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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to ask court to refuse ex permission to take DC to Middle East?

38 replies

donners312 · 30/03/2017 08:28

My Ex has made threats and put it in writing that i would not see the DC again if they were in the M.E. with him.
Will a court allow him to take their passports and go abroad for holiday.
We lived in the M.E. for our whole marriage and the DC (10 and 12) were brought up there until we returned to the UK 2 years ago and are settled and happy here now and rarely see Ex.
He has also asked for their both certs so guess he could just order them new PPs anyway?
I am very worried as he has behaved so irrationally and unreasonable for the past two years.
He also pays NO maintenance so how can he afford a holiday if he cannot pay a penny towards their upbringing.
We are all British but i don't trust him to take them and bring them back.

OP posts:

Original poster

donners312 · 30/03/2017 08:29

birth certificates as well i mean.

OP posts:

Chillyegg · 30/03/2017 08:32

Don't give him birth certificates and get a prohibited syeps orser restricting him from ever taking them abroad. If hes actuallh written down or you have proof he said he wouldnt return them then show that to the judge.

Original poster

donners312 · 30/03/2017 08:34

thans chillyegg - is a prohibitive steps order what prevents them getting through the airport?

OP posts:

BarbarianMum · 30/03/2017 08:35

I think you need urgent legal advice. I think it is very likely that a court would agree with you if you have the threats in writing but you need to be proactive in not letting him hold their (new) passports and in getting a ban on him removing them from the country. There are ways to do this but I'm not sure what they are. Hopefully someone will be along in a moment who does.

FlorenceandtheWashingMachine · 30/03/2017 08:39

You need a lawyer today. I don't think your ex has a leg to stand on, but I not an expert. I would not let him have the birth certs.

Things are okay between my ex and I but he lives abroad too. He is taking the kids there at Easter and I will need to write a letter so that he can do it without problems.

There is some Govt guidance here www.gov.uk/permission-take-child-abroad

Roomster101 · 30/03/2017 08:39

From what you have said there is a chance that he would not bring them back so I think you urgently need to do something prevent him from taking them abroad. Speak to a solicitor as soon as possible.

BarbarianMum · 30/03/2017 08:42

It's easy to apply for and get replacement birth certificates. And anyone with parental responsibility can apply/reapply for a passport for their child (although he may find finding someone to sign the photos tough). Hence court order needed.

Vanillamanilla1 · 30/03/2017 08:42

Not sure how my sister did it but she rang the passport office and had a block from ANYONE ( meaning the children's father) from obtaining new passports for the children as she was worried he too wouldn't bring them back

Spadequeen · 30/03/2017 08:43

Shit! If I were you, I'd be getting proper legal advice, not asking a bunch of strangers on the internet.

He's already threatened it, why haven't you done something about it already?

Vanillamanilla1 · 30/03/2017 08:44

What ties does he have in the ME ? Has he family there ? A home there ?

Original poster

donners312 · 30/03/2017 08:45

I already have a court order but he is trying to overturn it. I am seriously panicking now and yes think i will contact passport office now. bloody hell!!

OP posts:

CiderwithBuda · 30/03/2017 08:46

FGS Spadequeen - she is doing! That's why she is on here asking. For advice and support. Why shouldn't she ask on here if she has no idea what to do yet? Maybe she can't afford a solicitor?

Crumbs1 · 30/03/2017 08:47

See a solicitor and ask for a prohibited steps order. This stops him having the right to take children out of the country i.e. The court sets boundaries on what is allowed. Contact passport office and say you have original passports but are concerned your ex husband has/may apply for duplicates and why that is a bad idea/unecessary. Do not hand over any of their documents.

Wishiwasmoiradingle2017 · 30/03/2017 08:48

You can only have one passport. . And there is a service you can register dc on to stop them being taken out of the country without permission.

BarbarianMum · 30/03/2017 08:49

Not wanting to panic you more but are your children entitled to dual nationality? Is there any other passport he could apply for in their behalf?

NameChange30 · 30/03/2017 08:56

There is some useful info here:
rightsofwomen.org.uk/get-information/family-law/children-law-relocation-holidays-abduction/

Do you already have a Prohibited Steps Order? If not you need to get one. And if there is a real, imminent threat of him taking them abroad without your consent, the court can also issue a port alert.

I suggest you call the free Rights of Women family law helpline. They will be able to give tailored advice. And if money is an issue they might be able to advise on sources of free or low cost legal representation.

GreenPeppers · 30/03/2017 09:01

What lol the PP have said.
I would do anything I can to be sure he will NOT be able to take the dcs away to the ME. Much too dangerous.

Natsku · 30/03/2017 09:07

Definitely go for a Prohibited Steps Order and contact the Passport Office. And, I don't know if this will work in the UK but when my ex wanted to prevent me from travelling abroad with our daughter he contact the Border Agency in our country and put an alert on her name so we got stopped at the border (make sure you explain the reasoning thoroughly though)

PoundlandUK · 30/03/2017 09:07

Are you currently in possession of the passports? i assume you are.

First thing I would do is call passport office and explain situation, get them to make a official note on their records that no duplicate passports are to be issued under any circumstances because of kidnapping risk.

Then you get legal advice. Fast.

It's easy enough to get duplicate BCs. Your ex may well have them already.

Original poster

donners312 · 30/03/2017 09:10

Thank you everyone.
He has lived in the ME for the past 25 years (same as me) however he is allegedly now living in the UK.
He is a liar though so i don't know for sure.
He is also very spiteful and nasty and i am genuinely worried he would take the DC and not bring them back he could get a job there if he hasn't already.
I can't afford a solicitor anymore but i may have to just put on CC in this case.
We are back in court next month and i wondered if the order we will get will cover this or if i need a prohibited steps i guess prohibited steps.
I have one email saying if they were in the ME I would have no rights and he would have the children and he would not let me see them - will that be enough proof?
I have CAFCASS (again) so will also explain to them tomorrow??

OP posts:

PoundlandUK · 30/03/2017 09:11

contact the Border Agency in our country and put an alert on her name so we got stopped at the border (make sure you explain the reasoning thoroughly though)

Excellent advice.

EnormousTiger · 30/03/2017 09:11

You said there was an order already? Was that a prohibited steps order prohibiting him from taking the children abroad? If not it would be worth getting such an order.

Even with one be careful as some parents snatch a child and smuggle it out. Do make sure their schools know for example that no one but you or their child minder or whatever can take them from school.

The chidlren are 10 and 12 so probably old enough to be given a gentle warning about this too so they look out for anyone suspcious hanging around outside school who might take them into a car etc.

Original poster

donners312 · 30/03/2017 09:12

I already have a court order and don't need his permission to take the children abroad (controlling twat wouldn't let me go away for a weekend!!) he now wants to overturn that and get one years notice of any travel (whilst he has to only give me 2 weeks - see what i mean an utter idiot!!)

OP posts:

ConferencePear · 30/03/2017 09:50

Are your children likely to want to go with him OP ?
If not you could tell them about carrying a metal teaspoon which they can put in their knickers/pants. It's idea from Karma Nirvana to help children who are being taken abroad for a forced marriage, but it could help you too.

Hissy · 30/03/2017 09:57

The most important thing is that they need passports that YOU have in your possession, this will prevent him making passports for them.

Yes to prohibitive steps, yes to legal advice - could you ask for advice in conjunction with the upcoming court order?

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