To think DD's punishment from PE teacher was draconian?

[moonlightshadow1]

DD is in Year 10 and came home quite annoyed about a punishment she got in PE for something very minor in the first place. Her teacher made her get changed into her PE kit at lunchtime (without any tracksuit in the cold wet weather), and run laps around the football pitch for all but the last 15 minutes of the break (so she could eat), much of it whilst the boys were having football practice, who apparently found it quite funny. Is it overreacting to think this is a bit out of order? I might not have been surprised when I was at school but I can't help be a bit annoyed, seems a bit like it was intended to embarrass her and unnecessary.

sookies I know what I think education is about, but from all i read and hear these days it is about crowd control. I actually think many teachers do a great job, despite having experience of some not so much. But the attitude seems to be not to question a teacher, it is almost as if the whole house of cards will topple if we admit one zealous teacher was OTT. That is my take on it.

I have tried to engage with you, I am trying to do so but there are so many comments and really, I don't think you or I will change our views on this one, will we. I am and my dd had a shit time at primary school because of dyselexia and I am always a little suspisocus. i know there are brilliant teachers out there but I just don't think that all teacher are aware how much harm can be done in schools.

I think the whole school system could do with an overhaul, I think we do education in the UK is really wrongly focused, starts too early, is too pressured etc. I'd favour the Swedish model, I think teachers and schools would do better with a different model. And the more teachers say how much they are struggling the more I see that.

Anyway, I don't want to argue, sorry for any offense caused, not my intention, this subject just angers me a little, can you tell!

"Why are you defending an unknown lippy badly behaved teenager and chasing off my opposing opinion?"

Because this is mumset and the policy is that it is for support. The OP is asking for support not the teacher. The policy is also generally to believe the OP. So while I would get the teachers take on this I think that much of what the OP has said of her dd sounds very realistic and plausable.

The idea the child is embarrassed because of her bad behaviour is actually very sad, because her behaviouor was not bad, and the fact she is shamed for it is unhealthy - unless we really have a very minimalised view of what has happened.

moonlightshadow1
Yeah I am. It's why I'm both stunned (& slightly not) by some of the comments on this thread.
If I was you, I'd decide what you specifically think the issue is and call calmly to ask what happened. You may find that before you oitline what's annoyed you that the real version differs from what youve been told (kids can and do lie to parents even when theyve said theyre calling school in my experience). Then if the issue stands then chat about it with the teacher. But dont make your child privvy to the conversation details or say youre calling to complain (just discuss the outcome or brief summary & sanction at home if she has lied. We really appreciate parent support!) My experience says that kids who feel they can "get my mam in on you" usually end up being quite obnoxious, poorly behaved or generally feeling untouchable.

"You really are grasping at steaws now Italian she wasnt made to do laps just because she was a girl. She was made to do them because she was badly behaved." Do you think girls and boys are held to the same standard of behaviour, always?

I am not saying she was punished because she was a girl. It may have been an all girl class.

But i do think that school can have an effect on girls which is less than empowering.

And I have already said it would be the same for a boy running around next to a load of girls, if he felt embarrassed.

Anyway, not rising to the bait sookies- let's keep our separate views.

Do you think girls and boys are held to the same standard of behaviour, always?

Of course not but I also dont assume that every act is committed in a sexist way. Unlike you it seems.

I would imagine a boy would have had a similar if not more difficult punishment given that the sexist view held by many is that boys are more ohydical than girls.

Italian I wish the Scandinavian model would work in the UK. Unfortunately, without the wider cultural attitudes that support Scandinavian schools we are doomed to failure.

Fart jokes = not about farts. Schools smell because, unfortunately, lots of teenagers do

I will agree on the teenagers smelling Bitof as I have one (or an almost one).

Night

Anyway, not rising to the bait sookies- let's keep our separate views.

You question me and my opinions and you call it engaging me.

I question yours and its baiting you.

Yep you can dish it Italian but cant take it.

Op there seems to be a lot of teachers commenting on this thread and most seem to relish the idea that a teenage girl was humiliated as a punishment.

The punishment was not appropriate

How this thread even exists is baffling to me. Regardless of how she was sitting/supposed to be sitting, your daughter accepted her punishment and came home disgruntled. As a parent you're supposed to see that this has not done any harm and she's learnt not to do it again. As a teacher, I'd be irritated if I'd asked a child to sit a certain way and they just decided to sit another way - especially given that it was PE. It's like she was asked to use a hockey ball but went and got a basketball. It's disobedient and disruptive in a way you cannot imagine unless you've ever tried to manage a classroom. When kids are disruptive in ANY way it can spiral out of control like you wouldn't believe.

YorkieDorkie sorry but I'm really not getting how not keeping her legs crossed is disruptive. Disobedient yes because of how she was told to sit, but not the worst disobedience or willful to cause trouble. I don't think that would spiral out of control as she was on the side on her own.

Sookies I am sorry if that is how it came accorss, that was not my intention. Maybe I am more adversarial than I know. I will try to be aware of it. Let's agree to differ.

Moonlight it spirals because by visibly disobeying the teacher she is defying her. The rest of her classmates see your daughter defying the teacher. Your daughter then, potentially, steps up the defiance, face pulling, giggling, hand gestures. To stop this potential trouble the teacher reprimands the first evidence of disobedience.

The teacher has to visibly and obviously be aware of everything going on in her remit and be in control of it. That is one of the many reasons teaching is hard.

Op there seems to be a lot of teachers commenting on this thread and most seem to relish the idea that a teenage girl was humiliated as a punishment.

There is no relishing. Are you really silly enough to think that teachers give punishments for their own amusement? I suppose you probably think we go into teaching in order to humiliate and belittle children as well? The teachers on this thread are merely expressing frustration that their efforts to control behaviour in order to give children an education are undermined by mollycoddling parents who think that sitting away from the class or running a few laps is tantamount to torture.

If by 'humiliated' you mean made to look a bit silly in front of her mates, then yes I think that's a perfectly appropriate punishment. But I don't 'relish' it.

Bitofacow thanks for explaining, that does make sense. I suppose I was thinking about it as being something minor, i.e. her uncrossing her legs because it got uncomfortable after a while but stayed in silence, but her teacher saw it as disobeying another instruction. I do think she could have just simply told her to cross her legs again rather than how she did it, but at the same time understand your point on that.

It's disruptive because the teacher had to stop what they were doing to remind your child of something she had already been asked to do.

Secondary school. Anything can spiral out of control at any minute. You give an inch and the bury you a mile.

As I said, unless you've managed a classroom, it's easy to say that your child was "just" doing x, y or z and it "wasn't that bad"... I've heard it all. Bitofacow explained it 👌🏻👌🏻👌🏻.

Can blatantly see who the Teachers are on here.

Moonlight as a parent you want your child's individual quirks to be considered and cared for. As a teacher you want to do that, however, schools don't make that easy.

You are managing the crowd. One teacher, 25 kids the odds are in their favour! You want to be the kind, reasonable teacher but sometimes it just doesn't happen.
Starting a lesson and being forced onto the back foot immediately by a 'funny comment' is going to irritate most teachers.
Your daughter is at school, 5 days a week, however many weeks a year. She knows these unspoken rules of school life. She knows how to play the game, for good or ill. She is not stupid. I think she might be being slightly disingenuous.

Can blatantly see who the Teachers are on here

And thats a problem why user?

NC just for that comment. Well thats brave of you user

moon the teacher picking her up for moving sounds really unreasonable to me.

I think your dd is being painted as a bit of a trouble maker here and I don't think that is reasonable either.

But only you know what she is like. I've heard lots of kids are more 'naughty' at home, I know mine are because the teachers have told me how good they are in class! I'm not disputing some kids could be disruptive but I can't see every comment in this situation is intended to undermine the teacher.

Interesting first post @user1476641978

we're like psychopaths, we seek each other out user. Perhaps when you've bothered to join MN properly we'll remember your witty comments in future .

YorkieDorkie and bitofacow thanks for explaining. It makes sense to pull her up on it in the context of one act of disobedience leading to another, with me not seeing that side it seemed unnecessary to make her sit in the way first instructed but I see your points. Still do think it could have been done just by telling her rather than how it was, but at least do see why it was necessary now.