AIBU to ask what you intend to do with respect to caring for elderly parents?

[Timeforteaplease]

I'm in my 50s and my DM (in her late 70s) has always said that she does not expect us to care for her. She didn't care for her own parents; they went into a home. But as she gets older, I think (but do not know for sure) that she is changing her mind and would like to move in if/when something goes wrong. I am guessing that she will not want to spend her savings on a care home.
Do we wait for a crisis to happen or talk to her in advance?

What is the norm for care these days?
For background DH and I both work full time, me from the home - but my job is still full time/high pressure.
Looking for good advice from people who have been through this.

My granny told everyone to put "a wee pill in her tea". No one did obviously and she lingered on, getting increasingly frail, demented and unhappy until she died in hospital, unable to recognise her children. People are living too long.

Like one of the pps my parents are determined not to burden us in any way. And it makes me want to help them more. But what I really want is for them to continue to live healthy happy lives for as long as possible and then to die quickly when they no longer can. Not lingering on, dependent and lost in the fog.

I don't know if I'm allowed to post this (recommendation for a different forum) but seeing as dementia has had many a mention, if it does become an issue, the Alzheimer's Society has an excellent forum called Talking Point. One of my siblings has been nominated to deliver the "pillow treatment" to mum should she need it, obviously that's not going to happen but at least she can laugh about it!

Probably warden assisted accommodation at first and then if they need medical care, a care home. My mother insists that it would drive her crazy living with me and the kids and I doubt my father could cope either. I would visit daily of course and help pay if needed.

Great thread op.

I am there now. I am 50 too and although don't work I help care for my grandchildren and have an active social life etc.

My dm has developed altzimers and gone down really quickly. My dad is her carer and although mum gets out and about with dad she couldn't live alone. dad isn't in the best of health.

My sister can't help she's at the far end of the country. We are looking ahead and hoping to extend our house incase we need one or other to live with us but my heart sinks st the thought of me effectively becoming a carer 24/7.

Having been through this with one set of parents, I would absolutely not to commit to any promises at this stage: you sim

FIL was able to stay at home and only go into hospital for his final illness at 93. MIL became paralysed with cancer in her early 80s and required round the clock care in accommodation with space not only for a wheelchair but for a hoist operated by two people whenever she needed to go to the loo. There was absolutely no way we could have provided that at home. I would not only have had to leave work, I would have been able to leave the house e.g. to take my own dc to a doctor's appointment or hospital, let alone take them to school every day. Our hallway was not wide enough for the stairlift she would have required, and even with knocking out internal walls we could not have stored the hoist.

My poor SIL actually was feeling very pressured to take MIL in at one point (poor MIL was hardly in a place to make sensible decisions). We spoke to her very firmly and pointed out the risks not only to her but to MIL. A few years after this decision was made, SIL herself became ill with breast cancer. I hate to think how that would have panned out if she had been MIL's carer.

In the end, the house was sold and the money set up as an insurance scheme to provide her with the fees for a lifetime at a very nice nursing home. They looked after her very well during those years and because they were so well equipped she did not even have to endure the stress of a hospital stay in her final illness: she died in her own room at the nursing home, with her son at her bedside and cared for by people she already knew. Some of them came to her funeral.

I have no idea what will happen with my own parents, currently in their mid-80s. Experience has taught me to be open-minded.

2ndSopranos - will you look after MIL because she expects it - or say no?

Having lost all out parents now I can only say you can't predict how it will go. Of our 4 DPs my in-laws died in their 60s; one heart attack (no warning) and one had cancer for 1 year. My DM had a massive stroke but lived 11 years, 5 in (horrible) geriatric hospital (that was heart breaking and with a bit more state practical support DF could have coped at home which surely would have been cheaper for the state?). We lived far away with young children so couldn't help much though was still stressful and so so sad. The best decision my DP made was to refuse to sell their house to fund her going into a private home and him being rehoused into a council flat for the rest of his very long life. Huge pressure was put on them by DSS. He lived to almost 100 so if they'd agreed to that 25 years earlier he would have had nothing behind him in his 90s when he was finally not coping at home. He still had his marbles so sold the house in his 90s when it had more value (not South East so still not a lot!). He invested the money with our help and that helped fund a lovely nursing home near us where he spent his last 5 years. None of that could have been planned for but refusing to sell up to care for 1st frail parent is my top tip. I am an only child but still ended up without an inheritance but have the comfort of doing my best for them.

I wonder if any men anywhere are having these conversations with one another about their parents or PIL

I imagine there are very few.

My father died last July of Parkinsons and "frailty of old age".

He was 93. He lived in a retirement flat and managed until November 2015, with a cleaner coming in weekly and the local supermarket delivering food (and also Wiltshire Farm Foods). He did not live close to me and I only saw him 3-4 times a year.

I think he would have lasted longer, but he had a fall in November 2015 and went into hospital. With physiotherapy I think they might (I don't know for certain) got him walking again and then he might have managed in a care home. He spent a few weeks in a care home but they said his needs were too great and he went into a very expensive nursing home. I was very disappointed with both homes, especially the second one, they just seemed to deal with basic needs and nothing else and were very poor on getting professionals in like opticians or physiotherapists. He went downhill very quickly. He wasn't well and was never going to get better, but if he had been able to walk at least a little bit, he could have got himself to the toilet etc. But there was no effort to organise that sort of help for him.

If he had been able to cope at home, he could have bought in that sort of help. I think it's better to try to organise to be at home and buy in help, than plan to go into a home except for when you really can't look after yourself at all. My father didn't have dementia. I feel guilty because I think his final six months were thoroughly miserable. But I could not have looked after him.

refusing to sell up to care for 1st frail parent is my top tip

but for most people half the value of the house will be earmarked for care - the local council will put a charge on the property and when it comes to be sold (either to fund the other spouse's care, or for them to move to a retirement flat or because they've passed away), they will take their chunk.

My uncle has dementia and has recently gone into a home, it's the second one he's been in - he deteriorated in the first home after only 2 weeks but apparently the new one is fantastic and they really do care for them well. My aunt wanted to move to be closer to her children (it is a second marriage) but she can't because half the house is now earmarked for his care fees and she can't afford another property with half the value of their bungalow.

I used to work for social services, mainly assessing older people for care packages/homes.

I have already told my DM and DF that I will NOT be physically caring for them. I am happy to do shopping, cleaning, driving around and sort out their care packages but not physical care. I saw too many families where children/partners were resentful of their situation and felt stressed and depressed by the burden of responsibility they had taken on, especially as a caring role usually lasts for many years. In most situations it is too much for one person, but people feel obliged to do it out of love and a sense of responsibility, and feel guilty that they find it difficult. When that Tory said that people should be caring for their parents I got so

I'd rather someone else did the physical stuff and my time/energy was freed up to actually spend more pleasant time with my parents. Most people are cared for in their own home unless they actually need someone physically there 24 hours a day. If your mum has to go into a care home surely she would have no other need for her savings than paying for care- e.g. she wouldn't be going on a cruise, getting work done to the house etc! It would just mean that when she passed away you might not inherit as much. I've told my parents I don't care whether I inherit anything or not as I'd rather they were in a 'nice' home if that happened.

We've only had the conversation in such detail due to my job and also grandparents ending up in homes. I've also discussed with them what I'd like if I end up incapacitated as I don't think these things are discussed enough.

While you're on the subject with your mum it might be a good idea to discuss Power of Attorney etc with her as these things need to be planned whilst people are mentally capable.

fairweather I've never come across that before- usually the house isn't counted if the other partner is still living in it!

Yes I don't think any council had the authority to see a house if there's a spouse or any one else living in it can they?

Sell not see.

Sukey nail on head.

No, the council cannot make a claim on the property of the spouse is living there. My MIL is in a nursing home and her savings have long gone after four years. The payments are now a combination of council funding, FIL contribution and a reduction in th unbelievably high fees.

It's a difficult process because ill health can creep up so slowly without anyone being well prepared. A conversation at least sets the scene in terms of what one feels able to offer. Saying you will visit daily and do X,y and z is actually a massive undertaking in itself. Dh has three siblings and we all do our bit yet it's still overwhelming at times.

My own DM takes the 'shoot me' line which is really bloody unhelpful. I need to open that one again I guess.

I could not care for my DD. We would end up killing each other. I would care for my mum, but she lives hundreds of miles away, and would not move to be near me, or in with me. So not sure practically what would happen. I suspect my mum will die first, and then my dad will go into a home.

I have jokingly said to my parents that they'd better ask DSis not me to help care for them. They are in the 60s and in fairly good health but I know that this can change quickly.

My DM cares for her mum for a few hours a week, and I think that because she and her brothers have enabled her mum to remain at home, she might expect the same.

However, I have no plans to do this. I live 4-5 hours away, and whilst I could help with practicalities I could not care for my mum. Plus, I have a DD who has anxiety and ASD who needs me, and I can't see that changing. plus I am a bit bitter about the lack of support from my parents who struggle to deal with DD

I am comfortable setting my own boundaries with my parents, but I realise it might come across as harsh.

Having watched my DM end up on blood pressure and anti depressant medication and run ragged by my grandma as her health deteriorated, there is no way I would have had either of my parents to live with me (both now deceased anyway/ tragic circumstances), and no way on God's earth I would have PIL either. They have plenty of money and have been 'saving for their old age' all their life.....well I will expect them to spend it, be it on gardeners, cleaners, carers, care homes etc.
My grandma did end up in a care home eventually, but no amount of any inheritance left was worth the damage done to my mum's mental health and her relationship with my grandma by the end.

My Dad died in 20014 at 60, so nothing to deal with there. We are NC with mil for various reasons after fils death in 2011, so her attorneys will have to deal with her.

My Mum is 76 and still doing OK, but I am in a different country to her and it takes me 12 hours to get back to where she lives. We are moving home in 2019, and as we are a 10/15 minute drive away from her (and I have done it faster), then there is not a problem being about if she needs anything.

I do have a large room in my house which we use as a study, but could at a push become a bed sitting room, and it is next to the downstairs loo, which is next to the utility room, where we could if necessary put a shower.

I think having Mum live with us would drive both dh and myself barmy; it's bad enough when she is here to stay for a month at a time, but we will deal with that when necessary. Having worked in care homes and on the psycho geriatric ward of the local mental hospital in the 80s, I would prefer that she did not go into care if we can avoid it.

My mum will live with me, she will not be going into a care home or be looked after by strangers under any circumstances - She's my mum, my responsibility and I will look after her just as she looked after me when I couldn't look after myself (as a child).

However, my mum is adamant that she wouldn't want to be a "burden" and that I should put her in a care home or as she charmingly tells me often "If I get dementia smother me in my sleep" - Obviously I wouldn't harm her but equally I wouldn't put her care into the hands of others, so she will be living with me because I strongly believe it is my place to take care of her no matter how hard it may be and I actually want to look after her, I don't feel obliged.

You dont pay for care home if you are their for medical grounds ie terminally ill. Bothmy parents died last year and spent their last couple of months in a nursing home on"fastrack" nhs systemwhich indicated they were terminally ill and therefore free so dont assume it will cost lots.

Posted this on another thread.

Carers are a group that are taken advantage of including by the medical profession My cousin is in his 50s . He is the only child of my aunt who had a hip operation nearly four months ago and still hasnt got out of bed and wont help herself at all.
The doctor has been around and said " Never mind these things take time. My cousin is doing it all and every time he suggests she tries to do a tiny bit of muscle stretching she turns on the tears.

I suspect if my cousin said he couldnt cope any more and threw in the towel the doc wouldnt be doing the "Never mind " routine. He would be trying to get her to do more. He doesnt have to when my cousin is doing it all though

I'm potentially the elderly parent, although not yet in need of support. I've spent a considerable amount of time raising a child and I'd hope they'd value that enough to provide some help but I dont want to live with them. I've seen what that can do and I dont want to inflict it on my child or myself.

When my health deteriorates I hope I'll have sufficient warning to head off to dignitas but given my family history that may not happen and I cant ask my child to help. I plan to move nearer to them if my husband dies first and potentially into some form of sheltered housing where carers can come in if needed. In 10-20 years I expect robot assistants to be available. But the money I may need to protect myself I would prefer to be able to leave to my child.

I keep meaning to make a living will so that I will not get treatment to prolong life when it has ceased to have meaning. My relatives and friends are well aware of my views on that but it would be better to formalise it. However the way the NHS is being deliberately destroyed I can already see a reluctance to provide treatment to the elderly so by the time I need it I expect euthanasia to effectively exist.

I have no parents, but would expect PILs to cash in the value of their house to buy in care in the home. We're a 30min drive away and I'd be happy to go over multiple times weekly, but would find it hard to commit to essential caring tasks on a daily basis.

I would encourage them to move nearer us, but I know MIL will never agree to move out of the house she's in now, never mind change area.