wrap him round their little finger which then impacts on our relationship. It can't carry on but I've run out of ideas and only see it getting worse if something doesn't drastically change. It's making me depressed and as a result I've started to give up on them and just feel like i'm going through the motions at the moment.
Any advice?

Speak to their school. Usually there is a behaviour specialist who can help out with suggestions for ways in dealing with the behaviour.

runningLou is right. My dd is 8 (nearly 9) and she will get more and more stubborn and dig her heels in more becoming more unkind and saying nasty things about hating me and me being the worst mummy in the world. Really what she wants is to reconcile with me and have a cuddle and sit on my knee. She doesn't believe anything she's saying. She's struggling to moderate her emotions.

Your daughters are still quite little and they are trying to work things out just like my dd. I actually think that what you are both doing as parents perhaps isn't working. On the one hand, your dh is too lax. And on the other hand, you're not doing the "oh I hear you're cross/upset, let's talk about it, I love you, let's have a hug" when they are being vile. I'm not saying do this all the time, but I think you're maybe missing the cues. It is really hard to find a balance and I'm wondering if that balance lies somewhere between what you and your dh are doing.

I think you and your DH need marital counselling actually, you can't come together to agree on a united parenting approach until you can get on the same page with each other and respect each other as having a valid approach on parenting (I say both of you, of course it's mostly your DH's lack of respect for your parenting decisions that comes across in your post). Also, I think the way your DH undermines you is not just about your parenting methods, so often there is more to the picture. I strongly recommend Relate or a similar type of counselling.

Having read the whole of your original post, I'd say Nope. You're not being unreasonable at all To feel like I've failed and raised horrible children

And my dd told me recently she wants to kill me. I did the curious thing (thinking she'd perhaps snap out of it if I didn't rise to her) and asked her how she'd do it and she told me she would do it with a knife. That was one of those times when what she needed was understanding, not escalation. She much more frequently tells me I'm the best mummy ever and how much she loves me.

Norland. That's useful. Any more scintillating words of wisdom

I feel for you OP it is no walk in the park parenting two kids a year or just over apart. I know from experience sometimes my two fight and argue like cat n dog. Mine seem to go through phrases. Playing one off against each other etc. it's blooming hard work not helped by TV on tap these days and umpteen gadgets to hand which doesn't improve behavior. Don't beat yourself up.
Get DH on side.
I know they are behaving dreadfully but your little DC's are in there somewhere try and find a way to reconnect with them both individually.
Do you tell them off calmly and let them know what they've done or do you shout snap and yell back at them which we have all been guilty of at one time or another? I read a book somewhere which said if you lose control they've won and they lose respect or something (I know it's not always easy). Neither is positive parenting. I really like it when your not arguing and both working together to help me empty the washing machine. It makes my life easier and I feel really proud about how grown up your both getting etc.
Stick to your guns and if you say you've lost x now (don't make it forever) say for a day or two days and stick to it otherwise they lose respect for you. If you say something mean it. Good luck hang on in there 💐
PS DH has only started backing me up fairly recently tonight he said to them I won't tolerate you speaking to your mother like that etc. I felt really supported and united and although it's hard it's lovely if your both on the same page at the same time.

Might be worth considering a parenting course , they might identify something you haven't

You sound worn down by all three of them. Go away for the weekend. Get lots of sleep, recharge your batteries, and plan your strategies.
When you return home sit the three of them down and tell them how it's going to work from now on.
They get asked to do something, they do it. You'll maybe ask second time. You won't ask a third time, they get a punishment (your strategy so you decide. Different things apply and work for different children). And tell them all you're going to carry it out with or without their dad's approval so no point going to him.
Tell DH if he wants to be a doormat and let the kids walk on him sobeit. But they're not walking over you.
They don't actually hate you, they hate that you won't let them do whatever they want. If they say
"I hate you" brush it off with a calm "do you" and " too bad". Don't show weakness! You need to be their parent, not their friend.
And ignore their clamours for attention. Good luck OP

They're fine at school and clubs. Like butter wouldn't melt. People comment about how kind and polite they are. Once we get home it's a different matter. I've always been a positive parent. Lots of praise, hugs and encouragement. I still do now and have a laugh with them on the odd occasion they're not being horrible to me. I only punish them when they really deserve it as a punishment would have little value if overused. Maybe I was too soft up until about 6 months ago and that us the problem. Dd1 is highly strung and pretty emotional, shes never been able to handle situations in the roght way and i agree trantrums over who stirs the cake mix shouldnt be happening at her age. Dd2 on the other hand has just become a spoilt little monster brat.

You must have agreement between you and your OH about discipline; about rights and wrongs; about sanctions.

The way to get your children to misbehave and disrespect you is for the two of you to disagree in front of them about discipline. They then do not know where the boundaries lie.

Time for a long chat with your OH.

I used to work for CAMHS - we were always "curing" problem children by this one piece of advice.

It's not a day or stage sarah. It's every day. Every single day!
I have tried family rules/specific jobs. It lasted a day with dd2 and a few days with dd1

PS YABU you haven't failed as a parent it's the hardest job in the world none of us are perfect and none of our kids are either all we can do is try and be the best parent we can be. Keep doing that. Mine can be absolutely dreadful now age 12 and 13 a and they certainly have their moments as most kids do. But two or three years ago I took them to a very small nice local cafe for lunch. We went before they got too hungry and I was giving them both my undivided attention and lots of praise they were getting on and were both extremely well mannered ordering their food and pleasant with the staff. When I paid I got the DC's to wait outside as there really isn't much room. The owner a man said I love it when your kids come in they are always so lovely polite and well mannered not like some of the little horrors we get in here. They are a credit to you. It totally took me by surprise as the whole time we were up town and at lunch I was trying really hard and dreading them squabbling and kicking off in town lol. None of us are perfect.

I think that both you and DH are making mistakes and it wouldn't be fair to blame just your DH.

He might have a point that you're too strict and you that he is too soft.

He might be too soft because you're not and vice versa.

I have just done a fantastic parenting course - I would highly recommend it - it was called "What can a parent do?" by the Family Caring Trust - you can find a list of local practitioners on their site. There were two couples in my group and I really wished that DH had been able to come too - but I have signed him up for the next course. It really made me think differently about my parenting and gave lots of useful ideas for going forwards. It's not a miracle cure, but it is making things better (when I make sure I remember and don't just start shouting).

Dh and I have a great relationship despite this but all this seems to be taking over life at the minute

You don't though, do you? He constantly undermines you and is ruining your relationship with your children. He has no respect for you. How can you say that is a great relationship?

You have a DH problem.

You need to work as a team. When your DH undermines you your children are learning that you are a pushover and anything you say or threaten can be squashed by him.

When DD has been through grotty phases, I've found that ignoring rudeness is more effective than trying to correct it every time. When I say ignore, I don't mean disregard, I mean properly ignore - don't reply or turn round until they speak to you civilly. You will need to explain for a while - "I will talk about this with you when you ask nicely/speak more quietly."

It doesn't help if your partner has a totally different parenting style, so the children receive inconsistent messages. Obviously you need to confirm that it's not acceptable to talk that way, however, punishment can be counter-therapeutic. Your children are evidently 'acting out' about something.Find out what it is about. Would they really want more time with you, for example?

Are you trying too hard to be "perfect"? Your words include nagging, punishment, treat MY car as a bin, running around cleaning up after them, monitoring their eating and playing referee to constant squabbles. Moaning about DH.

I think a little relaxation in standards (not talking about the DC behaviour for a moment) may help. Are you constantly tired because you are doing everything? Leave them to squabble and sort it out for themselves (obviously with the proviso of no physical violence EVER).
It's part of learning to deal and develop relationships and they are past the toddler stage so are able to work things out. Give back the technology and start again. Call a family meeting when everyone is calm and explain that you are very unhappy and want to make things better for everyone because it seems that no one else is happy either. It wouldn't hurt to say sorry either. No one is perfect and it takes courage and maturity to own up to mistakes. If you've yelled, say sorry, you're doing your best and you absolutely love them but you don't always handle things well as no one is 100% all the time. To get respect you have to earn it, not teach it through fear of punishment as that just teaches resentment.
Let everyone have a say and make the other three (including yourself) really listen without butting in or arguing at what is said. Maybe use a timer so each speaker gets a chance to be heard. When you've all done have a good cuddle and snuggle up under a duvet and watch a film together, maybe something funny and start building some happy memories.
Best of luck, it's not easy.

The less your DH does of the discipline, the more he forces you to do it. So you become a more and more hysterical shouty thing while he becomes more and more laid back and popular and lovely. The children then learn that anything you say can be ignored by making you feel guilty and running to daddy to undermine you.

Both of you doing a parenting course and some marriage counselling to get you both on the same page would help.

Justalittlelemondrizzle

Dh and I have a great relationship despite this

Honestly you don't.

Your DH absolutely shouldn't undermine you. No wonder they are so horrible to you, they get frequent demonstrations that what you think is of no importance at all.

This thread has been a really good read though. I have a 9 year old, who has never told me he hates me or would kill me, but he does have an attitude. I shout too much, I know that, and DCs constantly constantly bicker and it drives me mad!!! I have read some good tips here so need to try them. I know with DS he feels like we don't like him as he has said as much and I always reassure him that no matter how much of a pest he may be being, I still love him very much but I think he still thinks we don't like him. I tell them I love them every day, all the time and always give cuddles but he can be tricky to parent and is pretty hard on himself. But doesn't change his behaviour that's made me angry in the first place. There was a very helpful post above, which I've copied to my notepad and am going to try the strategies from it.

Great advice from runninglou.