Quick need help with refusing to work extra hours

[Againagain97]

Can't link my original thread, sorry!

Basically working for a company for nine months that are totally unreasonable. Desperately they need to employ extra staff which they acknowledge. However, they make various excuses and never hire them. Offered position to one person and then changed their mind, didn't even email her that they'd changed their mind. They just didn't respond to her emails asking about contract etc and she eventually gave up!

Anyway pre Christmas I did literally 100s extra hours for them to meet target. I've now cut back not to strict hours but not doing three extra hours per day and working at the weekend.

It's obvious, work pilling up, they are non stop moaning (shouting) that it's not good enough. I've Requested planning meeting to discuss situation, but it never happens.

So today top lady is in and she is going to go mad, it'll be

"I'm sick of this"

"Everyone is lazy"

"It's not good enough"

How can I calmly and rationally say, I'm not doing ridiculous hours. You've not even sat down with me to discuss how we intend to tackle this. You're not really recruiting.

You think that shouting at me will get the work done, I don't respond to that!

They gave me a significant bonus for reaching target, but it only really compensated me for extra hours.

FWIW my CV is being drafted and I have recruitment agency looking at jobs for me.

So hopefully this situation won't be for much longer.

PS. they also paid salaries late again this month, which drives me mad as they have done this before. Not even an apology. Just shrug their shoulders.

You're right! But I need to calmly tell them this. Top lady shouts and screams!

Sorry posted too soon, how do I calmly articulate the reason why work is piling up?

Have you got proof if the extra hours you can lay out in front of her? Print off of a clocking in system or evidence of your start and finish times during the last however many months?

Back it up with proof and justify the need for a new member of staff.

When she shouts, keep your voice low and ask her not to shout at you. Take the higher ground.

Will anyone else be in this meeting?

I think qwerty has a point make it unattractive to them by demanding an increased rate for unsocialable hours. Be very clear that payment for past overtime hasn't been forthcoming and that payment must be timely and not dependent on target.

late payments of salary screams cashflow problems to me.
good luck with the job hunt

I trained my colleagues to say 'I'd love to help but unfortunately I can't that day/evening.... And repeat.

If pressed...personal stuff. Sorry I don't want to discuss it.

I was the only one that wasn't dragged in to cover all the time. I covered when I could but wasn't prepared to keep cancelling things.

I have proof in as much as emails sent early and late? But not everytime. Could also possibly get list of times I've logged in from home at the weekends?

To PP who said they reckon a cash flow issue, im 100% sure it's not. They are doing really well. It's utter disregard and disrespect that makes them pay late. No member of staff is ever good enough or worth their salary according to them.

I quote "I've never interviewed anyone who I've really wanted to employ"

Right......that sums it up!

Contact ACAS today, this is illegal.

The Acas helpline number is 0300 123 1100. It is available Monday 8am-8pm, Tuesday 8am-6pm, Wednesday to Thursday 8am-8pm, Friday 8am-6pm and Saturday 9am-1pm.

www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=2042

As long as you're in an EU country, you're protected by the 48 hour working directive (unless they put a waiver in your contract - however, I believe that legally you're allowed to reject the waiver at any time).

I can't stand screamers/shouters. It shows a complete lack of control and professionalism. I worked for a boss who would lose his rag on a huge scale regularly and I would calmly state that I wouldn't discuss anything while he was speaking to me like that and exit. He would calm down and we could talk properly and effectively without the dramatics.
Be honest! It's not rude to give the proper reasons things are not working. If she won't take your points on board, continue with your job hunt and move on.

I also recommend ACAS.

Don't do any unpaid work. Shrug right back at them.

I agree with walking away when she shouts and rants. Say that you'll have a conversation when she can talk with respect.
Show her what evidence you have of the extra hours you work. Tell her you feel bullied and unappreciated. Tell her you will be talking to ACAS next time your salary is late.
Or, if you've reached the end of your tether (unsurprisingly), tell her youre consulting a third party about the bullying, shouting, working hours and late pay and will let her know details of your grievance.

I once worked for a company who MADE us go home at 5pm. I asked my boss why I couldn't just finish something off after 5 and he said if I was staying late then he wasn't helping me work effectively, was giving too much to do, or I was feeling that I wasn't doing enough and he assured me I was.

If she mentions the bonus she paid you, you can say that it effectively worked out as payment at £2.50 per hour (say) of overtime you worked (do a quick calculation of bonus / approx how many hours to get a rough figure)

Stay calm, don't raise your own voice, put forward your plan to get the work done (employing X more people / paying overtime to those who work extra hours).

Log from now on the extra hours you do.

Then leave, if necessary citing the fact that they haven't followed your advice! Good luck OP. They sound awful.

Brilliant advice...thank you!

Right at the start of your discussion today you have to say that you want to set ground rules. these include no shouting, screaming or swearing. if she does this you will walk away until she is prepared to be calm. and you have to actually stick to this firmly.

has she ever actually working in the business herself? suggest she comes in for the whole of next week to see what is going on rather than shouting about laziness from afar. I have met loads of people in my industry that do this - never done the job so no idea of the pressures. when they come in for a week and do the work themselves it really changes their view on what is and isn't achievable in a day.

if your pay is late consistently then ask her why. explain the issues that it causes you as you have regular bills to pay and ask her what she is going to do to put it right.

if they want you to work above your hours then they need to pay overtime. unfortunately they have got away with this because you have been too nice and enabled their bad behaviour. you need to stop because they never will.

are you able to have someone else in the meeting with you? I would strongly advise having another work colleague there and taking notes.

In the long run though of course you need to move jobs and as soon as you can would be best.

If you really want to tell her then send an email. Although I'd hurry with that CV and leave the day after signing a new contract. If they're not playing nice you don't have to.

I would just keep telling them that your hours and x til y, and unless payment is coming for the additional hours then you won't be doing it again. Especially as the actual wage was late this time. And stop doing extra hours that you are not getting paid for.

Is this cornflake spitting woman? If so it won't get better, you need to move on. Sorry

If you aren't being paid for the extra hours does that bring you below the minimum wage?

They can't just bully employees. I think I'd file a formal complaint and see where that goes. And like suggested - seek outside help.

I have recruitment agency looking at jobs for me

I have no idea of your role or position, so just a thing: if you are really senior and/or really specialised, head hunters will be fighting to find you a new job. Otherwise, as good as agencies can be, their clients are the companies (not the job seekers) so their job is to fill a vacancy and send the best CVs. It's not to find a job for someone.
I only mean you have to be proactive and apply for roles, a recruiter doesn't keep your CV on his desk and scroll through all his job ads to find the best one for you. They would love to, but they have hundred of very good CVS and very good people to help!

I'm extremely fortunate to have a career that has a huge lack of qualified candidates.

It took two years for them to find someone, they left within two months.

Then I joined about six months later, based on previous employee in this position, I should get a long service award!

Anyhow, good news....I have an initial telephone interview on Monday and a "real" interview the following Tuesday evening.

Fingers crossed!