To think this rules to apply to "our little darling"

[NootNoot]

Hard hat on & fire extinguisher ready

Went to Kew Gardens over the weekend- gorgeous day, place was packed, lots of families. Plenty of youngsters running about, shouting, having a great old time.

Walking past the Orangery there is a lovely display of small blue flowers which have cropped up on the grass- not bluebells but tiny little meadow flower type things. Signs every 5-10m saying "these are part of our meadow collection, please stay off the grass". Small child aged about 3, running up & down through the flowers, stamping on them, picking them etc. Parents looking on indulgently, taking photographs etc.

Middle aged man with a rather fancy camera (looked like a realy Kew enthusiast) lost his shit with the parents- pointed out the child was destroying the flowers, clearly states keep off grass etc etc. Parents just smile benignly & said "oh but she's having so much fun"..

I appreciate toddlers can be tricky/wilful etc but for the love of god that surely isn't an excuse to trash the place? There's tonnes of "plain" grass areas to run about/pick daisies etc. FWIW we crossed paths with them later on & the father was watching the child pulling petals off the magnolia trees!!

NoMessing' that shouldn't have happened but was easily avoidable if you had told your toddler beforehand and n a fitting manner.

Nomessin - to be sure, she should have directed her ire at you, not the child (assuming you weren't already actively trying to prevent your child from doing this)

It is fine and dandy to insist that you are the only one who tells your child off - as long as you actually keep an eye on them for any bad behaviour, and tell them off for it!

If a parent is just watching their child destroy the flowers and doing nothing, it is not entirely unreasonable to assume that they are not going to tell their child off for this - so telling the parent is likely to be less effective than telling the child.

Couple of people asked question in their replies

Did we back the old man up- we were a party of 6 & 2 of us did back him up yes- pointing to the sign RIGHT in front of the parents.

Someone commented on being more unhappy with the man losing his shit...I should probably clarify, he shouted/spoke loudly (from other side of the flower patch) "excuse me, your child is damaging the flowers, can you take them off"...when he got the "oh but she's having fun" he replied "I don't care, she's breaking all the flowers"...he never once swore/threatened/was aggressive. He was going an awful shade of red with rage & when they walked away he muttered about "bloody spoilt brat" to our similarly-aged party member.

He was going an awful shade of red with rage & when they walked away he muttered about "bloody spoilt brat" to our similarly-aged party member

And he was absolutely right!!

On the subject of telling off other children, I am dismayed her this doesn't seem to be OK anymore. If I have not seen my children doing something dangerous or that would impact on others I'd rather someone else stopped them than they just carried on. Even more it annoys me when the parents have seen but don't do anything. My DC go to swimming lessons and recently a child waiting with his mother for the next lesson while our lesson was going on repeatedly pressed the shower button. Unfortunately the pipes made a horrible noise each time, loudly enough that the teacher had to repeat himself and raise his voice. His mother did nothing although she could clearly see what was happening. I went over and explained that it was making a noise that was disturbing the lesson, please could he stop? No shouting, not rude. He says yes, he sits down with her. She is furious but won't speak to me about it, just shoots daggers at me and speaks loudly about the nasty lady telling him off, how rude she is!

I also complained to Wakehurst (Kew Gardens in Sussex) about their no scooter rule. This was when DC were too little to walk far and scooters made a day out more possible. I was genuinely aghast that some parents would let their children scoot over plants - the reason for the rule. (The paths there are very wide and not busy so considerate scooter use would be possible, but clearly in their experience doesn't happen, leading to a rule that I realise was necessary but the previous poor behaviour of others spoiled our day as we didn't know about it in advance.)

People take umbrage if you ask them politely to stop petting and feeding the deer in the local park.

If i see children hitting fish tanks in shops i will tell them off if the parent doesn't. I remember being in a Maidenheads aquatics that have foot height aquariums (god knows who thought that was a good idea!!! Obviously little kids were running up and down kicking them. They get a "your giving the fish a headache"
I am also pretty quick to interject if they are doing something to harm animals. I would have no problem arguing it with the parent. The chick story is heart breaking.
Generally I find a stranger telling them off has more impact than the parent. Unless they really are defiant little ones! It is more difficult approaching them if the parent is there and doing nothing though.

KERALA1 Tue 28-Mar-17 21:54:07

"We were at a Jewish holocaust memorial exhibit in Berlin Dd 2 was standing quite close so I warned her not to get too close. The elderly Jewish attendant came over, took dds hand and said "come walk with me" and walked her gently across the exhibit which he said was supposed to be interacted with. Very moving."

Was it this? An amazing piece. The whole museum was amazing. We went about 12 years ago and I thought all of the memorials were amazing.

Last Spring DD2 (then 5) picked a flower in an open air museum. I told her off and explained the the flowers are for everyone to enjoy, and in any case don't belong to us and it's stealing.

Half a minute later a (now ex-) friends DS picked several flowers and handed then to DD2; he's heard my lecture talk so I made her drop them by the path as we were not taking stolen flowers.

Ex-friend told me to lighten up. It's only one of a myriad reasons why I no longer see her, but her children are very 'free range' including chasing ducks/pigeons and with exuberant play hitting my DDs

I recently took DDs to a NT property. They did climb a tree, but it's in the NT book '50 things to do before you're 11 3/4' so it serves them right. We also rolled down the slope to the croquet lawn rolling down hills is also in the book We did not pick flowers and DDs maintained a respectful distance from the lambs.

And because it's a great photo. DD1 had the worthy lunch of brown bread and water...

Tesco recently - an 11 year old boy was sitting in the trolley - when someone from the shop opined that the trolley perhaps wasn't configured to take a full sized secondary aged pupil, the father flew into a rage and subjected the poor cashier to a 2 minute rant. I dread to think how that child is going to grow up. Needless to say he also ate a packet of crisps, a chocolate bar and drank a Capri Sun, the remains of which were then scanned at the check out. Boundaries, anyone? I bet he's an absolute delight to teach, and the parents fully support the school's disciplinary code...or perhaps not.

It takes a village to raise a child when it suits, but obviously this doesn't seem to include being able to tell a child their behaviour isn't suitable when the parent is clearly incapable.

It was Sarf! Incredible how art encapsulated the horror

While we're on the subject, can I add dads it's always dads encouraging their offspring to dive bomb into swimming pools full of people quietly swimming lengths and minding their own business to the List of Shame ?

Awful parenting.

I blame people who think they know about gentle, psychologically aware parenting because they've read some huffpost crap and some face book memes. Half of which are wrong.

1. You still have rules. You don't shout or smack but you are teaching respect so... teach respect.
2. If you subscribe to the completely-child-led-play idea, take your child to somewhere where they can lead themselves in play safely and without damaging nice things. Parks, your own garden etc. Not Kew or shops.

Angry angry angry crunchy mum who works hard at crunching and hates it when others give us a bad name.

Riceuten I did once have a member of staff shout across that my then 7 year old was too big to be in the trolley ( seat that is not the basket bit). I was pissed off about that since he is disabled and the store didn't have bigger alternative. I didn't shout back but did complain to customer services who were apologetic.

When I was at school aged 15 and a classmate proudly brought in a letter for the teacher. He told us that because his dad had forgotten to buy ham, he would be having school dinner today. I was as I'd never heard this before as in my house, we would just have something else and another classmate said "Wasn't there anything else you could have had instead?" He said no, "I always have ham. I don't do any other sandwich fillings."

He had no allergies/disabilities - he was just indulged horribly. To the extent of talking during assembly and being allowed to watch 18 films at the age of 10.

I do agree that we have lost the "It takes a village mantra" and replaced it with "I do what I want, when I like and to hell with everyone else."

DM worked in a supermarket about 15 years ago that was in a working class area but also between the grammar and prep schools and the posh housing. While kids will be kids, it was the moneyed customers who were the nightmare with nothing more effective than, "Please don't do that darling!" which of course "darling" ignores.

Best one was pre-scanners, a child kept pressing the till buttons while DM was putting through her trolley. Every time the kid did it DM had to cancel that out. Again and again and again. DM finally turns to the mother, who's been ignoring her child, to say, "I could put this through quicker if he left my till alone". Woman looks at DM, then at her brat, and goes back to packing so kid continues. Next time they were in the shop with a trolley they walked past DM's till and the mother said loudly, "Oh, we don't want to go to that till, she's a sarky bitch!"! DM was

what sort of person thinks this is ok?

What sort indeed, Kelpeed?

I just hope I'm not unfortunate enough to meet any of them in a dark alley anytime. Sometimes I think we are raising a nation of thugs.

Awful behaviour of the child mentioned by the OP. For those who have not been to Kew Gardens, below is a photo I took last year.

Thank you also to SarfEast1cated for the photo from the Jewish Museum in Berlin. Unrelated to the thread in a way, but still appreciated.

I'm a fish obsessive and the thing that totally boils my piss is when kids bang on the glass in aquariums or pet shops. It traumatises the animals. I've taken to speaking up and have been the recipient of many a pissy retort from parents. Wankers.

You're very welcome Forallthesaints. Your holly made me laugh, Kew would be much less popular if it was planted only with spiny plants :D

Many years go, MrsFring, I tapped on the side of a vivarium containing a motionless and rather boring and possibly dead pit viper.

The effing thing shot at me so fast I nearly wet myself and jumped back, twisting my ankle (KARMA!)!

If there hadn't been a 1/4" plate glass between us I would have been writhing in agony and probably dead before the (Italian) ambulance got to me. Serves me right!

Never tap on fish glass, though - I like fish and worry about them. (I used to have a "rescue" goldfish that I bullied a friend into handing over to me. Poor thing was is two inches of filthy water in a BOWL on top of her freezer - I couldn't even see it and had to ask what was in there. She took some persuading, but finally gave him to me, and he went into our 6' tank with the other three - had him many year. We are now down to two, both f which we've had for over a quarter of a century, though one of them is now completely silver (used to be orange))

Excellent, good for you!

Those parents are shitlords of the highest order. I would have gone off and got a member of staff.