To feel for my friend who is very anxious about how she will afford twins.

[BobDylansUnderpants]

My friend is due twins in the next few months the and she is beside herself with worry about how her and her DH will cope financially. She would never have aborted as that was never an option for her for religious reasons.

She lives in what i would consider a small house with her DH and 2DCs. The DCs share a room and there is a small box room which would just about fit a single bed. The fact her house is too small is the least of her worries.

She says she just about can manage the mortgage payments and living costs with just the 4 of them and has little left over for savings. They hardly go on holiday and live within their means.

She is really worried about how she will manage with paying for the gazillion nappies, milk, baby clothes every few months and the general cost of kids.

She told me that she has just missed out on tax credits which she won't get anymore for the twins as the government only pay for 2 kids. She could have got an additional 5k a year which she says would have really helped alot. ( Not sure if the figure is correct)

I don't really know what to suggest for her and wondered if anyone has had similar experience of unexpectedly having lots more kids and how you managed financially. It feel such a shame that the government have stopped the tax credits as it would have really helped her family and no doubt others in similar circumstances.

I don't know if your friend has tax credits already but if she doesn't it may be worth applying once the babies are born.

They may give an increased WTC element with four children even if they can't give the increased CTC element.

Also get her to look on the Turn2us website. If she claims housing benefit she may be entitled to additional help.

There are also a huge amount of grants available online, she just needs to find one which is applicable to her circumstances.

Bear in mind, the twins may arrive early. I'm not sure of her due date or the exact cut off date in April. But if the worst happens and they are prem then she may be able to claim. I hope that doesn't happen but it's worth remembering if it does.

I'm always surprised by the number of people that believe contraceptives are 100% effective. Although i thought the MAP was, turns out not!

I assume she can't be getting housing benefit as OP said they had a mortgage.

Thanks for thoughts on eBay wando I think I would prefer to just buy super cheap basic stuff than pay delivery, not being sure what I'm buying etc (pondering for myself as well as just discovered we are expecting the unexpected #3). I remember some primark stuff lasting beautifully through both my DCs, bright colours lasting etc. TBH it's all going to get poo, wee and vomit all over it anyway no matter where it comes from. Not that I'm averse to second hand of course - these days both my DCs are dressed pretty much entirely from hand me downs from friends and charity shop bargains - just not sure it's worth the effort of scouring eBay, bidding etc.

I think she's exempt from the new rules due to multiple births

If you have mum2mum sales by you they ate crazy cheap for some stuff, can find details on FB. Clothes, equipment, toys.
Start saving the older kids stuff now ready for several years time.

I'm surprised and saddened by some of the responses on here. I'm sure I'm not the only person who left their first scan relieved to not be having twins as they must bring a huge amount of pressure (particularly when you know what having one baby is like). I also know quite a few people who had unplanned babies; capable, sensible people. Society is moving towards some rather Victorian attitudes of deserving and undeserving poor. What kind of society punishes children for the sins of their fathers?

Aldi nappies and wipes. I've been buying weekly, £1.15 a pack of newborn and the wipes work out at about 50p a pack. Great quality

I feel for your friend OP. While I don't have much advice, Definitely join facebook, and I guess try and think of it as a few years and things will be easier after that. And to all the 'suck it up' posters I hope you never need sympathy from others because life hadn't gone exactly as planned.

She should definitely check with tax credits in case they are exempt. they have an online chat service.

It's a tough one because it's awful to be so worried about money.

However, as harsh as it sounds, I agree with those who are saying that it's not the government who will be pushing her into poverty.

Accidental pregnancies obviously do happen, but she had the tough choice whether to continue with the pregnancy or not.

She chose not to terminate due to religious reasons, so I'm wondering if her place of worship may be able to help/advise?

The exemption for multiple births is if your second child/pregnancy is a multiple birth. The changes come into effect on 1 April so unless she has them this week she is out of luck.

This has been coming for a while now but no one raised much of a flap above it so it must have quite a bit of support. Tories don't U-turn without major objection, I mean, UC is still being ramrodded through even though it's resulted in a serious problems where it's been rolled out.

Wow first posters t the thread making the usual shit comments, please OP ignore them, what some people are willing to say anonymously just shows what twats they are!

Help your friend to think practically.

"She is really worried about how she will manage with paying for the gazillion nappies, milk, baby clothes every few months and the general cost of kids."

It's possible she will be able to buy non-disposable nappies quite cheaply and this will be cheaper and also more environmentally friendly.

As others have said breast feeding is free and although it is not always easy to get started once you are it is much easier than doing tons of bottles. I know because I was a mother's help for a woman with twins who did all the sterilizing of bottles etc but when I had my own baby I breast fed and it was tons easier.

I'm still making my way through the thread so I expect someone else has mentioned TMABA

www.tamba.org.uk/support-menu

As well as the national organisation there may be a local group so you can buy multiple items from them in their sales or by contacts in the group and can also sell items on in the same way.

Maybe these babies will grow up to be surgeons and perform life saving surgery on some of the numties on Mumsnet who say mean things.

No one should be made to feel guilty or bad for having a bad, whatever the circumstances.

But making sure there are no more pregnancies needs to be part of her and her husband's plan for the future if they wish to avoid the worry.

o one should be made to feel guilty or bad for having a baby, whatever the circumstances.

expatinscotland "Can you host a baby shower for her? Or start a whipround among other friends for large ticket items?" What a great idea.

Cheby "However, we did have a back up plan and we were careful not to have an unplanned pregnancy. If I got pregnant accidentally after this baby is born, for the sake of out existing children we would more than likely make the difficult decision to have a termination. Your friend had this option open to her, and has chosen not to take it."

No, actually not all people have this option open to them. The fact they may be able to have a termination doesn't mean it is an option open to them. Because as you rightly say "Now of course no one should ever feel like they have to have a termination when they don't want to."

So for that exact reason it is not an open open to them.

Just as taking my mum to Switzerland was not an option open to me when she got dementia.

I would much rather live in a country that support children and ends poverty and allows children to grow up to be part of the best country we can be. Sadly, I don't think our government wants this but hey ho, I didn't vote for them.

It's easy to sit on your high horse and say 'it's easy to not get pregnant' and 'they should have been more careful' if you've never had an unplanned pregnancy.

It can and does happen though. Our DC are 7 and 9. We were done. We were ridiculously careful, double up on contraception. Never had any contraceptive failure s. Plus we don't usually fall pregnant easily and tried for over a year with ds2.

I'm now 7 months pregnant with dc3. We did about five tests and could not take in how I was possibly pregnant. I was so convinced I went to the GP for blood tests/early scan because I was sure I had one of the horrible and rare illnesses that mimic pregnancy hormones. Nope, just pregnant (and the GP thought I was a loon but that's how convinced I was that there was no way we could have conceived).

It also irritates me how easily people sling the 'she could have aborted' line around as if it's of no more consequence than disposing of an unwanted handbag. Abortion would never be an option for us and planned or not a pregnancy becomes our child from week 1. Maybe the op's friend is the same and,like us,just has to deal with having another child (or children) in the best way she can.

Of course she's worried, that's natural...Huge lack of empathy on this thread though.

Well said Peridot, and congratulations on your pregnancy.

londonrach "If you cant afford it why have children? Maybe im old fashioned but my dd my problem."

I think you are old fashioned. This is how it has been for much of the world for much of human history and how it is for much of the world now.

Kind of dog eat dog.

You may be happy with it, but I don't want to live in that sort of place. Of course ideally people will look after their own kids, but we all need help sometimes.

The country limiting number of children getting assistance in families may well make the population go down. As immigration goes down too, I think it will now due to other factors.

I do wonder who is going to be doing all the work to pay tax for all the pensioners in the future, and who is going to do all the caring professions etc as well.

Thanks Babyroobs! It took us a couple of months to get our heads around it but very excited now

All the best with your pregnancy PeridotPeridot.

Really feel for her. What a nightmare. She is just going to have to muddle through.

Agree that she should put the word round everyone she knows re being interested in any hand-me-downs. Religious charities should help her, and also her local religious leader needs to know in case there is anything they can offer. I had a friend whose child got money for a hobby they loved by making an application to the local community chest (I had no idea this existed). Our bishop has some charitable funds that are given out according to his discretion I think.

At least if the box room will take a single bed, it presumably will take bunk beds in the future?

I would also suggest that she goes to the GP to talk about long-term contraception solutions, e.g. presumably she could be sterilised when the twins are born? But I would be careful who I said that to, I have to say.

I won't say anything about the tax credits policy other than that I thoroughly disagree with it but many people do agree with it as on this thread, and it's not going to change.

Really feel for your friend, OP. I feel it is sad that what should be a time of joy, the arrival of a new baby, in fact twin babies, is seen as a time of dread of poverty.

I am very uncomfortable with a law that makes babies the prerogative of the rich. I dislike the idea that there is a 'two child' policy for poorer people, or for those of us who do not have rock-certain job security. A certain tory MP and his wife seem to be constantly producing babies, are they doing this to show that their millions means they can?

There are quite a few blogs out there, too, on YouTube that might help.

The IKEA hacks ones are terrific, too, for the future, if they need to stay in their house and make it work.

There's time yet for them to sort some things out.

But the policy won't change. As I said, just wait till UC gets rolled out everywhere.

Expat- When people have to switch to UC, will it be the case that those who already are claiming for more than 2 dc will continue eing able to do so ?

sweets101 I'm always surprised by how many people think that contraception failures are commonplace when used correctly. The truth is that most contraception failures are from not using it correctly and consistently. Using the pill/iud plus condoms and/or pull out method or the pill/iud/condoms plus vasectomy etc. would mean it is near impossible to conceive. If you really don't want another child then you need to conscientiously use more than more method. You're correct that the morning after pill doesn't always work but as it's effectiveness is reduced if you are overweight, then if you are overweight you need to be aware of that.

OP I sympathise with your friend, I too would not want to have an abortion so I can see how going ahead is the best decision for her. I think all the advice I have has been covered so I'll just send my best wishes and to her.