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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be about to spontaneously combust in DH & SILs' general direction?

96 replies

WeiAnMeokEo · 22/02/2017 18:25

DH and I have had a ridiculous year. Accidental pregnancy, move across continents to have baby, DH having to retrain to stay in UK, DH having to leave me and tiny baby for 6 weeks due to visa issues, me starting own business...

We live in a 2-bed flat and our baby is 8 months old. We can't afford to move because London. I have just about come out the other side of PND.

Since 1 month postnatal, PILs were pushing for SIL to come live with us while she studies. They are from a culture where this was an impossible request to refuse, but I staged a mini coup and managed to push it back til baby was 6 months.

SIL has a serious mental illness. It has become apparent that she is much more unwell than I or dh thought and will likely need to live with someone for the rest of her life. The course she wanted to do is impossible duemail to her MH, and she is unlikely to be able to hold down a regular job. Essentially, it looks like she'll be living with us long term.

I am totally up for caring for her. I would want to do the same if my sis was ill. But. But but but. I feel manipulated by PIL - again this is partly cultural but we have had no actual convo about this, I feel like they've just decided they don't want to care for her anymore and shipped her over to us. Her behaviour is really exhausting - she's my age, but mentally like a pre teen so after a day of childcare and before working into the early hours of the morning I feel like I'm basically doing more parenting (DH is mainly at uni til late). I have literally no time to myself, so while the will is honestly there to care for her I feel super overstretched and resentful. I know it's not her fault and I know firsthand how shitty MH can be...I just feel like I am running on empty as it is, with nothing more to give.

Help? Hand hold? AGH.

OP posts:
Astro55 · 22/02/2017 21:28

And she can't work - so who pays for her? What if she needs medical help/bills - have you looked into the coat of 'care' would it be cheaper to treat her where she's from?

TheFullMrexit · 22/02/2017 21:37

DH has his hands tied culturally, ie can't go against his parents in anything really

Id love to know what culture this is - and why it matters so much. Its appalling to do this too you - appalling. Its not sustainable, so either your dh mans up about this excuse of a culture and takers her back to her dp or your looking at leaving him with your baby in the longer term.

rollonthesummer · 22/02/2017 21:45

I can't understand why you are tolerating this?

I'm also surprised that she's doing a masters level course yet cannot care for herself or live alone?

ToastyFingers · 22/02/2017 22:22

Unless she gets proper, effective (or as effective as possible) treatment for her MH problems, then I wouldn't want to raise my children in the same house, I say this as someone who has suffered chronically with MH problems, and untreated/poorly treated mental illness is no picnic to live with or alongside.

Original poster
WeiAnMeokEo · 22/02/2017 23:02

Thanks for all the replies. I've just been having some Real Talk with husband.

To answer a couple of points:

  • her parents are currently supporting her financially and will continue to, but we very strongly suspect they intend us to take this over in the long term, and a first step to this would be giving her a home.
  • she's not doing the masters. PIL wanted her to, after completing the English course, but since she has been here it has become clear she won't be able to cope with it.
  • I feel like DH is doing what he can - he's not just taking on his sis because of cultural and parental pressure - it's the reason she's had to come right now, but in the long term he wants to look after her as do I. He's concerned that by just sending her back to PIL, he's reinforcing the idea in her head that she's a burden.
  • She's never lived independently and it does seem highly unlikely she ever will - I'm not just saying that with no medical backing, it's what the family have been told. Bearing that boundary in mind, we'd both like to empower her as much as possible...we just lack resources and are very overstretched, and feel we've had a thorny mess dumped on us rather than been part of a sensible conversation about what is best for SIL and everyone else (our baby included!!)

DH now agrees that he needs to be firm with PIL on this and we need to agree a sensible plan with SIL. Hopefully this will be a step in the right direction.

Thanks all, I will report back...

OP posts:
EurusHolmesViolin · 22/02/2017 23:08

Do you and DH both understand that whatever your wishes, immigration law in the UK simply isn't going to allow you to care for her in the long run?

BoomBoomsCousin · 22/02/2017 23:54

Purple perhaps one of the things you should push for from her parents or arranging yourself, is proper health care for her mental health issues in the UK (and insurance for any other health issue that comes up) while she's here. If part of the reason the UK would be better for her is because of the better mental health care, then that might be a good focus. I realise this would be private care though, and probably very expensive.

BoomBoomsCousin · 23/02/2017 00:07

Sorry - I meant Wei Blush.

Surreyblah · 23/02/2017 00:19

She isn't eligible to live here long term so simply can't!

If your H wishes to help his sister he should take her home and seek to help arrange and pay for health and social care.

TeethDrama · 23/02/2017 00:28

I think your PIL have unrealistic expectations that sil will be entitled to/can access all sorts of help, financial and medical, and they can therefore pass the responsibility into you. Do you really think that they think she's capable of achieving masters?? Seriously? Or is that a cover story for getting her here in the first place.

Unless you & dh have lots of money for private health care for your sil, what treatment or services is she/do you think she'll get here? She's possibly worse off here than at home as it seems she don't be entitled to any nhs care (and realistically, why should she/would she be?)

TeethDrama · 23/02/2017 00:29

*Lots of autocorrects/typos but you get the drift!! Smile

Original poster
WeiAnMeokEo · 23/02/2017 00:39

boom thank you - more sound advice.

It's helpful to have so many people saying what I've kind of been thinking all along, ie she won't be able to get the visa. There's definately a tendency in DH's family to look for a series of short term 'solutions' that are often unrealistic in and of themselves, rather than address underlying issues. This is one of these occasions, and I think I'm so used to dealing with madcap, half thought through ideas coming at me from all angles that it's hard to think clearly sometimes...

The sad truth is, there is no health and social care for people with her condition in her home country, at least not of the kind that you would wish on anyone. Hence why PIL need to really face up to her condition so we can talk honestly about it and plan realistically...she has wider family back home who she gets on with so maybe they could be an option too -DH just raised this. I feel for PILs but agree with PPs who have said it is damaging for her not to do this.

OP posts:
saffronwblue · 23/02/2017 00:52

You sound so lovely - I would have run screaming much earlier on! The ILs may paint you as the enemy in preference to facing up to the real situation.
Does it help to look at it from the perspective of everyone's different needs?
Sil's
Pils
You and DH
Your child

You are responsible for your child's wellbeing in the way they are for theirs. Their child's needs cannot trump yours. Really hope you can all find a way through this mess that supports Sil but not at the expense of your own family wellbeing and mental health.

GardenGeek · 23/02/2017 01:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Figment1234 · 23/02/2017 01:36

I am an immigration lawyer... she won't get a visa. She can stay as a visitor for up to six months a year, as you've discovered, but if an immigration officer sees that she is essentially resident here, she will not be allowed in. She may manage one six month stay but after that they will be suspicious. And there is no family visa which applies in her circumstances.

TinselTwins · 23/02/2017 01:44

- She's never lived independently and it does seem highly unlikely she ever will - I'm not just saying that with no medical backing, it's what the family have been told.

It's highly likely that that is true only because her only treatment is tranquillisers.
Is it possible that someone with the same condition could have very different outcomes and live independantly as a result of better care/support/treatment?

Could you pay to have her assessed here in order to support a better care plan you help to put in place for her back home? If her assessments are being done in a place where you say that MH is like the 50s here, there won't be the right information and advice informing the family's and her decisions.

SanitysSake · 23/02/2017 05:16

I'd definitely be getting a private independent mental health assessment done here in the UK, to get things officially documented and provide a clearer picture of the long-term requirements. I'd also use it as a massive bargaining chip to give yourself some time. Tough situation, OP. My thoughts are with you.

annandale · 23/02/2017 06:08

Do you have any feeling about what she would actually like to do, where she wants to live? Not that you have to fulfil that, but what are her goals?

I agree with asking the PILs to fund a private MH assessment, which can also be done in the context of 'of course as she isn't ordinarily resident here she isn't covered by the NHS' which helps to set a little mood music. Perhaps physical health too? I know that people with mental health diagnoses get bad physical health care here in the UK, I'm sure it's the same elsewhere.

BoomBoomsCousin · 23/02/2017 06:32

Is it possible, given the cultural approach to mental health in their country, that it's basically beyond their ability to conceive of a good future for her? And if so, might this be part of what stops them from trying to plan it out? I'm just wondering if a bit of work on showing them what people in your SIL's situation can expect in the UK ^with considered, well planned care" would help in getting them to start thinking about planning properly.

TeethDrama · 23/02/2017 07:12

Wei - there's no health or social care here for her either. Nothing that she will be able to access unless paid for privately and then she only has 6 months in which to access it (and I presume she's already a few months into that?)

The reality is that she will be going back so plans for her return have to be made, anything else is unrealistic. The idea of having her privately assessed here so a little more us known about her condition seems a good one. If your pils can afford to oay for her while she's here, and she's done a degree in home country, why is it that there is absolutely no Health or social care available? They have universities there but there isn't one up to date mental health doctor to be found in the country???

Surreyblah · 23/02/2017 07:19

Your H needs to get real. He is looking for unrealistic solutions (extended family etc). Needs to get things straight in his head and perhaps seek his sister's consent to private MH/SN assessments. She will have to return to their parents until their parents are not well enough to care for her.

Original poster
WeiAnMeokEo · 23/02/2017 07:45

Wow, thank you for a series of incredibly helpful posts! That has genuinely helped me get things a bit straighter in my mind.

Some responses:

  • she has schizophrenia. I think I used the wrong word for her meds, apologies - they are antipsychotics but their effect is to make her dull and slow her down significantly...kind of like she"s moving through treacle? They also make her rock from side to side whenever she sits or stands still.
  • I think assessment here is something to maybe look into. Unfortunately teeth what you describe is about the size of it: their home country developed incredibly quickly so tech and infrastructure (and actually their physical healthcare) is streets ahead of the UK but social and MH attitudes are pretty shocking from our perpective. It's worth noting that a good deal of her infantilisation is down to being a woman as well as her illness :(
  • boom definitely. I have kind of been trying to take this tack - looking at more realistic pathways for her that will also help to build her self esteem - as someone else mentioned, language study is no picnic for her. She was actually fluent before she got ill, but she kind of 'reset' to her preteen self and also can't think metaphorically or quickly enough to progress as she'd like to on the course .

Thanks again. As you can see, it's a shit situ for her and I genuinely want her to be OK and properly supported. You are helping me see that I can't do that alone!

OP posts:
TestingTestingWonTooFree · 23/02/2017 08:26

Antipsychotics are tricky drugs and they do come with lots of unpleasant side effects. There are however lots of varieties, maybe another would be better for her. In the time she is able to stay with you, I'd try getting a review of her medication. Can you ask PIL in a vague way for money (to allow them to burry their heads in the sand for a bit)?

brummiesue · 23/02/2017 09:02

Wow the entitlement is astounding...thinking she can be 'sent over' to access nhs services and social care Hmm
As everyone has said, prepare your argument, get your op to grow a pair, stand up to his family and explain their expectations are unrealistic

MorrisZapp · 23/02/2017 09:12

Did you know your husband did whatever his parents asked for cultural reasons before you married him? It seems a standard trope on here. Marrying men from outrageous, woman hating cultures then battling the inlaws forevermore. You didn't marry them or their 'culture'. Luckily the law will sort this one out if pp are correct. You could help this along by contacting the relevant authorities yourself, and finding out how long sil can stay in UK. After that, all you can do is send sympathetic emails or if you've decided jointly with your dh to do so, money.

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