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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Muslim prayers

426 replies

Amibeingtoosensitive · 14/03/2017 19:11

My DD (9) had R.E today
They were learning about Muslim prayers. All fine.
They then went on to get prayer mats and say a Muslim prayer, with their shoes off, on their knees as a group.

AIBU to feel uncomfortable about my DD being made to do a religious practice we do not believe in.

OP posts:
Jazzywazzydodah · 15/03/2017 11:27

seagazer as I keep saying my family are Irish Catholics and have first hand experience of shocking treatment towards women and children which lead to me researching the history of horrific treatment to Them on a huge scale, you clearly have no idea what they did and the repercussions that are still apparent.

Let's not turn this in to a Muslim verses catholic thread hey?

Original poster
Amibeingtoosensitive · 15/03/2017 11:28

I'm going to be chasing the headmaster about a change in policy, where parents can be consulted and given an option to opt out of lessons where children are made to participate it religious practices such as this.

OP posts:
BarbarianMum · 15/03/2017 11:33

I also have Irish Catholic family Jazzy And I get really upset and angry when people talk about Christian abuses of women as if they were something from ancient history. These women are still alive - and where not, they bloody should be Sad.

ChippieBeanAndHorro · 15/03/2017 11:37

These women are still alive - and where not, they bloody should be

My family is Italian/Swiss Catholic. I know quite a lot about the history of religious institutions in Switzerland (to be frank, the state has done worse things in the last 100 years than the various religious institutions combined) and I don't know a lot about Italy. Shpuld probably do some research...

seagazer · 15/03/2017 12:01

Jazzy no let's not but the thread wasn't about catholics was it? Somebody else, not sure who, brought catholics into it for some reason? and i do know the horrors that were inflicted on catholic women only too well. Thankfully we've moved on from that, (as far as i know catholic priests aren't stoning women to death for adultery )not so the horrors that are and still are inflicted on muslim women in this the 21st century. So can we stick to the subject and leave catholics out of it.

seagazer · 15/03/2017 12:05

Barbarian me too, but we aren't talking about that. Start a thread about it?

Alfieisnoisy · 15/03/2017 12:19

To be honest OP, I think your next action should be to ask the school to find an alternative way of educating the children about the aspects of each religion.

You don't need to stop them educating about various faiths as part of RE but they do need to look at HOW they do this.

Terfinator · 15/03/2017 12:27

A little off-topic, but...

There's no such thing as a Muslim/Catholic/Jewish/Jedi child. You cannot consent to being religious until you're an adult. Would you judge the same children by their parents' political beliefs and call them right-wing children?

notaflyingmonkey · 15/03/2017 13:18

So, a parent objects to their child learning about Muslim prayer, and the school apologises.

What a sorry state our education system is in when a child's learning in order to promote understanding and tolerance becomes a problem for people.

Original poster
Amibeingtoosensitive · 15/03/2017 13:29

So, a parent objects to their child learning about Muslim prayer, and the school apologises

No, I complained about them participating in Muslim prayer. I'm happy for them to learn about it.

OP posts:
Jazzywazzydodah · 15/03/2017 13:30

This isn't a Muslim bashing thread either seagazer but for every negative example you could give me about Islam to women I could give you one about Catholics. It wasn't to long ago when the church stole thousands of children and sent them to work in horrific situations, murdered and raped. There families back at home being told they had died whilst in care. Priests rapping women in their care and burying women who died 'suspiciously' in unmarked graves. I'm out now, just popped on but can enlighten you properly what happened later if you like, It was only a few years ago....

It's splitting hairs love.

IamFriedSpam · 15/03/2017 13:33

No, I complained about them participating in Muslim prayer. I still don't get why you care. They clearly weren't converting the children to islam they were just acting out what a muslim prayer would look like. Lots of schools say grace before lunch times too would you complain about that too?

greenworm · 15/03/2017 13:35

I think it's a good thing for them to learn about other religions and what the practice of prayer involves, but it seems wrong on multiple levels to actually have them replicate/pretend to do/participate in the actual religious acts themselves. Whether it's Holy Communion, Muslim prayer, confession, whatever. It seems disrespectful to the religion and the children.

Original poster
Amibeingtoosensitive · 15/03/2017 13:55

Lots of schools say grace before lunch times too would you complain about that too?

Yes!! Because that is another religious practice being forced on my children. This isn't about Islam as some posters are trying to suggest

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 15/03/2017 14:01

"Lots of schools say grace before lunch times too would you complain about that too?"

Well, if my child was at a faith school, then no. But the whole idea of faith schools is iniquitous. So my complaint would be more general.

seagazer · 15/03/2017 14:07

Jazzy but it seems to be a catholic bashing thread with you. Or is that ok. Catholic women had a hard time in Ireland, especially with the nuns and priests. Enda Kenney made a public apology, too little too late. But me referring to the muslim "anti women" stance is muslim bashing? do me a favour.
Yes the treatment of Irish women was atrocious and yes it was only in the very recent past but it doesn't go anywhere near what's happened get to many muslim women today. Do you not know what goes on in Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan etc. Go and read about it then come back and tell me catholic women in Ireland are faring worse. But try not catholic bash.

BertrandRussell · 15/03/2017 14:13

Happy to Catholic bash. And Muslim bash. In fact, happy to bash any reactionary, misogynist organization. Particularly ones that shield paedophiles.

I am an equal opportunity basher.

PerspicaciaTick · 15/03/2017 14:14

I was always taught by my parents that it is rude to imitate other people's religious beliefs. If I found myself attending any sort of service or ceremony involving prayer then I was not to try and participate or copy what other people were doing, I should sit quietly and respectfully until they had finished their religious observances. Because imitation without understanding or belief could be interpreted as crass and insensitive.

So, in the light of that, I find the lesson very odd. But I'm happy to be told that holding mock religious observances is not as rude as I was led to believe.

seagazer · 15/03/2017 14:17

By the way Jazzy don't bother trying to enlighten me about what went on in Ireland, i probably know a lot more than you, love. I still cry for the children buried in the Tuam graves. But the difference is, it's not happening now, we can't change the past. Don't try and downplay what is happening to women NOW in many middle Eastern countries because of it.

BertrandRussell · 15/03/2017 14:24

I could say "Don't minimize the issues in the Catholic Church by saying Look over there! They are much worse!"

Jazzywazzydodah · 15/03/2017 14:48

Happy to Catholic bash. And Muslim bash

In fact, happy to bash any reactionary, misogynist organization. Particularly ones that shield paedophiles

I am an equal opportunity basher

^^^ this

What are we actually talking about here seagazer? I think your getting confused with cultural and religious differences. You are aware that FGM is still practiced mostly by catholics And Protestants in Kenya don't you? Or are we not really allowed to talk about what still happens now. Have you any tears left for those ladies?

I'm talking about about when religious institutions I.E the Church ... are directly behind terrible acts. But I suppose we should just forget about it because they are white men and it's all a bit embarrassing..

Hey ho , let's focus on the other side of the world,nothing to see here..

This is why R.E needs to be radically changed in schools so our children can see all religions even our 'native' ones and the ugly truths around them

Sorry to derail op!

seagazer · 15/03/2017 15:13

Add message | Report | Message poster Jazzywazzydodah Tue 14-Mar-17 19:38:18
In fact I REALLY wish that schools would teach paganism so that kids could join the dots themselves and see why Christianity is such a farce! It's just fucking story telling angry
Your post right from the beginning Jazzy you derailed right from back then.

seagazer · 15/03/2017 15:18

Yes i've tears for them too jazzy , what about you? You're talking about acts when it's "religious institutions" behind it. Are the acts of appalling violence and barbarity done in the name of Islam above your radar?

seagazer · 15/03/2017 15:44

Hey ho , let's focus on the other side of the world,nothing to see here..
But you just mentioned Kenya. Hmm oh well, not to worry.

Jazzywazzydodah · 15/03/2017 15:50

Appalling acts of barbarity and violence are done in the name of all gods sea

By the way are you a practising catholic?