to ask about experiences bringing up low tech kids

[rattlingaround75]

This is a hypothetical post - I don't have kids, and don't plan to have any for health reasons. Am a long term member and regular namechanger, am not a newspaper reporter, but I understand if people are wary at threads like this.

Although I don't have kids, I do think in detail about how, if I did, I might want to raise them; one thing is that, at least during primary years, I wouldn't want them to have any of the gadgets that I didn't have growing up in the 80s, and as far as poss only to be exposed to broadcast TV at home (no recorded or catchup - some other people had videos when I was a kid, we didn't), and my own home based internet use would be very limited and mostly in the study. (This all assumes similar standards of living to what my own parents had, including space for a study in the house.)

I feel that schools like Acorn: www.theguardian.com/education/2015/sep/29/the-no-tech-school-where-screens-are-off-limits-even-at-home
with zero screens policy for home and school go slightly too far; some TV is good to have contact with the cultural context, and I am glad I learnt some programming in primary school (computers then felt like a work tool, not an addictive leisure activity - I only knew one kid with games computers and they were really bad at the games).

Do people manage to get nannies who won't put kids to play on tablets and phones and use them in front of them? Older nannies? (I realise all this would be undoable using childminders and is a luxury or SAHP choice!)

I would be a lot more laid back re teens as I think it's really important to be involved in contemporary pop culture at that age, but I would want a kid to have a grounding of how to manage / be/ entertain themselves without the web and of "slower" ways of thinking, and of not expecting the instant gratification of TV on demand. (Really, I think it would be great for the internet to be for adults, like driving is, you'd learn more social skills before you used it, as my own generation did, never having used it as kids, but that's not how it works, sadly.)

I did know one of those families with no TV when I was a kid (which was the 80s equivalent) ; they were very serious people, but I found their house rather romantic and intriguing.

I'd guess that because this is the internet, the families doing this might not be around to talk about it, but maybe people tried and abandoned it because it was too difficult? or have friends who do?

rattling

Just to give another perspective on on demand TV. It doesn't teach "instant gratification" it teaches choice.

My children sit and review what's available in Netflicks, discuss genre and negotiate a programme between them.

They don't just sit in front of the TV and zone out to whatever is on- which is what lots of kids did in my day.

Btw my children are never watching TV in that "early evening" slot you mention. They are doing music practice, packing bags for school, setting out their packed lunches and eating dinner, having baths and bedtime stories.

I get quite annoyed at the suggestion that technology use equals poor parenting. We have quite a lot of technology in the house but the children have been able to sit at a table throughout a meal since they were babies.

We would never pull out a tablet or phone for them in a restaurant/cafe/waiting room/queue or on a car journey.

Yep I've only just got a mobile myself. Still no DVD in car. Kids used to travel to South of France from birth with zilch, sit through lengthy French meals with zilch, go on holiday with zilch......

Yyy to on demand TV. Best thing ever for getting kids to watch better quality TV.

I often think parents who are scared of tech with DC are simply scared of saying no. I am the parent and I parent. They have access to the good stuff but I am in control. Yes they can moan at times but better that than they miss out. I feel strong enough as a parent to handle it.

I'm just thinking about what we've done this evening. DCs are 1 and 4.

Got in from school at 3.50pm, zoned out in front of TV for 20 mins. Then they played until dinner at 4.45pm, then they had dinner. Then the 4 year old did cosmic kids yoga for 40 mins, then he played pairs, then he did his reading book and now he's playing something fireman sam based in the bath.

After a day of practicing a nativity, the usual school phonics stuff and then an afternoon of Forest School I don't think that's a harmful balance.

I tried to resist technology for my kids who are now 16 and 18 - it was impossible. They just felt hard done by and weird so we gave in and let them have access - they had the whole lot: PS4s, phones, TV etc.
However, when they were about 12 and 14 we went to a party which was mainly adults (DP's departmental Xmas gathering at head of dept's house). Our two boys chatted sociably, were able to make conversation, were confident, intelligent and engaging. People noticed and commented.
There was another boy there about the same age, he hadn't been allowed any technical stuff at all his entire life, wasn't even allowed to watch TV. He was incapable of making conversation, was awkward and frankly rather dull. This wasn't necessarily due a lack of technology but it made me think that maybe getting immersed in technology wasn't going to make the social unsocial and vice versa.
I came to realise that technology may even have had some benefits.

This sounds like Luddism to me. We are in the 21st century, not some idealised 1950's childhood with worthy wooden toys and books.

My dd loves her ipads and youtube. She has a ps 3 and an old smartphone of mine. She's at least 2 years ahead of her reading age and is fantastic at drawing. She taught herself from youtube vids.

Technology is a fantastic learning tool too!

Mine have wooden toys. Because I'm fed up of shitty plastic toys falling apart

And ds had a play station for his 5th birthday. He's 23 now, sociable,politically active and doing an MA. It didn't affect him badly in any way.

This is like that Lee & Herring sketch about an Amish community who wouldn't use anything made after 1982, so they all have ZX Spectrums but think Nintendos are witchcraft etc

I completely disagree OP, everything in moderation of course but I know a lot of engineers and all of them developed their interest and skills from an early introduction to computers and video games. My DH is a software develop engineer and runs a games studio and my DB is also an engineer at Google. It infuriates me a little that I had to go through university and then do a graduate degree to become a lawyer (it was a career change) and they both just needed to get a university degree yet they both out-earn me significantly. I hate that I don't know how to write code because it will be as important a subject for future generations as English and Maths are.

To be honest if you are a good parent, you are a good parent regardless of how much technology you have in the house.

The "they don't need to be on screens they need to be climbing trees" always makes me laugh. Like it's absolutely mutually exclusive.

My DD got home at 3.30, did her homework, read some of her book, played with her dolls, had a riding lesson. She's watched a minecraft vid on YouTube. Pretty decent mix of activity there.

most tech these days is so user friendly that you can pick it up within days. I bought an iPad and used it straight out of the box

you haven't seen my ineptitude with a touch screen. I still struggle with WYSIWIG some days. More seriously, I hate how dirty touch screens get. But how wasteful to keep wiping it, too.

My only thought about low-tech is the stress some people put themselves under to enforce it.... or even require relatives to enforce those rules, too. I knew a child not allowed any live broadcast TV (it causes ADHD, don't you know).

12yo DS does stuff in MS Word at least once a month, but he's terrible with it. Drives me nuts all his clumsy ways of doing things. Needs more practice! He'd be clueless at PPT.

My child (4 at the time) was "developmentally behind" on a reception report in only one area - operating technology. I felt so guilty for holding him back. So since then I binned off limits and what he was allowed to use, now he has to help me on the xbox.

I think it's better to teach children how to live well in the world we're In, not the world we can't go back to.

My kids have no computers or whiteboards at school and no iPads or games consoles at home. This is an economic choice rather than an ethical one though.

Mine (aged 13 and 15) don't have 'phones, except for a shared, very basic ( non internet) 'phone that they use for practical purposes eg if they are on a school trip and need to be able to tell me the pick up time. They have ipad that they are allowed to use once they've done their prep.

I think the main thing is to keep them away from constant smartphone use until they have developed good social skills anx other interests.

I would add that neither of them is bothered to have a 'phone, although almost all of their friends do. The school has a policy of making thd pupils hand their 'phones in during school hours.

Smartphones are difficult to restrict though when even our local scout group only communicates by whatsapp.

It is very interesting to imagine how to raise hypothetical children. It is a thought experiment not actual child rearing though.

I made many plans and had all sorts of ideas how I thought children should be raised. I thought limiting screen time was a good idea and ensuring access to libraries, art and nature essential - I still do but...

But then you actually meet your children and find out their personalities and individual needs are a big part of how you need to parent. Equally my personality and limitations are instrumental in how well my aspirations match my reality as a parent.

I was raised in a very low tech household, didn't get a video til late 1980s (I was born in 74), lots of books in the house, slightly hippy parents, politically active socially aware etc.

My children have access to a lot of tech with few time restrictions. Timetable for a shared centrally located pc and a tablet each. The two older children are HF ASD and need alot of downtime, they may be considered weird and socially awkward by their peers, but they are the most polite and well spoken children you could wish to meet. Adults love them, other children are less enthusiastic

They get alot of enjoyment and value from technology and are likely going to work in high tech environments - I feel very fortunate to live in a time when technology can have such a positive impact on my children's lives. We have meals seated together without tech. We have loads of books, music and art in our lives, technology can enrich not just impoverish your life.

Youngest dd is in a drama club and is our normal (nt) child whatever that means! She has great fun with her big sister online when they interact in a roblox game while also shouting across to each other in the living room. They invent games and worlds in Minecraft. They learn drawing and programming skills on scratch. They are supervised and have plenty of conversations with me about staying safe online and how to report unwanted attention and abusive language.

I am not parenting how I planned but no one told me how much impact the children I got would have. They are not bits of clay to mould, they are very definite people and I have learned to be a responsive parent. They have taught me how to be a parent and they are still teaching me!

its not all or nothing

My kids are doing fine at school using ms software and programming and they have access to this at home on a limited basis but generally go on when they ask

They have no games consoles and don't really watch tv. I don't see how that will harm their development. They don't have much interest in tv anyway.

You'd be doing them a great disservice, imo.
Where do you think technology will be by the time any of your potential children become adults? Do you really want to restrict their knowledge/input into that world?
Don't believe all you read on MN. Children who grow up with open access to screens and technology do actually turn out ok you know

Limiting use of technology is sensible, but raising a 'no tech' child, or one that is only exposed to technology that was available a generation ago, feels like a vanity project or a statement.

I am a geek so feel there is a difference between tech and entertainment. DP do not have nor want kids but as this is a thought experiment I'd say that from an early age I would want them to use technology to learn and develop. To know what information is out there and how to access it on a number of different platforms. I would also like them involved in coding schools and simple computers like the RasberryPI from a young age.

All of that is different from watching television. Even then though I'd be encouraging them to think about what they want to watch and why rather than just have something on a screen - probably even as far as unlimited documentaries but limited time with toy-promoting-cartoons.

We are living in the digital age, there will be driverless cars in our lifetime, house robots etc. Can you imagine that world and what the opportunities and skills we need to provide children to grow up in such a world? Why do you think they are teaching Scratch (a programming language) in primary schools now? There will be huge demands for jobs in technology in the future generations, a 'no tech' child would be at a huge disadvantage.

Low tech makes some sense for toddlers, but not afterwards in my experience. The low tech kids I know are glued to tech the moment they can (school, friends houses, grandma...). Low tech teens would really be outsiders. Why artificially produce some weird Amish experience in a high tech world?

We are low tech. Rarely watch TV except for sport or certain specific programmes like Bake Off (on catch-up). We don't have any consoles or anything. Watches the odd CBeebies program when he is unwell etc. Don't encourage games on the iPad. DS is nearly 5 and can read fluently and add/subtract/multiply/divide (has basically covered the entire KS1 maths curriculum) without using technology. We have been doing some basic coding at home. He has ICT at school. As he grows older and needs to use technology more (for homework etc) we will be happy to let him. Since we are not big TV watchers it has worked out fine but it wasn't a principle or philosophy we started out with in any form. Average evening he is home at 3:30, quick snack, will sit and do something vaguely educational with me, then music practice (is a bit obsessed), then plays either by himself or with us till dinner time at 5, and is in bed by half 6. In terms of his interests it depends- we have had a space phase, a Lego phase, a fairy phase. Currently he's into arts and crafts having shunned anything creative for a year and will spend hours building stuff. If he's into something then we get books and try and encourage him into finding out about it. He knows DH and I use technology for our work but it has never been a huge battle.