To fall out with my elderly grandmother?

[NoCapes]

My Nanna is 86 and over the last few years (since my mum has retired) has become more and more of an attention seeker
Faking illnesses, going to the doctors and A&E a lot and acting like she can't do things when people are around (yet being perfectly capable of doing them when there's no other option)
Ie. My mum went away earlier in the year and she was fine for 10 days, the day after she got home my Nanna had a 'funny turn' and rang an ambulance and made my mum go to hospital with her
We all know she's attention seeking but we all sort of roll our eyes and let her get on with it because she's old and probably quite bored, and really what can you do?

Last week my 1 year old had a nasty accident where he chopped half of his thumb off in a door, he had surgery to reattach it and is thankfully going to be ok but everyone was obviously in a bit of a panic
My mum took me to A&E when it happened and to an appointment this week to have his bandages changed (I don't have a car atm and he has to go to the children's hospital on the other side of the city)

The next day we were meant to be taking my Nanna shopping, so my mum picks me up then we go to collect Nanna who when we get there refuses to go if I'm going because 'she's sick of the baby being all anyone thinks about, he'll be getting all the attention and she might aswell not be there anyway, she's sick of my mum not being available because of the baby, why couldn't I take him to hospital myself?' Etc etc
She went on for a while and really upset my mum
My mum said she was being horrible and I was probably not going to want to speak to her after this and my Nanna replied 'I don't care I'm upset'

So basically she's having a tantrum because a baby got more attention than her while he was injured and she was fine

I don't want to see her or speak to her after being so mean and spiteful and she's already said she's no intention of apologising - yet it somehow feels wrong, she's very old and it's almost Christmas?!
Should I stand my ground on this one??

My Mil was like this all the years I knew her she was an extremely unhappy and angry person had funny turns she had a Dementia type symptoms due to an infection at the end it wasn't pleasant to be around she was either ranting or crying it was very sad

I hope some of the PP don't get old.

Iranian you are right aging isn't all boiled sweets and being jolly people struggle

she sees medical professionals enough for it to have been picked up on by now

Not necessarily, depending on the type of Dementia (different types affect different parts of the brain) and some people can 'maintain' shockingly well.

I'm an ex-HCP and we regularly got patients in who seemed fine if a little forgetful or demanding but ok during the day; come the night time..........

Not a clue where they were, wandering, aggressive, had you running after them all night, but then in the morning they'd be convinced they'd slept well.

Saying that growing older doesn't make nasty people less nasty. But I would still mention the 'bad' behaviour to her GP next time.

I try to be understanding when my 87 yr old mother pulls stuff like that. She often quite blatantly competes for my attention with my two teen girls. I know that she doesn't understand why they still need me so much - as well as just being teens, one has HFA and the other has MH issues.

Mum's had a hard life. She grew up in poverty in rural Ireland, lost her Dad at 10, had to leave school to care for younger siblings, two of whom died, and by 14 had left home to work. Now - as she sees it - in her later years, her daughter's attention is taken from her in favour of two pampered big girls who in their lives have known nothing but love, comfort and privilege. It isn't like that at all, of course. It's just that she doesn't understand. Partly that is for generational reasons and partly it's because some people do get childish as they age. (My mother has a brain injury since her 20s so was quite childish to start with.) I remember her when she was younger and know that some of it is also just her own selfish personality. But it's too hard to separate that from the other, more understandable reasons. So I just set up boundaries as best I can rather than cutting her off, especially at the end of her life.

Possible early Alzheimer's?

Interesting that the responses swing from 'nasty old goat' to 'poor old lonely woman' that's pretty much what's happening in my head too!

I won't fall out with her, I think you're all right that that won't help anyone, least of all my Mum
It's so hard to let certain things slide isn't it, when she's bitching about me I can just tell roll my eyes and go 'OK Nanna, more tea?' But her being nasty about my son certainly got my defences up

I think I will have a word with Mum too, 1. To flag up the dementia possibility (although the fact that she can switch it on and off makes me think it's not and its just plain old manipulation, but then I'm not a professional) and also to tell her it's ok to be a bit more firm and to say no sometimes

It's so bloody hard isn't it, literally is like dealing with a toddler - and I have enough of those already!

Thank you for the well wishes about DS too he's going to be fine, he does indeed have a huge dressing on though which he can not wait to get off, but they're confident his thumb should work as normal once it's healed 👍🏻

It is bloody hard! Good luck x

"Once a man twice a child" as they say.

I feel a lot of sympathy for you and your mum OP this sort of behaviour can be exhausting. I think you are right to be the bigger person and let it go if only for your mum's sake. If she wants to sulk and not come shopping let her get on with it.

I know a woman with dementia looks fit healthy nips to town for shopping I get her on the bus sometimes and it's only the repeating of stories or saying her family don't visit that you realise her Dementia the family live on her street and go in and out all day

It's really hard work her saying that about your baby must have been such a shock

Yes, one good boundary that I have is the one I draw when Mum takes to sulking.
'You might as well not even bother coming today.'
'OK, Mum! I'll see you tomorrow. :) '
Then I go and do something nice with my unexpected free time.
I do think your Mum must be suffering with this - I know it's bloody exhausting physically and mentally to be torn different ways. It feels mean to set boundaries but if you don't do it you snap in two or cut contact, and then the people who need you don't have anybody at all.

Early dementia was the first thing that crossed my mind too. The nastiness to you while nice to others is also a typical sign - it's borne out of resentment at realising she needs a bit of care, so takes it out on the care giver (even if it's not a formal role, and even if she's doing it subconsciously).

There are also trust issues; she may not trust the others to support her the way your mother does, therefore she gets to bear the burden.

As others have said, personality changes are one of the earliest signs, and usually manners, subtlety and discretion are the first to go! The lapses may be few and far between initially, which may appear like the sufferer switching it off and on at will, but over time you may realise that the timing of it is not in her control.

Of course she may not have dementia but it's as well to find out all you can about recognising the early stages so you and your mum are prepared for it if/when it really takes a hold.

Blimey Capes, I thought you had endless time for elderly relatives, no questions asked.

My Nana had Alzheimer's and only liked 1 Dd looking after her she had 6 Dds but only 1 she seemed to like even though all the Dds cared for her it was very stressful but it was her illness I think

Its hard isnt it. My grandma is unpleasant but always has been but is worsening and we are concerned about dementia one moment, annoyed with her the next. Though Ive stopped trying so hard after shes acted the same with my kids

Nope bibbity never said anything of the sort
Although I've clearly said on this thread that actually I do give her a lot of time
So hush

It's so hard.

The people who I know who acted like this in extreme old age always seemed to be the ones who had always been surrounded by lots of family. I think they were used to being busy and the centre of things, and also in control - being the ones helping out and doing the caring - not being vulnerable and needing care.

So you get old, and everyone else is still busy and in the centre of things, and you're not, you're vulnerable, you have to wait for people to come to you, you're probably in pain, you're tired, you can't do things for yourself that you could always do, you're bloody bored for hours and hours at a time. Yep, I could see how I could brood and get bitter and unreasonable.

I have had quite a lot of contact with elderly women from the generation that didn't get married and have families due to losses in WWI and they seemed to cope better - just had spent so much of their lives on their own that it wasn't such a shock maybe.

Anyway, it's just life unfortunately. There is very little to be done about it and I'm not sure what would make people who are unhappy about their lives due to circumstances outside everyone's control (and who don't want to engage with clubs or carers or activities etc) better.

I'm not sure even having the person whose attention they particularly crave wait on them every second of the day would actually make things better as it's their physical circumstances as much as anything that's making them unhappy. You would just end up with more unhappy people.

My grandmother was finally persuaded to go into a home and yep, she's bloody miserable and I wouldn't wish her life on anyone (not the home, it's lovely, but she won't engage with anyone but my mum and she's bored to tears), but at least my mum has some respite.

I think that your mum certainly needs to say no sometimes or at least be only available on certain days.

I can't help thinking that what your GM said was laughable rather than horrible & perhaps your mum needs to just tell her mum not to be so ridiculous & leave.

Of course your GM behaves like this because there are no consequences.

Perhaps you both need to pull back a bit so she realises that she can't just be nasty.

Must be upsetting for her that noone else bothers, but she's relying on you not giving up on her!

given her age I would be inclined to tolerate the situation but I would not be enabling her behaviour as much as your mum is!

I'd be mentioning the carer again!

Agree with Flappys above, ime, when people get to a certain place in their lives, the filters seem to disappear and behaviour gets stripped raw.

For example, from tales she told me, I always got the impression my late DM had been a 'mean' girl in her youth, a bit of a bully, a ring leader and just mean hearted. As she aged, although she had periods of being lovely and, well, just my Mum, she definitely had more times where she was just nasty. If it wasn't all about her, if she wasn't the centre of everyone's attention, then the tantrums would come out and the threats would emerge.

I used to try to ignore them tbh. I loved her yet I could see her faults 100%.

Now she's gone, I'm just glad that I did act that way because, when she died, as sad as I was, I had nothing to beat myself up about. I genuinely felt, regardless of what she said to me (days before her death she spent an hour berating me for my behaviour at the previous Christmas when I 'hadn't made her feel special, had ignored her, everyone else had clearly been more important, she didn't know why I bothered to invite her, she should have stayed home alone with a meal for one etc.' I had been hosting for 10 people, all her family, I had just treated everyone the same, what else did she expect me to do? God, I could go on and on), that I had done my best, I had been the best I could be and I had zero feelings that I should have done more.

God, that was long! I guess what I am saying is you can't change her and conditioning means your mum will probably just continue to be the primary source of support. So, try to ignore, raise eyebrows a lot, see the humourous side with your mum to support her (cause clearly your granny is bonkers) and ride it out, it will end and then you will feel peaceful knowing you did all you could.

The lapses may be few and far between initially, which may appear like the sufferer switching it off and on at will,

Family thought that about GM - she had form for being difficult - but it really was distress as she wasn't remembering things.

www.nhs.uk/conditions/dementia-guide/pages/symptoms-of-dementia.aspx - this might be worth having a quick glance through to see.

Otherwise your mother needs to put boundaries in place.

I was all set to say you were being unreasonable, but reading your posts - no you're not! I can't believe she could be that callous about your dc.

I don't believe age has anything to do with it either. My very elderly grandparents (they have 15 years on your Nanna!) would never dream of behaving like that. In fact, if my dc had any accidents, they'd be just as upset about it as we would be.

The only way I think age plays a part is if there is any dementia. But you don't think there is. I can totally understand it must be hard when you're older and probably lonely and in pain, but I don't think it's an excuse to bitch about everyone, and certainly not a baby

My first thought after reading your OP was that your mother needs to set some boundaries with your gran.

Yes, she may or may not have dementia, or (IMO more likely) may struggle with anxiety and needs the constant reassurance of getting attention paid to her. Which is why your DS's accident and treatment was so threatening to her.

I would not fall out with her over it, but would be quite firm with her.
This whole 'telling off' of your mum if she does not phone or whatever is really unbecoming of any adult relationship.

Would she agree for you or your mum to come to her GP's with her? To give a fuller picture of what her difficulties are??

It really sounds to me that she could do with some anxiety management or finding some kind of other focus in her life. ?Lunch club ?volunteering ?joining a knitting group. She's 86, not a toddler and IME people do often respond when more not less is expected of them.