To think modern life makes us miserable and unhealthy

[thedcbrokemybank]

I am currently doing an Msc. My research at the moment is on depression and there is evidence that environmental stressors in life are contributing to increase incidence of depression which is the biggest cause of burden in high income countries.
There is also evidence to suggest that modern lifestyles Inc diet, technology, increases in sedentarism etc also lead to us being more physically unhealthy and dissatisfied with our lives.
I am a parent and try and give my dc opportunities in life by feeding them a healthy diet, limiting screen time and promoting exercise but I find I am often up against barriers e.g my ds gets called the health police because he doesn't take large bags of sweets etc to activities, he finds he is somewhat socially isolated because I limit his opportunity to play computer games.
AIBU just to up and leave and move us all to a simpler environment, away from a society where measures of success in life are judged on material wealth?

These days I think you can either have time or money. I work part time out of the house and also on a self-employed basis as an author. My kids have left home and I have lots of time to fanny about doing research for my books (otherwise known as Mumsnet, Facebook, and tiddling about reading crap). My day job (which can be up to 36 hours a week) is very low stress (I work in a supermarket, as a till jockey).

I am unstressed, have time for myself and life feels wonderful. Unfortunately, I have to juggle like crazy in order to cover all the bills, and can't afford to heat my home or have hot water. But, as I said, life is good. So, I think, if you choose lots of free time and no stress, you have to take the downside of eating the same meal four times a week and going to bed to keep warm.

I think some things are a lot better now, so this thread will probably attract a lot of people asking if you want to die at 23 of preventable disease/in childbirth, etc. etc. and completely miss the point...

We evolved to live in a completely different environemnt, and I think we need to work with that.

The main thing I think is a problem is the lack of community. As someone with depression, I can say the happiest time of my life was when living fairly communally. (Not an intentional community, but we were living in close proximinty/sharing rooms, and living in such a way/doing stuff that meant this was awesome and not a complete nightmare!)

Personally I think it depends on what you judge it on. You could argue that there is more mental health problems now, more divorce now, less marriages. Or you could say that there has been medical progress in mental health and while there is still a stigma its not so much of put up and shut up. People don't feel the need to stay in loveless marriages or abusive marriages anymore. And couples don't feel the pressure of having to be married to know you are in a committed relationship.

Yes the internet can be a dangerous place, your whole life can be placed online, bullying comes home with you and we have the whole of the internet to learn things and we spend time watching videos of cats yawning.

But the internet is also an amazing place, it has bought the world a lot closer. Demonstrations can be organised in a matter of hours rather than weeks. Its always easier to tell if a politician is lying their words are found in a simple search not weeks of pouring over hard copies.

This is the point, that was not a utopia where all women stayed home and kids were rosy cheeked cherubs playing foot ball in the street!

That is right, from where you come from - I am sure you know there are other people in the world, with other experiences.

Rape in marriage only became a crime in 1992.

So before 1992 it wasn't a crime for your husband to rape you. After all, you were his chattel so how could it be a crime?

I'd say modern life is goodish too.

Life is what you make it. I eat too much sugar and spend too much time on my phone. But I also run marathons and race bikes and am constantly outside. Imo it's when that balance isn't so good either way that dark feelings happen.

That is right, from where you come from - I am sure you know there are other people in the world, with other experiences

Hey, you were the one who said "in my grannys day women were expected to do x, which is different to now".
I pointed out that you were not speaking for all women. You can't then criticise me for saying that!

JaxingJump

We are in Nothern Vermont near the Canadian border. We moved from the UK wanting a simpler life and found it here, we are about 60 miles from the nearest town,

We grow our food. Hunt our meat. Cut wood for heating. I work remotely part of the week and travel to the office 2 days a week.

So in many ways we have removed ourselves from mainstream society and we love every moment.

That's funny. My grandmother had to deal with a husband trying to cheat with her sister (she couldn't divorce him, he had a pillar of the community job). I wonder if that grandmother knew anything about sex before she got married. Both my grandmothers were married & pg at 17 (the other gran had a husband off fighting the war... they divorced after 5 yrs).

But their lives were great compared to their grandmothers who died young or had many children die young. It's like carnage in my family tree, trying to track down all the kids who died before age 10.

gosh the good old days. When a man could openly spout racist bile or beat his children & wife with impunity & she couldn't vote in elections, either.

Everything in balance, I think. Yes, some aspects of modern life can be difficult. But there's a lot of good stuff too. Take the internet - yes, it can be a source of stress. But it can also provide support and community. I, for example, got some great breastfeeding advice on here that I wouldn't have had anywhere else. Neither my mum nor my grandmother breastfed, so I'd have been on my own.

Or modern medicine - when my grandma struggled with the menopause, she was given Valium, to which she became addicted, so she had to go cold turkey while still dealing with the menopausal symptoms. My grandpa's sister had anorexia - she couldn't access treatment, there was no NHS and even if there had been, there'd have been no real idea of how to help her. So she died.

Let your DS play computer games, just don't let him only play computer games. Let him eat sweets, just don't let him eat nothing but sweets. If anyone looks down their nose at your car, or house, or whatever, ignore them. Their opinions don't matter. For all that our society is not perfect, we are bloody lucky to have been born where and when we were so roll up your sleeves and work to make things better for sure, but don't look back with rose tinted spectacles.

Exactly what Fake said. I should have been born way earlier than I was.

Hey, you were the one who said "in my grannys day women were expected to do x, which is different to now".
I pointed out that you were not speaking for all women. You can't then criticise me for saying that!

What I actually said was:-

When you think of previous generations, my grandmas day, the only expectation was she clean house and cook the evening meal and look after the children. She was a house wife, that was her job....

Please could you point out where I said I was speaking for all women?

No you can't.

So just stop.

I was hoping for an intelligent bloody conversation

Exactly what Fake said. I should have been born way earlier than I was

Unless you were actually Fakes granny, why would you think that description would have anything to do with you?

I wonder if that grandmother knew anything about sex before she got married I remember asking my Nan this once, and she went beetroot red and said such things were not spoken of. It must have been a massive shock hahaa

Its a real shame that people are so quick to snipe at each other on here

I could say 'wow the sky is black'

and I would get someone saying ''so what you are saying is you hate the black sky?! you racist!''

So...far..off....the....mark....it's....tedious

Fake, you were CLEARLY comparing societal expectations of the two generations as a whole, and you know it. You said "Fast forward to my life - My generation are expected...."

You weren't talking about individuals, but large scale expectations. I have no idea why you are so mad about people commenting on what was obviously and clearly your point, but thats your deal.

The rest of us ARE having an intelligent conversation, you're just getting confused about what you said, which doesn't lead anyone to be able to talk to you specifically.

"move us all to a simpler environment, away from a society where measures of success in life are judged on material wealth?"

Does such a place exist?
Actually, I know home-edders who try hard to raise their kids to have those values, right in the middle of the rest of our materialistic society. If I'm honest, I sense some arrogance in how the parents view people who don't share their values. The kids seem to mostly turn out how they want, though.

That life doesn't appeal to me b/c I grew up being a weirdo in spite of my parents being fairly conventional & very materialistic. My childhood was often painful, so I would would never promote my kids being extra-weirdo.

It's about expectations. We think we can have it all and when we don't get it or things go wrong it had an impact.

Whenever I get like that I try to remember that a century ago I'd have been working in some backbreaking physical job down a mine or something as I would not have been rich and I need to appreciate how good I have it now!

My grandmother was a housewife, found it an unbearable source of pressure and tedium and was suicidally depressed. But there wasn't much awareness or help available for that sort of problem and she was ashamed, so she hid it in public and mostly took it out on her kids instead. But at least they had hot meals every evening. Good old simple life, eh? I got diagnosed with depression in my early twenties, got help, feel tons better. My depression is open, hers was secret, so if you weren't part of our family you would think she was fine and I was worse off. Lessening stigma and increasing awareness = more diagnoses, more visibility. It doesn't necessarily mean increasing problems.

"I'll take modern medicine, contraception, votes for women, marital rape being a crime etc etc over the Good Ol' Days any time" You are literally talking hundreds of years ago with most of that, I think the OP meant a bit less distant past - well that's the way I read

Hundreds of years??

Votes for women - 1928.
contraception- the pill was first approved in 1969.
Marital rape wasn't criminalised until 1991.
Modern medicine- that's a wide one, but for example, safe anaesthetics and antibiotics only started being widely available in the 20th century.

So no-where near "hundreds of years" for any of that. Most of it in the lifetimes of our grandparents.

U.K. Infant mortality rate around the 1900s were around 120 deaths per 1000 live births; now it's around 4.

The modern world is far from perfect, and there are many problems that tech and our current lifestyles cause/exacerbate, but many of those issues can be dealt with, and are a case of personal responsibility. Unlike many of the problems that beset generations as close as our own grandparents.

The thing that bothers me about this narrative is that I think it romanticises poverty, a lot of pretty oppressive practices, and a life that, for many, was shorter, nastier and contained fewer options.

I have a workmate who keeps going on about a country she visited recently on holiday, and how amazing it was because the people there are so much simpler, and happier, and more spiritual than us and don't want things like flat screen TVs and big cars and air conditioning. Now, my in laws come from said country. I've spent a fair bit of time there. I am 110% that most of the lovely simple people she met would fucking love a nice car and a decent TV and proper air conditioning. They aren't super happy with their lovely tranquil life. They are POOR. The women are hugely at risk of sexual violence, and if they are raped may well be rejected by their families or even punished for being 'promiscuous'. Access to education and medicine is hugely compromised out there, and life expectancy is significantly shorter than it is in the UK.

I love that part of the world. My DP's family have been nothing but warm and welcoming to me and I have spent a lot of precious time there and I will raise my kids to be proud of their heritage. But I don't pretend that they haven't faced some massive challenges that I'm kind of glad I haven't had to face and wouldn't wish on my children.

Compared to my Grandmothers I have a fantastic life.

Oh, and I'm also pretty glad that the modern world gave me medicine that has helped my mental health hugely. My grandmother and I suffer from the same mental health condition - me bipolar, her manic depressive (as it was called then).

I struggle, surely, but I also take four pills a day, hold down a job, have a relationship, and a life. She was taken away from her family and locked in a hospital because there was no reliable treatment for her episodes and ended up killing herself when she was two years older than I am now.

Her father, my great grandfather, probably had the same condition and died at 40, penniless and rejected as an alcoholic.

I am very very glad I live in the modern day.

I do not mean of a return to 'the good ol' days'. You can live a simple life and have a modern take on life.
To the poster who doubted the burden claim; burden is a measure used by the World Health Organisation to quantify the impact of disease. It is not a made up phenomenon. Depression and mental health disorders had the highest cost of burden in westernised societies. This was closely followed by disease which have a high correlation with lifestyle factors such as cardiovascular disease and diabetes type 2. We might be living longer but I would argue that we aren't actually healthier, we just have better health care.
I also do not deny that technology has a place in modern life but we do not know the impact of increased screen time yet. Certainly there is an increase in the incidence of Speech and Language difficulties coming through in early years children. The brain develops through a learning process and if we are removing this process (e.g through dimished interaction).
I do believe it is all about balance but personally I find that very hard to achieve. We live in a small rural town which is hardly progressive in its thinking and I find that we are in the minority when it comes to computer games etc (I do allow them btw but just restricted).

Holy moly, a person never means what they actually type on here then they can mean anything depending on what the reader wants it to mean depending on the readers agenda to whatever they twist it to mean.

So you type something, another person comes across and tells you what you really mean and then you can spend the rest of your afternoon defending and trying to explain to people who CLEARLY just want an argument over something you haven't even said.

Yes I can totally see the correlation between the above, and an intelligent conversation that you claim to be having, whilst sniping at each other

Oh I think i'm starting to understand the rules of MN now