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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think it is CRIMINAL to describe male rapists as women

201 replies

DickToPhone · 08/03/2017 12:50

WTF?

www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/truth-female-sex-offenders/

The article starts:

"Last night, Crimewatch covered the case of Lisa Hauxwell: a sex offender who could be living as a either man or a woman. On the run from a 14-year prison sentence, the offender has not been seen since being convicted of a string of rapes and sexual assaults committed between 2001-2002.

It has become, sadly, typical to hear of appeals for information on male sex offenders - yet when the perpetrator is female, it always seems much more shocking. "

But the perpetrator was not female! Women CANNOT rape. It's a physical and legal impossibility. Therefore - conclusively - the offender was a male.

To compound matters, they couldn't find this evil fucker for a year because the police were more bothered tying themselves up in knots humouring a RAPIST and his silly games then actually trying to catch a dangerous sex criminal.

Last year:

www.itv.com/news/calendar/update/2016-04-14/fresh-appeal-to-trace-missing-leeds-woman/

"Lisa Lacey, aged 47, who also uses the name Lisa Hauxwell and Lisa Hauxley, was last seen at about 9pm on Sunday, April 3, at her home in Holbeck."

"Detectives say she has also been known to use a male identity under the name Craig John Hauxwell. A photograph of Lisa as Craig has also been issued as part of the appeal to trace her."

They then further compounded

www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/missing-woman-dressed-as-man-seen-in-dronfield-1-7873949

"POLICE hunting for a missing woman said she had been spotted in a Derbyshire shop - with the footage appearing to show her dressed as a man."

And:

www.facebook.com/westyorkshirepolice/posts/10154129801369920

They apparently managed to tell 'Gay Star News' that he was genetically male: www.gaystarnews.com/article/police-help-missing-trans-woman/

But not any mainstream source www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-36123487

AIBU to wonder why the police were sharing this apparent 'vulnerable woman goes missing' story when he was in fact a dangerous MALE rapist? And to think that he wasn't a very good example for a story about how shocking female sex offenders are? Man rapes people, police describe him as woman, today found & living as a man (although I'm not sure how you tell? are we saying that you are a woman based on dress, hair cut, what?) www.sunderlandecho.com/news/crime/convicted-sex-offender-who-lives-as-a-man-and-woman-is-traced-after-tv-appeal-1-8427467

Suddenly based, presumably, on his clothes & haircut, the police are happy to say "We understand Hauxwell had been living at the address in Newark for several months, without anyone knowing his true identity." WTF is this shit? How have they determined that his gender identity is now male? Did they ask him whether despite 'presenting as a man' (whatever the fuck that means) he in fact 'identifies as a woman'? Perhaps he was 'dressing as a man' because the stupid police were insisting he was a woman, so this made it easier to evade capture? Who are we to presume that his femaleness is negated by his 'presenting as a man'? If a woman presents as a man for subterfuge does that means she is no longer a woman?

OP posts:
miniatureegg · 08/03/2017 18:05

I agree. Reminds me of the 'world's first pregnant man'. No, that's a woman who has had her hair cut... not a miracle. He can be a man all he likes I don't have a problem with that but ffs at trying to sell a ~miracle pregnancy~ just because we are trying so hard to be sensitive and pc.

miniatureegg · 08/03/2017 18:06

has mumsnet reached peak misuse and overuse of gaslighting yet Hmm

Screwinthetuna · 08/03/2017 18:10

The number of males being 'raped' isn't actually 'statistically insignificant', as stated above.
RAINN.org says that's statistically, 1 in every 10 rapes are male. I'm guessing a lot are not reported as many men would wrongfully feel embrassed to report being raped by a woman.
Sorry to hijack thread, op!

MinimumPaymentMaximumBurrito · 08/03/2017 18:11

YANBU. And I hope the endless threads never end until some sanity prevails.

allchattedout · 08/03/2017 18:23

The law defines rape as 'a person' . It doesn't have (in law) to be a man

From the citizen's advice bureau guidance on rape:

"Rape is a criminal offence and can only be committed by men"

Leading criminal law textbook (cited by supreme court/court of appeal on numerous occasions) by Simester and Sullivan clarifies that only a man can rape.

Elendon · 08/03/2017 18:23

YANBU and it's madness. Madness. We can see that, why can't the media?

On International Women's Day, why can't we see that this is totally beyond what I would think would be happening in the 21st Century. Being told, TOLD, that a man is a woman who happens to sometimes be clothed in male clothing. Seriously.

Klaphat · 08/03/2017 18:25

The number of males being 'raped' isn't actually 'statistically insignificant', as stated above. RAINN.org says that's statistically, 1 in every 10 rapes are male. I'm guessing a lot are not reported as many men would wrongfully feel embrassed to report being raped by a woman. Sorry to hijack thread, op!

If you're going to hijack the thread it would be good if you could:

  1. Use statistics that define rape the way everyone else is doing so, or at least make it clear how the statistics you're using define rape (RAINN.org appears to be an American organisation)

  2. Actually read what a poster is saying. They said the number of female sex offenders is statistically insignificant. A male rape victim in the UK, would have been raped by a man. A male rape victim in the US would also most likely have been raped by a man. So your point is what?

Floggingmolly · 08/03/2017 18:26

1 in every 10 rapes are male. I presume this means the victims are male; but why conclude the perpetrators are all female? It's unlikely.

WobblyLegs5 · 08/03/2017 18:31

Screw male rate victims are normally raped by other men.

I'm not doubt female sex offenders are more common than conviction stats (see my ore virus posts) but male on male rate is commonly known about, even if under reported. Females sexually assault males and females, more commonly children, and more than the 2% suggested. BUT there are very very few accurate studies, and will now be even less as people with male bodies will be included in the stats and blur the issue, which will leave victims of actual females at increased risk.

yellow6 · 08/03/2017 18:32

From the citizen's advice bureau guidance on rape:

"Rape is a criminal offence and can only be committed by men"
it DOES NOT SAY THAT it says 'Rape is defined as non-consensual penetration of the vagina, anus or mouth.' check for yourself
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/family/gender-violence/rape-and-sexual-assault/

allchattedout · 08/03/2017 18:38

it DOES NOT SAY THAT it says 'Rape is defined as non-consensual penetration of the vagina, anus or mouth.' check for yourself

Sorry, I just realised that it was the Scottish CAB guidance that I linked to. You can look it up. However, their Sexual Offences Act also simply uses the male pronoun just as the English act. The textbook I referenced says that only men can commit rape because only men have penises. Anyway, if you can find me a single instance of a biological woman being found guilty of rape, I will take it all back.

ToastDemon · 08/03/2017 18:38

A person (A) commits an offence if—

(a) he intentionally penetrates the vagina, anus or mouth of another person (B) with his penis,

(b) B does not consent to the penetration, and

(c) A does not reasonably believe that B consents.[4]

Sexual Offenses Act 2003

Elendon · 08/03/2017 18:39

Male rapists should not be described as women.

And that should be the end of that. Own a penis? You're a man. Or maybe women should claim that those in possession of a penis are really women.

It's a boy should be a phrase to be scraped.

SookiesSocks · 08/03/2017 18:40

Screw and who are those 1 in 10 men raped by?
Men or women?

ToastDemon · 08/03/2017 18:40

That is the current definition of rape in UK law.

WorldWideWish · 08/03/2017 18:40

YANBU. This is madness.

allchattedout · 08/03/2017 18:41

From Met Police: "Rape is when a man forces his penis into the vagina, anus or mouth of another person when that person doesn't want him to do so"

safe.met.police.uk/rape_and_sexual_assault/get_the_facts.html

Shockers · 08/03/2017 18:46

If the rapist had a penis which was forced into another person without their consent, then the rapist is male.

Screwinthetuna · 08/03/2017 19:05

I don't know how many men are raped by women (let's use the word rape as interchangeable with sexual assault in this instance, like Americans do) but I'm guessing it's a lot more than we are led to believe.
Someone close to me was pinned down by 2 women, with one pulling his pants down and attempting oral sex on his flaccid penis and hittng it/him when it wouldn't become erect. In my eyes, this is as much rape as a male forcing intercourse. I know it's just terminology but I think that man has every right to say he was raped.

SookiesSocks · 08/03/2017 19:10

Nobody is denying them that right but legally it would not be rape.

Plus the focus of this thread was not how many men are raped by women which by the way is way way way less than women raped by men, it was about the fact this rapist is a man and is being called a woman.

Screwinthetuna · 08/03/2017 19:11

Here are some instances of 'biological women accused of rape'

fox4kc.com/2015/05/17/woman-convicted-of-breaking-into-apartment-raping-man-headed-to-prison/

www.theguardian.com/world/2005/apr/28/2

Elendon · 08/03/2017 19:12

I believe your friend Screw (nice name)

It was a sexual assault. And if it happened to my son, I'd be very angry.

Why aren't men angry about rape and sexual assault against girls (babies too) and women? Why haven't they done something about it? Men are the one's with the power in politics after all.

AwkwardSquad · 08/03/2017 19:14

Apparently he is now a man... Darlington and Stockton Times

Elendon · 08/03/2017 19:15

Girls and women have the added problem Screw of being impregnated too. They also get beaten up.

I do hope your friend has sought all the counselling he needs after his horrific attack. Women and girls don't tend to go to the police either and they rarely seek help. Generally, they are not believed.