Why you do or don't believe in God?

[summerbloom]

Interested to hear people's views on why they do believe in God or on why you don't believe in God.....

I don't.

I work with one person in particular who does, a lot. His wife died of cancer and he's so upset, so lost but still finds hope in god. I cante understand it, even just on that fundamental level, how if there is a god, he lets these things happen to "good people". All I hear is (good) adults who die horribly is because it is simply God's will. But why???

That children die of cancer because of their family's sins or similar, it's god's will, everything happens for a reason...How is that a fair and just being that is looking over us? That is meant to love us?

No, I don't believe at all. I kind of get people finding comfort in an all seeing being being in charge of our destiny and things happening at their will, but it feels like a cop out - a way of saying whatever happens isn't my fault, god willed it.

I do. I believe in the three-in-one God of the Bible, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, because I have a personal relationship with this God, and I see His hand at work in all things around me. I know from my experience that God is good; He is love and righteousness.

Or a barbaric slaughtering maniac full of hate, racism, misogyny, child murder, cruelty and revenge.

Depending on whether or not you've read your Bible.

No - I see no reason to believe. If some sort of creator does exist then it's unlikely to be anything that manmade religions have envisioned and certainly is unlikely to require worship. Religion is utterly bonkers as far as I'm concerned and should be held in the same regard as the tooth fairy.

I don't. I don't have faith, and I don't think that faith is something you can will yourself into, or out of.

You either have faith, or you don't.

I do hope there's a God though, I just don't believe there is one.

It's possible to believe in God though, and still reject organised religions. I see people saying I don't believe in God, I don't buy all that religious bollocks.

Which is fine, except the OP isn't asking for views on religion. She was asking about belief in a G/god. The two things are not interchangeable.

Anyone ever played Sims? It's like being a god. You get to decide the character careers, loves, children, personality...then when you're bored you can kill them off.

I went to catholic primary and secondary, stopped "believing" somewhere before the end of primary. I chose to send my dc to catholic primary schools because although I don't believe myself, I do think being good to people and basic catholic values are a decent start. Both my dc chose not to go to catholic secondaries as theu both decided they didn't believe (my son because he discovered dinosaurs and evolution, and my daughter just because). I wouldn't force them to continue with it but did support them any wau necessary until the point they made their own choice.

I don't because there is zero evidence to support it. It's a theory, of course, but with no scientific backing.

I do believe however that god and religion are completely different things. I can understand why people would believe in a god, as a creator of our universe. I can't understand why anyone can take a lot of stories and superstition and base their whole lives around it. To me that justs seems utterly ridiculous.

Nothing says I love you like teaching kids about hell.

Or a barbaric slaughtering maniac full of hate, racism, misogyny, child murder, cruelty and revenge.
But aren't those very strong words for someone who apparently doesn't exist.

MooCahnt
I'm kind of loving all your recent posts...(not being sarcastic)

A priest told me once that heaven and hell were almost exactly the same. in hell there was a long banquet table with lots of food, everything you liked and could dream of but you had really long cutlery and couldn't use your hands. Everyone is miserable because they're trying to feed themselves and can't. Heaven is the same except everyone helps eachother eat so has plenty and are all happy.

I quite like that story, it's a bit like life. Just be kind to people. Some of the priests I've met were just the nicest people ever and even outside of religion, were just lovely. I just usually don't bother bringing religion into anything because I wonder what if you burst someone's bubble, what if they suddenly didn't believe because if something you said, or it made them question something they devoted their whole life to, it could be devastating for them. Those are the people I feel bad for, but it's not my place to feel bad, everyone is entitled to believe in their own thing that gives them comfort.

And if the nice priests torture children they can always pray the sin away www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2017/02/27/pope-reduces-sanctions-against-some-paedophile-priests/

Or a barbaric slaughtering maniac full of hate, racism, misogyny, child murder, cruelty and revenge.

But aren't those very strong words for someone who apparently doesn't exist.

Only in the same way as you would apply them to any fictional character. You don't need to believe Heathcliff is real outside the pages of Wuthering Heights to describe him as a vengeful wife-torturing, puppy-hanging, usurping, murderous maniac. The difference is that a lot of people do believe in the literal truth of the deeply unpleasant Old Testament God.

Strong words based on your God's own words. Seriously is that all you've got? Colour me disappointed.

I just usually don't bother bringing religion into anything because I wonder what if you burst someone's bubble, what if they suddenly didn't believe because if something you said, or it made them question something they devoted their whole life to, it could be devastating for them.

And you don't think that questioning something you've accepted blindly all your life might be a good thing? Or that this person's faith must be a pretty fragile affair if a random commonsensical remark from someone else can burst it so completely?

I find the view that something can't exist unless it's seen, heard, smelt, touched or tasted a bit limited.

Yeah, who needs hard evidence to determine the existence of something.

MooCahnt I have Irish family, I definitely know all about evil priests. But not all of them are like that just like not all non-priests are. But along the same forgiveness vein, there's a good joke. "I wanted a bike for my birthday so I prayed. Then I realised god doesn't work like that so I stole one, and asked for forgiveness."

This thread made me youtube lookup George Carlin...his comedic views on religion are brilliant.

what if they suddenly didn't believe because if something you said, or it made them question something they devoted their whole life to, it could be
It's good that you consider this because most don't. If anyone is ever wavering in their faith then these threads are not the place to be. i've seen so many posters tearing to shreds a persons beliefs, for what aim i don't know. I would be interested to know if anyone has ever doubted their faith because of this. And vice versa, i wonder if any atheists have ever changed their minds after reading what some posters put.

Mortal what I mean is everyone is entitled to their own beliefs right? Just because I think they're bullshit doesn't make me right. So one comment, one question, a small discussion, fine. But trying to sensibly argue that religion or god are bullshit is not going to work because (I don't think) that it's sensible in the first place. You can't use logic or reasoning to argue against something unreasonable if someone believes that much. And really, who cares? Day to day I don't give a damn what my friends or colleagues believe.

But what if you could, what if someone was having trouble and their faith was wavering, and you barge in with logic and it clicks to them, they dig deeper and no longer believe and everything is shattered? That could be horrible (or, they could be better for the change obviously) If it's not hurting you I just don't see the need to try and kill that belief for someone because you don't think it's right.

Mortal but why would that be a good thing, to question something you've "blindly" followed all your life What purpose would that serve and how could it make that person happier, would it improve the quality of their life. If a person devoutly believes in God and quietly goes about their business without preaching and trying to convert people, and their faith gives them the strength to get through their life, they aren't harming anyone. Just what purpose would it serve bursting that persons bubble. What harm is that person doing anyone....and if she's wrong and there isn't a God? well it won't matter, she'll be dead, but at least she's got through her life easier because if the strength of her faith.

I meant to add it seems an unnessessarily cruel thing to do imo.

No. I'm not inclined to change my mind based on what other posters say. This is because we are asked to reconsider based on no more than someone's say so: it is equivalent to my asking you to consider a belief in fairies simply because I have a "feeling" or "faith" that they exist.

I agree with Noodoodle that you can't use logic and reason to argue against faith (though perhaps for a different reason). The devout live behind a faith forcefield immune to even basic reason (the website you posted, Dawn, is frankly a joke - being an actual philosopher myself I found it amusing).

I don't think Christianity is harmless. As far as I can tell, it continues to perpetuate guilt, fear, and mass insanity (like many other religions). I am tired of calls to "respect" beliefs in virtue of their being religious. That's usually a sign they haven't been arrived at by sensible means and don't deserve respect. If you take umbrage at this, then think about the attitude of "love the sinner, hate the sin" - same difference.

I don't think anyone was suggesting they consciously went about trying to wreck someone's beliefs out of mean-spiritedness - I understood Noodoodle to mean accidentally puncturing someone's belief system, by something like, I don't know, making an innocent reference to the controversies about the absence of historical evidence for the existence of a historical Jesus, or the number of other religions with a dying and resurrected god, or something like that. I know I have talked about Frazer's The Golden Bough, Darwin, Nietzsche's 'death of God', and Freud's ideas about religion, as a literature lecturer when teaching various early 20thc texts, for instance. All could, I assume, lead to someone questioning their beliefs, but honestly, if it's only ignorance allowing someone to hold certain beliefs, I don't think I can be held responsible for their world falling apart.

The responsibility lies with the false belief not the fact.

I find the view that something can't exist unless it's seen, heard, smelt, touched or tasted a bit limited
I don't understand your definition of "existence", if it can't be detected.

So, why is it ok for Christians to proselytise (and actually a core requirement on many sects) but not ok for e.g. atheists to say 'I think all deities are bollocks based on x, y, and z'.

More broadly, there is a sense that belief trumps lack of belief.

I don't believe, but am agnostic. I have a kind of softly formed idea of all things sharing a consciousness, I think when your body dies you still continue to exist but as part of this universe. I think when your body dies you become all-knowing because you become part of everything. I can't really explain it properly but I feel we are all connected to all things, rocks, trees, animals. I believe death is the greatest adventure that we'll never find the answer to until we ourselves die. I don't know who or what has created this life, this universe, but I wholeheartedly do not believe in any God of any religion.