To wonder if you're one of the older members of a large family you ever stop and think

[PlayOnWurtz]

No more kids please mum and dad!

How much were you expected to do to support them?

Thats why I specified "we all"

Do pay attention.

Its only manners after all.

Fine
You also generalised
"Most people with larger families have larger houses"

It is that generalisation that is being questioned
"Do pay attention.

Its only manners after all."

Oh no danger there.

I stand by my assertion. Most do have larger houses.

Not all or even most are noisy and crowded.

But if you have the need to believe that they are it is, as I said previously perfectly understandable.

"The proportion of large families has declined over the last 60 years. Now only a third of children live in a family with three or more dependent children and only 10 per cent in a family with four or more.
However, in 2004/5, 50 per cent of children in 4+-child families were poor compared with only 23 per cent in one-child families.
Children in 4+-child families constitute 19 per cent of all poor children.
Parents of children in large families are more likely to be not working, from ethnic minorities, have had their first child at younger ages, be less educated and have a young child.
All these characteristics are associated with a higher risk of poverty. However, the study found that large families had a higher risk of child poverty independently of these factors."

www.jrf.org.uk/report/child-poverty-large-families

I stand by my assertion. Most do have larger houses

Do you mean 'most people I know have larger houses'?
Because that is clearly very different from 'most people' and is just plain wrong

www.jrf.org.uk/report/child-poverty-large-families

50% of children living in families with 4 or more children are in poverty, compared to 23% of children in 1 child families

Families with 4+ children make up 10% of over all families but 20% of families in poverty

Surely you can accept your assertion is incorrect?

No WAY can children in abnormally big families get the amount of parental attention they deserve - and many probably crave.

This is a ridiculous statement. It may be the case for some large families that all the children do not get sufficient attention. It's also the case for some small families. It is not correct to say it's impossible to give children in large families the amount of parental attention they deserve. How do you quantify this attention? Time? Quality? How many hours, per parent, per week, per child? What form must that attention take? Is it a universally known quantity or is it an amount of time/quality of time you've decided arbitrarily? Does it count if another child is in the house at the same time? Does it count if it's in the car on the way to pick up another child from an activity? Does it have to be verbal or can it be physical? What are your rules?

It's fucking ridiculous to set yourself up as the arbiter of how much parental attention is obligatory, and make a statement that it is absolutely impossible for a parent of multiple children to provide that.

Anyway im off to do the run.

If you dig up any stats that support your assertion that larger families have significantly lower incomes id be very interested in reading through them.

Thanks

Cross posted there.

Thanks for the stats.

It says largely nothing about house size or geographical variables but I'll read it fully on my return.

It says loads about geographical variables.

A child in a family of 5 plus is 4 times more likely to be poor than a child in a one child family.

Not sure why this would either surprise or annoy you really. It doesn't say anything about your own family.

It says largely nothing about house size or geographical variables but I'll read it fully on my return.

It says that parents of larger families have lower educational attainment and lower likelihood. There is also a graph which shows the levels of poverty before housing costs are taken into account - the level for 4+ children families is much much higher than all other family sizes and is going back to the 1990s.

I really can't see why you would think families who are already under the poverty line before housing is taken into account, have lower education and are less likely to have a job are still living in nice big houses

Ok forgetting dress sizes.

No morning sickness, just nausea.
No stretchmarks
Pelvic floor fine
No pain relief for labour other than gas and air.
No tears.

jed
A large scale scientific study has found that parents of large families spend less time per child interacting with their children, and that is directly linked to lower attainment of those children.

www.nber.org/papers/w21824
And a summary of the research here:
www.businessinsider.com/kids-from-big-families-less-likely-to-succeed-2015-12?IR=T
"Our fixed effect estimates indicate that the arrival of a younger sibling reduces measures of parental investment as well as cognitive and non-cognitive outcomes of older children by approximately one-tenth of a standard deviation," the researchers said"
On top of that, the researchers found that over time children didn't grow out of the negative effects.

"Not only do we fail to find evidence that the impact is transitory, effects appear to substantially worsen over the longer run," they said. "Test scores and parental investments are both worse over the longer horizon than in the short run. Only in behavioral problems do we find that the effects may dissipate over the longer run."

And sorry to disappoint, i have a first class degree, my children are above average in a lot of subjects at school (different subjects for different kids) and my children love reading and studying.

I know loads of large families and am related to many. We would love to have as many and so would many of our cousins and friends, but we are all aware that costs etc are different now. My parents don't regret a thing but mum said to me that having six would be a bit hard with my career plans . Shame! I'm aiming for 4 , which seems to be the modern definition of large family. A number of friends and cousins are aiming similarly.

There is some true residents of Lake Wobegon on this thread!

miserablesod Tue 07-Feb-17 15:41:45

And sorry to disappoint, i have a first class degree, my children are above average in a lot of subjects at school (different subjects for different kids) and my children love reading and studying.

Ah well that proves that the research must be wrong then. Clearly your family is representative of all large families and the one's that were studied were all outliers.

sparechange why do you keep on at me?? You're weird. Did I say all parents in all large families are giving enough attention? No. I said that it is fucking ridiculous to say it is IMPOSSIBLE for parents of large families to do that. It's not impossible. How much is 'enough' parental attention? It's a 'how long is a piece of string' argument. Presumably if you REALLY love your children you will only have one then, to avoid damaging them by one tenth of a deviation.

Studies also show that the immune system of children in large families particularly when sharing rooms is better, and the more siblings you have the less likely you are to be obese. I guess those who have fewer kids don't care about their physical wellbeing the BASTARDS. Oh hang on - that's a ridiculous over-generalisation, isn't it.

if you don't have the attention from the beginning because every 12-18 months or so your mum pops out another kid then you would get used to having to centre naps/babies needs into the rhythm of life. Of having knackered parents who are doing the box ticking bit of making sure you are fed and watered but none of the emotional stuff because DC's 6/7/8 need to be in bed for 7 so you'll be fine at your school concert/match because it clashes with nursery pick up.

I don't believe all the parents of 5+ have the energy, emotionally or physically to deal in the optimum way with the demands of every child within that families emotional need.

The thing is hodd that many of us are very capable, effective, energetic, involved parents, whether you choose to believe so is academic.

You cant magically change us in to shit parents by sheer force of will.

Sorry about that.

i am sure you are, and that you have time turners in your people carrier glove compartments too...

Ah sarcasm I see,

The bastard love child of the union of arrogance and inferiority complex within ones psyche.

How simply awful for you

Agreed.

As your opinion of my parenting abilities and attainment speaks to nobody but your own sense of self aggrandising and misplaced pseudo superiority.