At breaking point

[AtSea1979]

DS is crying himself to sleep. I'm sat here crying. I don't know how to help him or myself. Life is so stressful at minute. DS day dreams so much the frustration is killing us. He lost hundreds of pounds worth of things since starting high school in sept. He won't get dressed without needing me to yoyo up and down the stairs every few minutes to keep him focused. He can't prioritise and doesn't seem to care either way anyway. All I do is yell. All the time. I come home from work swearing it will be better, I will not shout, I'll be kind and understanding and patient, and within minutes I'm yelling what the hell did you do that for, why haven't you done this, where have you put it? When did you last see it? All the while DS getting screechy and I get louder until he's screaming at me in an irritating off the radar high pitch whine and I'm yelling at him.

In the nicest possible way, you're the adult here. Stop shouting at him. He's 11. Help him. Sympathise with him. Support him. It's a huge adjustment. Mine won't get dressed in the morning either. I have to hassle him every few minutes or he just goes back to bed. I know how annoying it is! But you're the parent.

AtSea1979 firstly I am very sorry for you and your son, it is so hard.

I had some issues similar with my dd about 5 years ago, starting when she was 6 and culminating when she was 8, she is now 12 and in Year 7 like your son.

She has dyslexia which made school very hard for her.

She also has autistic tendencies.

We went through the school link worker to see CAMHS and although they were not much help, I believe an accurate label can help to explain to the child, the family and others why a child has quirky or whatever behaviour, finds concentrating hard etc or struggles with organisation or work.

Please do not back off from getting the right help, GP/CAMHS/Teachers for special needs/organisational skills or whatever - be tenacious. It won't give you the full story but it may help.

I agree with mrsmcmoo.

Stop shouting at him.

Shouting at kids achieves nothing and only makes a bad situation worse.

DS is a stress head too. This morning he couldn't remember if it was world book day, he lost the letter before it made it to me, the website said nothing but he was screaming that he didn't know what to wear and I said just put your uniform on it's fine but he was so scared of wearing the wrong thing. Once he got to school without his tie and was sobbing his heart out. He doesn't seem too fussed about my consequences though.

AtSea1979 this may sound a bit out of left field but something I found helped me when I used to find myself losing my temper: being polite.

The angrier I got, the more polite I would become. Being polite was a way of expressing my anger in a way which wasnt damaging.

I think he could well be being bullied. The daydreaming etc being a cover for delaying in having to go to school and face it. Talk to the school (and buy cheap stuff if he's losing it it's less to lose if it's being stolen much less likely to nick non-designer stuff).

You are dealing with it all wrong as you said. He needs to be able to talk to you without being blamed. Don't shout, if you feel that angry go to the kitchen and make a cup of tea, unload dishwasher etc then go back and talk calmly, the old count to ten slowly works too. Humour and asking the, works well too. If he is daydreaming ask him if he thinks you are being unreasonable in being upset about whatever has happened.

Also you will probably hate me for saying this but a lot of people need to chill out and try not to stress so much. Don't yoyo start with him the night before, make sure he's put all of his uniform out ready to get dressed straight into in the morning. Make sure he sets alarms on his phone, wake up, out of bed, be dressed, downstairs to breakfast etc. The schedule should help him and give him something to remind him when to do what. Also at 11 he is not too old for a reward scheme that could act as an incentive. Have him build up points towards a treat that he really wants or earn time on a game etc.

This sounds so stressful OP, especially all the yelling and screaming from both of you. I bet if you stop yelling that will be a huge step in the right direction. Children (or anyone really) don't listen when voices are raised, it's just horrible, stressful noise.

I too was wondering if your son's things are being taken at school. If your confident there are no worries about bullying or theft then its a case of dealing with the reasons for the daydreaming and losing things. Including if appropriate, consequences each time. But calmly. When you yell you just show you're not in control and that's so unsettling for children.

Really hope you get it sorted.

Thanks for all the great advice. Just being able to talk about it, hear everyone's stories and ideas has really helped me focus my mind. I will contact the school again and request we move the next meeting forward to see if there's anything more they can be doing.

All my dc had stuff stolen at secondary school. It is rife IME.
I would be concerned about bullying too.

I felt so sorry for you and your DS when I read this. My DD has some dyspraxic tendencies and I agree with other posters that the getting distracted thing you mentioned rings a large bell.

Here are some . You're doing all you can, you have a tough row to hoe, as they say. People here are supporting you, hope that is some comfort.

We got through difficult times with lists, reminders, and being prepared the night before. If the bag is packed and the uniform is laid out, a lot of morning stress can be avoided or at least reduced.

Not shouting is incredibly difficult when you consider the many items that your DS has lost and what stresses and strains you face every morning. But maybe you could learn techniques to break the cycle of shouting. Mindfulness might help, and a friend told me that grasping the middle finger of the right hand firmly in the left hand just before you say/shout something hurtful or unwise can help you keep the words to yourself. I have found it works, although mainly with appalling relatives. It's free and is worth a try!

I agree with other posters about getting an assessment. Knowing what you're up against can help.

I really feel for you - and remember this well from one of mine. The day-dream stuff - lack of ability to keep anything on track and the constant losing things. He worked very hard at not caring - just removed himself from the problem.

Mine is dyspraxic and dyslexic. The labels explain the problem but don't help solve it.
Suggestions:
-Spend a lot of time sorting out ways of keeping things together that would help him (having one bag - not taking extra things - agreeing where things would be put down at school - rehearsing a bodycheck to use when leaving any space)

-Clearly mark everything - even socks. (I hate school ties.)
-Homework diaries - a nightmare. Create contact with a network of friends and with school.

-Accept that Friday is 'search the lost property bin' night - every week. (My son was more horrified at the idea of me going in to do this than he was shy to go and find out how to do it himself)
-Prepare cartoon funny posters/posts to put up on lockers/school notice boards/social media for more precious/expensive things that go missing. (This worked amazingly well for us. Humour is a winner.)

Punishment didn't work - just made us both miserable.

Celebrate (daily) the things that didn't go missing. (Happy memories of the day he got to take the same pen to school twice in a row - the return of the coat every day in a week was even better.)

There is hope. Mine got better at it - and I got better at coping with losses. He -almost grown up- has had the same coat all winter this year! He still struggles with order but uses the strategies that worked when he was younger.

On a practical note, can you get everything ready with him after school for the next day and put it in the room you're in (or at least the same floor?) So you've not got to drive yourself mental with that side of things? Then as he gets into it more you can try doing that but up in his room. Tried bribery? Little things, ie get ready within 15 minutes, for example and you get 15 minutes extra of x box or whatever? Or reverse it - ie if you don't do xxx there's no xxx after school? I know what you mean though. My little 6yo has a brain condition and is really the original bugger to try the patience of a saint!! I'm always repeating myself, he goes off at a tangent, gets upset I shout.... sound familiar? Unfortunately I don't have an answer. Although I hear the Caribbean is rather nice and shackles and chain for under stairs dungeon use are very cheap at b and q x

I'm not surprised he gets stressed when he's being shouted at every day and being told he's useless.

Agree with MrsMcMoo please stop shouting, and I am really talking to myself too as I shout too often!

I do feel, for me when I start shouting that I've lost the kind of moral ground/authority in the situation and it has turned into a bit of a verbal rugby scrum.

It may be that you can find a parenting course for teens or pre teens or whatever that can support you.

In terms of the list of things to do, my dd found making her own list with photos of he stages to get ready was helpful, your son may be a bit old for this so I would really suggest you gently nudge he way he gets himself ready and how he remembers back to him.

I would suggest you read How to talk so children will listen and listen so children will talk this book is really helpful.

I am a great believer in the power of positive images and positive thinking. One of the things the book encourages is the idea that you can encourage children to participate in problem solving. So you could ask your son how best for him to get himself ready for school and act as if you really think he can come up with some ideas.

Try not to talk too soon, silence can be a bit deafening and we sometimes rush in to speak. But wait and listen, the books suggests some tactics for engaging in conversation, it is really good.

So for example there might be a written list, or a picture list, or a symbol list whichever he chooses. Trial it for a few weeks. Maybe get into the whole 'are you on 'step 4' now rather than 'have you got that jumper on yet! Or whatever.

I also think think look into the bullying thing. It is odd his things have disappeared and not turned up in the lost property. Asking him direct questions may not provide the opportunity for him to talk, you need to create space where he feels safe to talk.

I do hope all is OK. Is he managing the work of school OK?

Are there any other issues for you, OP?

Good luck

Atsea Re "...the website said nothing but he was screaming that he didn't know what to wear and I said just put your uniform on it's fine but he was so scared of wearing the wrong thing. Once he got to school without his tie and was sobbing his heart out. He doesn't seem too fussed about my consequences though."

It souonds like you need to get creative. See if there is a Facebook page for his year at school and join it, if not, can you make a few friends of mums/dads in his year and share information on this type of thing.

He sounds very anxious, I could be wrong, but I think you could look into this with the GP the tie thing sounds quite extreme.

Help him to think strategically about how to tackle issues. If he suspects it is a non-uniform or World book day but is not sure get him to take a simple option, own clothes/costume/sports kit whatever (loads of kids at ds's school were Where's Wally or just wore Star Wars tops!) in his bag to change at school if necessary.

Gnome "The angrier I got, the more polite I would become. Being polite was a way of expressing my anger in a way which wasnt damaging." That is brilliant.

Red great ideas too. Also feel "Have him build up points towards a treat that he really wants .." could be something family orientated or social and communication building, and fun, a meal out at McDonalds, a trip to cinema with a friend, etc. Lots of chances to talk while out or to talk about what he saw with his friend.

If he is not happy at this school, for whatever reason, please do consider a change of schools if this would help. The more academic school may not be the best choice, necessarily.

blue I am definitely going to try grabbing my finger of my right hand in my left hand!I'm going to use my pinky finger on my right hand!

AtSea are you the poster who was having some kind of custody battle at the first of the year? How did that go?

At Sea,
Reading yoir OP and other comments, it looks like you are suffering depression. Not surprising really in the circumstances. Nor is it something to be ashamed of. It really is hard work being a mum.

Come over to the Mental Health pages. There are many like you over there who have been through what you are going through and will help you.

steff yes that's me. It's ongoing so can't discuss but it's certainly adding to the stress as I feel I have to be super mum at min and I'm failing miserably.

finger glad I didn't read that last night. No very helpful to leave that there and offer no advice on a solution.

Some great advice here. I have talked through a routine with DS at school to check he has 1 or 2 bags and his coat before he leaves his class but I think he hears that bell and focuses where he needs to be next. On PE days now he puts his school exercise books in his PE bag and his kit and other stuff in his rucksack as he's never lost his rucksack. I know his work is important too but that's more likely to turn up/not get pinched.

I've woke him up early today and given him his list. All quiet at min, hoping he's eating breakfast and no sat on his bed with one sock on staring at the wall!

My ds was like this wben he started secondary school. He lost things l didnt even know it was possile to lose eg his shoes! He got in such trouble with the teachers for forgetting homework and equipment. He had teachers shout at him and some refused to have him in their class as they wouldnt believe he wasnt doing it on purpose. It was a horrendous time. Eventually he was diagnosed with dyspraxia. This was slow coming as he is very sporty and quite coordinated but they said he couldnt see the wood for the trees. Its a visual issue. Also not only was he totally disorganised but he didnt see any reason to be organised.
What helped me have patience was giving myself permission to help him as much as possible. So instead of worrying that he needed to do things for himself l laid everything out put up lists and generally became his right hand man.
Good news is he is now at university doing particularly well lots of friends and a fine young man. He improved with age and his friends realised he wasnt messing and are good at gentle reminders.
Change tactics. If he couldnt walk you wouldnt shout at him. He has a disability. Shower him with care and attention and as the stress goes off him he will improve.

He needs help, he's not doing it on purpose. You need to push for a diagnosis, I imagine he's already feeling like he's useless.

As hard as it is for you, it's so much harder for him.

He sounds so like my two who have dyspraxia and ASD

It's very common for these youngsters to not transition well to secondary school, much greater demand on coping skills and many more people to move around

You do sound low but that's very understandable, it's hard work with kids like ours but you can use strategies to help

Please come over to the special needs board where there are lots of us who can give you practical support

The first thing I would say is give yourself permission to be cross and angry, let it all out then realise that just like any other medical condition, he and you can't help it!

Acceptance and a label will help your DS enormously and help his self esteem if he knows that it's just who he is

Talk to the senco and your gp but be prepared for very little help sadly

In practical terms, my DS has duplicates of all his bag things like calculator, pencil case so that he doesn't take things out and then leave at home

He probably needs to be referred to an occupational therapist rather than an educational psychologist. If you can't get an assessment done privately, ask your GP to make a referral.

Please stop shouting at him. I'm not surprised your consequences have little impact on him. From his perspective, he's probably going to get roared at no matter what he does. Stop looking to blame him. Look at you.

My 11 year old was a bit like this when he started high school. After losig his PE kit for the 2nd time I told him that if he lost it again a new one would be bought from his money. Although he has lost it since then he has also quickly found it again.

With the getting up and getting dressed he also needed constant nagging which put us all in a bad mood. So now he has an alarm and needs to get dressed before he comes downstairs. He knows that at 8 he needs to do his teeth and gather stuff ready to leave, I'll give him one reminder. If he's late for school, misses breakfast, forgets stuff then it's his responsibility to do the punishment the school give him.

I do remind a bit more for homework but not excessively.

I don't yell, stern calm disappointed voice seems to work better and loads of praise when he does things himself.

So I'd sit and talk to him this weekend in a calm manner. Tell him it's not working at the moment, that you're sorry for yelling and that now he's at high school he needs to have more responsibility for himself and his possessions. He might need a few reminders in the beginning but it should get better.

Atsea I've read most of what's here and think caught all your posts.

My son has dyspraxia, it wasn't found out until he was 14!! But we struggled with a lot of the things you've mentioned since he started school in year 1. It was tiring and emotionally draining to the max but now nearly two years on things have improved.
Things we noticed:
He was/is a big daydreamer and easily distracted.

Very possessive and picky over his personal things at home.

Came across as lazy/no regard for other people's things/school stuff.

Behind in school work/homework but very bright and could answer any question asked verbally.

Couldn't get work done on paper but could talk for hours about something he's passionate about.

Very over emotional/sensitive to things most people wouldn't think twice about.

Knew there was a problem but was frustrated as he couldn't figure out (neither could we) what it was or how to help, just knew he didn't want to feel or be the way he was.

Punishments didn't work at all, rewards garnered a little more effort but nothing he could sustain.

Shouting/arguing made him (and us) feel awful.

I'm not saying your ds has dyspraxia, but you say you read about it and some things felt like they matched up. Just be aware that like any mh issue or illness/disability, not everyone has all or the same symptoms. So maybe there's some dyspraxia there, maybe a little of something else. Pushing a SENCO for testing is not being precious. If you feel something is wrong, then it is. Having a diagnosis DID help my ds as it helped him realise (and us) that he wasn't doing these things on purpose. It didn't make him lazy and say "oh I can't do it I have dyspraxia so it's not my fault" it actually opened his eyes to what he coud do to make a difference for the better. He has his off days but he doesn't feel useless anymore. He doesn't cry himself to sleep over something he lost 6 years ago because it's playing on his mind with worry. He doesn't get over angry or shouty. He teies extra hard to look after things. He TALKS to me, a lot. It helps. Diagnosis help. Please look after yourself and stop worrying you are a bad parent, you're not. You're trying your best to help him and that's lead you here to such a great resource. If you need anything, please feel free to pm me.