Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Primark forced to remove racist t-shirt from sale

296 replies

Soubriquet · 22/02/2017 17:38

link

I don't watch the walking dead. So this reference would have gone straight over my head.

But again I'm the generation who sang catch a tiger by its toe so wouldn't have immediately gotten the racist connection either.

But once it was pointed out, I got it and agree it should definitely be removed

What were they thinking making this?

OP posts:
GunnyHighway · 22/02/2017 20:51

squishysquirmy what's your frame of reference?

MrsDoylesTeabags · 22/02/2017 20:52

£20!!! Bloody hell Gamer have they got big windows?

MrsDoylesTeabags · 22/02/2017 20:54

and stripy t shirts?

Starlight2345 · 22/02/2017 20:55

I am a child of the 70's so knew the original rhyme.Did not understand the words as a child.

AS an adult who has not seen TWD no i did not understand the reference to TWD but did take me straight back to the rhyme.

gamerchick · 22/02/2017 20:55

There's no such tee. There are loads of burn them all tees but wouldn't have registered because I'm not into game of thrones.

It's not comparable, whine to the comics that created TWD if it bugs you that much.

That scene was a pivotal moment in the show. It's been marked. Although how the next lot after negan is going to match it boggles my head.

HateSummer · 22/02/2017 20:58

I love TWD but I wouldn't spend £20 on a TShirt 😆...I wouldn't buy a £5 TShirt from Primark either though. I saw their Harry Potter stuff and it was all cheap and flimsy material.

Just adding a meme here to calm people down.

Primark forced to remove racist t-shirt from sale
sibys1 · 22/02/2017 20:58

I'm a child of the 90s but knew the racist version of the rhyme as a kid.

limitedperiodonly · 22/02/2017 21:02

Soloman anhd gamerchick You're both right, it was Eugene. Thanks. I don't know why I forgot.

But as Eugene might say: 'That t shirt was a grievous provocation to many people and therefore should have been withdrawn from sale or circulation in order to prevent escalation of the situation to said people. This is what I truly believe.' Grin

squishysquirmy · 22/02/2017 21:03

Bu gamerchick, the walking dead shirt wouldn't have registered to me, because I am not into TWD. If I hadn't read this thread and saw someone on the street wearing a shirt with those words and that picture, I would assume it was a reference to lynch mobs. As would many other people.

I have no problem with TWD, and have no wish to insult the show, but I fully understand why people complained, and why Primark removed the shirt from sale.

If they had included the second line from the nursery rhyme with tiger/baby/knicker etc, probably no-one would have complained. It's the ambiguity combined with the historical context of real mobs beating real black people to death in living memory that makes the T-shirt threatening, and a poor choice for a brand like Primark.

sibys1 · 22/02/2017 21:05

gamerchick - but, in the context of the show, it doesn't sound like the rhyme was used in any sort of racist way.

But if you strip the line of the context of the show, then people are going to interpret it within the wider context. That wider context includes the commonly-known, racist version of the rhyme.

And again, for people that don't know the TWD context about the bat, the shirt looks even worse.

Honestly, if I had seen someone wearing it I don't would have thought that they were advocating violence against black people. I think that's how a lot, possibly even the majority, of people who hadn't seen the show would interpret it.

No racist intent, but full of violent and racist connotations.

gamerchick · 22/02/2017 21:16

Even this thread shows that every single person knows and has used that counting rhyme in one form or another, it was something before the offensive version and it was something after. It'll always be a counting rhyme and I personally think that if your mind takes you straight to the offensive version says a lot more about how someones secret brain works than any stupid teeshirt with a sentence from a tv show.

Course that's just my own opinion Wink

ReasonsToBeModeratelyHappy · 22/02/2017 21:18

I think some people need to accept that the connotations of something don't have to be known and fully understood to absolutely everyone, in order to be offensive.

I bet there are plenty of slurs against various groups which I have never come across, and would not know the meaning of, but that doesn't make them any less real, or offensive to the people who have suffered them.

PurpleDen · 22/02/2017 21:18

Do people not understand the difference between being 'offended' and feeling scared? Thinking someone may want to do you harm?

I have never seen TWD, there's no obvious reference to the tshirt being linked to a TV show. It's just a racist nursery rhyme next to an image of a blooded baseball bat.

Lucky you if you don't have to bother with being upset by something like this.

ReasonsToBeModeratelyHappy · 22/02/2017 21:21

gamerchick, the offensive version has been around since at least the 1800's, just because it wasn't the first version you heard, doesn't make that untrue.

category12 · 22/02/2017 21:26

Since the version using the racial slur has been in use since the 1880s and it's only since around the 1980s really that tiger/spider and all the other variations came into use widely, I'm not sure that IF there were previous non-racist versions they're relevant.

The population of people who grew up with the racist version rather outweighs the number of people who watch the Walking Dead now. Hmm

sibys1 · 22/02/2017 21:27

gamerchick - yes, my brain goes

^"I have previously heard two versions of the rhyme and know both have been in common usage during my lifetime, one says 'catch a tigger', the other 'catch a n***'. So far as I know, the 'tigger' version is a sanitised version of the racist version.

I wonder what they've stopped after the first line of the rhyme and included a picture of a barbed, baseball bat......oh"^

Maybe if I'd seen TWD my brain would have instantly recognised the intended context, but I haven't and it didn't.

It astounds me that people continue to defend the shirt tbh.

Mynestisfullofempty · 22/02/2017 21:28

I personally think that if your mind takes you straight to the offensive version says a lot more about how someones secret brain works than any stupid teeshirt with a sentence from a tv show.

gamerchick I was born in 1954 and the racist version is the only version I know and is therefore the only version I think of when I hear or read "eeny meeny miny mo". I have never watched The Walking Dead so any references to that would be lost on me. That doesn't mean I'm a racist it means I was born in the 50's and haven't heard anyone sing any other versions so it's inevitably the racist version that comes to mind, though I wish it wouldn't. Therefore I would not want to see this t-shirt.

BreatheDeep · 22/02/2017 21:29

gamerchick I know that rhyme from my childhood when I said piggy. I also know it from later life when I found out that piggy was not the original word and the rhyme was previously racist. I do not know that rhyme from TWD. If I saw that t-shirt with those words and a huge offensive weapon I wouldn't think 'oh, they want to beat a pig up with a baseball bat' because that is not a known event in history. Beating black people unfortunately is. So yes, my mind would go there and I would definitely wonder why the fuck they were wearing it. If I only knew the piggy version I would probably wonder why they would want to beat a pig. If it had some way of showing it was from TWD, like a logo, then I would think they must use it in the program meaning beating zombies.

It's the lack of context that is the issue.

gamerchick · 22/02/2017 21:31

Flushes out the fans like I said. Just like my other tees flush out the gamers of the game referenced.

A bit like a smoking corner.

I wouldn't wear that tee, too bland. If I'm referencing negan I want his name and picture on that mofo.

PencilsInSpace · 22/02/2017 21:36

It's just a racist nursery rhyme next to an image of a blooded baseball bat.

This.

Willyoujustbequiet · 22/02/2017 21:37

Its not racist. We grew up saying fishy by the toe.

You'd have to have been living under a rock not to know TWD and Negan said tiger anyway.

Honestly whoever complained needs to get a bloody grip.

picklemepopcorn · 22/02/2017 21:39

This highlights the need to have a more diverse workforce in the design chain of that tshirt, and in all businesses. They clearly needed older minority ethnic workers involved at some point to spot the issue. Under forties perhaps could miss the connotation.
How could anyone miss that connotation? What were they thinking?

category12 · 22/02/2017 21:39

I'm sure few people would have a problem with a t-shirt with Negan and so on on it, gamerchick. That's context.

The problem with the t-shirt under discussion is the lack of context other than start of a racist nursery rhyme and a baseball bat.

picklemepopcorn · 22/02/2017 21:40

You'd have to be living under a rock to miss that the rhyme was racist. Jeremy Clerkson anyone?

ReasonsToBeModeratelyHappy · 22/02/2017 21:46

WillYouJustBeQuiet - will you, please :-)?

Your attitude is astounding. TWD is not the height of culture and knowledge - not knowing about it will have no effect on someones life. It is just one of many TV series provided for entertainment, which will be forgotten in 5-10 years.