To ask my ex for more maintenance??

[Cactus76]

My first time posting here... I'll try to be succinct AND to include as much background as possible.

I left my husband nearly 8 years ago. It wasn't exactly an amicable split at the time. Our DS was 3. As we lived in the same city, he spent time with both of us, but slightly more with me. Because we were sharing care of our DS, we didn't bother with any formal maintenance, I just let him know each month how much I'd spent on childcare and anything else such as school shoes etc and he'd pay me half.

I have a new partner now, been together since not long after the split and now married and have a DD and DS together. After about 2 years we decided to relocate for many reasons and moved to a rural county 2.5 hours away by train. Our DS stayed with me. I felt very very guilty about taking him away from his dad and I didn't ask for any maintenance. Shortly after this my ex lost his job and was out of work for a good 2+ years, so obviously maintenance wasn't something we did. Although we live further away, I always facilitate contact when my ex requests it.

My ex is now working again and has been for 2-3 years. Shortly after he found a job I asked for some contribution and he set up a DD for £250 a month. Better than nothing. So, here's the issue. My OH is getting really irritated by this amount. I don't know what my ex is earning, but I know it will most likely be in excess of £80K. My OH pays his ex the best part of £2K per month in maintenance as calulated by his earnings. He also sees them every other weekend and pays for swimming lessons and other normal stuff (not a hero, just like he should!). If we went down the CSA route, I know we'd be 'entitled' to far more. Although we are reasonably comfortable, things are tight at times. My OH has no issues with supporting my son and he's lovely about it, but at the same time I think it's a matter of principle for him that my ex should be contributing more to his own son. I still feel guilty that I've separated my DS and his dad and know that if we hadn't moved they'd see more of each other so maintenance would be less any way. I also know, for a fact, that this coversation won't go well if I do approach him, he's not the easiest or most pleasant of chaps, hence the fact I'm no longer with him... So, WIBU to ask him for more? Am I being grabby, or just asking a father to do what he should be doing?? Agh!!

[SuperBeagle]

what a stupid conclusion. 2.5 hours isn't that far and it shouldn't stop a parent supporting their child.

The OP herself had admitted that he'd have a lot more contact - and thus be obliged to pay a lot less - if she hadn't made the choice to move 2.5 hours away with her new husband.

There are two sides to the argument here. My conclusion is not "stupid" just because it's not the same as yours.

[Cactus76]

Hellsbells and super - this is my argument too! I have a lot of guilt around this. And this is why I don't know whether IABU!!

August - looking at the CSA / CMS calculator based on my prediction of his earnings / the amount he has DS and the fact the he has no other children, I'm getting an amount of around £650 per month. It wasn't possible to agree any maintenance at all during the divorce stage as he wasn't working at the time. He buys literally nothing for DS other than food etc whilst he's with him and birthday / Xmas pressies.

[August1984]

Actually looking at the CSA calculator your entitled to about £700 per month if he has the child less than once a week, lucky you, mines minuscule in comparison to that. I'd just go through CSA so that you don't have to deal with him directly. People can criticize about the move but if you did it because its a nicer place for your kids etc than fair enough, my Dad drove 2.5 hours to pick me up every other weekend and i stayed with him for weeks on end in school holidays so its partly your ex's choice to see your DC less.

Your current husbands financial strains are completely separate though and definitely should not be used for comparison, £2k a month is so far past the norm.

[August1984]

Oops x post

[Cactus76]

With regard to the amount of contact he has, he dropped it considerably about a year after we moved. He used to have him every other weekend. So, he gets the train to us and picks my son up on a Friday eve and then on Sunday I get the train to him to collect. It's a pain, it's a 6 hour round trip, but it works and I'm happy to do it as often as my ex and DS want to do it. When he wasn't working, we paid for many of his train fares for him to make it possible. But, over time, and entirely his choice, he's cut back from alternate weekends to less than one per half term.

[Cactus76]

August - I agree, what my OH pays is irrelevant, but I think he feels frustrated that he's paying what he 'should' to his ex and their children (and he's more than happy to do so), whilst, as he sees it, my ex is taking the piss, paying well below what he 'should', especially when my OH supported him entirely for so long when he was out of work. As a bit of background, my ex was out of work a number of times when we were together too and because he has such a big ego about who he is, he refused to look for / take on anything that he considered menial work and would only look for flashy city jobs. My OH has always been of the opinion thatbif you have children to support, you do whatever you have to do work wise to bring some money in.

[needsahalo]

Also I just don't think you have any grounds when you've chosen to move 2.5 hours away, thereby limiting contact between your DS and ex. That's a choice you've made; you've got to bear the consequences

the consequences are not that any parent should be supporting their child less than the legally enforceable minimum.

[Mumofttwins]

It sounds like your OH has decided your ex is taking the piss, and wants to call the shots.

Personally, I agree with another poster - I'd only expect half of what I'd actually spent. I'd then ask your ex to pay the rest into a savings account for your DC.

[MrsFarm]

I would have a chat with the ex - tell him that if ye cant come up with an agreed amount then you will have to go to CSA

[Mummyoflittledragon]

So you do one of the trips when ds goes to his dads. So you are facilitating the relationship, which is great. I'd go through the CMS. You moved for good reasons and where you live has no bearing on whether or not he should pay maintenance.

[Cactus76]

Mumoftwins - yes, maybe he is calling the shots! It's hard though as I'm a SAHM so he's effectively supporting two families (his choice, I know!!) whilst watching another father not stepping up to the plate to support his.... I like the idea of putting excess funds into a saving account for our DS! It's hard to calculate exactly what is spent though as many costs are hidden / hard to calculate.

Dragon - yes, we always do one journey. And we moved for many reasons. My OH found an incredible job here, a once in a lifetime opp, we have a fantastic country life which my DS adores, he's not a city boy at all and is near stunning beaches / countryside here and we're much closer to my OH's children too.

[juneau]

YANBU to request an amount in line with what the CSA deems a reasonable sum for the raising of your DC. What he's paying does indeed sound very low and while no, he didn't ask you to buy a 5-bed house or to move to a rural area, he should be contributing to housing costs for his DC. I think you should ask him, mention how much the CSA deems appropriate and see what he says. You can always get more heavy-handed if he refuses to up the amount, but I think I'd start with a reasonable, politely worded request and take it from there.

[Petal02]

If he pays £250, and you contribute £250, so that it’s equal – are the costs for that child covered with £500 then? I would only expect half of the monthly cost of raising our child, regardless of how much my ex was earning – I wouldn’t want £3000 per month just because he can afford it.

Very good point, but a lot of people don’t think like that!

[Sunnyshores]

It sounds as if 8 years of arrangements with exH have been too casual - perhaps it was easier, you felt guilty, you didnt strictly need the money, ex was unemployed for periods etc etc.

But I think now is the time to get the CSA involved and get a formal amount decided by them. Its the fair thing to do for DS, you and your new husband.

btw you dont need to justify what the money is needed for or why youve moved or anything. Everyone has different scenarios, the CSA have a figure set and thats that. Take control of the situation and stop the stress with DH and ex

[x2boys]

tbh it doesnt really matter what mumsnet beleive your ex should be paying legally he should be paying either 10 or 15% [i forget which ] of his wages less anything for other children living with him so for example my dh pays 10 or 15% of 80% of his wages [because we have two children] /month for his daughter from a previous relationship.

[moonchild77]

Bloody hell I'd be chuffed with £250 a month. I get much less for 2 teenagers. My ex is a cock.

[peggyundercrackers]

why are you being driven by your new partner? so what if he doesn't think another man isn't stepping up - its nothing to do with him. he took on your family and the responsibility that goes with it.

all your calculations are based on predictions whereas in reality you don't have a clue what your ex is earning. you also took the decision to move with your child, its up to you to bear the brunt of the cost as that was your decision.

[bimbobaggins]

have you been happy with the £250 a month and it's only now your do is getting really irritated that you want to ask for more.

[MelinaMercury]

Your DH needs to take a step back from this, it's not his place to be annoyed about it unless he is significantly out of pocket and it has absolutely no relation to how much he pays his ex for 2 children and her upkeep.

Try to note all the costs involved in bringing up your DS and half it, you should both be contributing but your ex is only responsible for your son not the lifestyle you have chosen for him so the big house, the fuel, childcare costs are all yours.

As far as I see it you are both responsible for clothing, feeding and school trips/extra curricular activities. His housing, transport and childcare is down to whoever has him at that point in time.

[Cactus76]

Peggy - of course I'm being driven, in part, by my OH. We're a partnership and I'm obviously going to listen to his frustrations. For several years he solely supported my son without a word. He's 'taken us on' incredibly willingly and happily. It's only recently that he's been getting frustrated by the situation.

I have some clue what he's earning. I know exactly what job he does and for whom. It's a board level role for a financial services company and I've probably been quite conservative in my estimations. Even if we hadn't moved and DS was spending 3 nights a week with my ex, he'd still be short by a couple of hundred a month!

[Porpoiselife]

Sounds a bit like you want the money for you, to compensate for the fact your OH pays out so much to his Ex.

It should be for your child. He already pays £250 (his half) a month. In fact that sounds like alot for 1 child, mine certainly don't cost me £500 each as I don't even earn enough for them to each cost that per month!

Plus why should he compensate you for buying a 5 bed house, only one of those children is his!

[Cactus76]

Bimbo - no, I've never been happy and also feel that he's been taking the piss. But that petty nuch sums up my feelings about most things that involve him!! It's just that this has always been mixed up with my feelings of guilt about taking DS away, so I've never acted on them.

[Cactus76]

I'm really not saying that he should compensate us buying a 5 bed house, I'm really not. Honestly!! I only mentioned that as it's part of the hidden cost of raising him. He needs a bedroom and whenever you add a bedroom to a housing search the price goes up. It could have been a 2 bed house we're talking about, but the fact is that we need an extra bedroom regardless of house size because DS lives with us!

[Mumofttwins]

When you mention your OH, you do type in a certain way - but I can't put my finger on it.......It's like you almost feel grateful that he took you and your son on yes, I realise that's not the point of the post, but it's just an observation

You do seem to have been happy with the arrangement previous to this. And £500 per month does sound like an awful lot of money for 1 child. I don't think we spend that on teenagers. And I promise you we are not 'tight' parents.

[Cactus76]

Twins - gah! the joys of communicating through a keyboard. No! Not at all, that even why I put the phrase 'took us on' in inverted commas. Really trying not to sound that way!! It's very much a partnership and we're both grateful to each other for the roles we play.