To think 335,000 extra people coming to the UK in a year is too high

[jdoe8]

Where will they all live? What jobs will they all do? I know it may help GDP, but that is irrelevant as GDP per head is the important thing.

It does seem to be race to the bottom with more part time work , uber type work and the country is borrowing more and more and the national debt is 35k per head now.

**£3bn in income taxes, while claiming roughly £0.5bn in benefits"

Is that out of work benefits or does it include in work benefits?*

Defo excludes in work benefits, so is useless and misleading.

MigrationWatch have crunched some numbers on this issue at www.migrationwatchuk.org/briefing-paper/1.38.

Their Conclusion was:

16. Many migrants might work hard but, when they work at or close to the minimum wage, as is the case for nearly half of those from Eastern Europe, they pay very little in tax and many will make no contribution at all. Research claiming that recent EEA migrants contribute far more than they receive critically failed to take any account of income levels in estimating the cost of the means-tested benefits. In fact, as this paper shows, those with families may receive far more from the taxpayer in cash benefits than they pay in tax and National Insurance.

30 April, 2014

EDIT! sorry that bit on Sheffield was not me, was a paste and not my POV.

My father's family didn't live in London but they were in a 2 up 2 down terrace, 4 kids, the parents and his granny. It's the same size house as three of us live in today. They used to have no bathroom, just a tin bath. I imagine it was cosy but how many of us want to live that way today?

Apparently they had to close 3 tube stations during rush hour in London just to cope with volume of people, maybe due to a slightly delayed train, it does work mostly but it is finely balanced.

Luckily we live in a country where if you can't afford food you can go to a food bank, so you dont starve.

You consider it lucky that in a country this wealthy there are people having to resort to charity to avoid going hungry?

Also, you can't just head down to a food bank if you are hungry.

You have to be given tokens, often by the job centre staff whose sanctions mean you can't feed yourself.

Charitable food donation is now a part of our welfare state.

It is shameful.

Some of DH colleagues have had to go to foodbanks, they are on a 33 hours contract or agency. They are mostly migrants. Ten years ago he never heard of this. 20 years ago I'd not really heard of a foodbank, and I grew up in the 70's when things were often tough...

Was reading about the homeless on the news app earlier- what about them? Are their needs so very unimportant?? It's always occurred to me that one cannot help another if they themselves need help... and it seems clear we have plenty already here that need help and support.

I agree we are apparently the 5th wealthiest country (or 6th according to some) and people have to use food banks to feed themselves and their families

It's an absolute disgrace

Migration Watch is a right-wing pressure group, campaigning for reduced immigration.

The Office for Budget Responsibility is a public body , serving as a fiscal watchdog for public services.

I don't see why I should trust Migration Watch's "yeah but we disagree", over the OBR's exhaustive analysis?

EDIT! sorry that bit on Sheffield was not me, was a paste and not my POV.

A paste from where, exactly, OP? You seem to be copy/pasting from some rather unpleasant sources there.

Elendon - if there is a harsh requirement in people coming into the UK then naturally there would be an equally harsh requirement in those wanting to leave.

Yes, but I dont think requiring a job, or paying off investment you benefited from, is a harsh requirement.

A greater issue facing us these days is how we actually get through to people who lack the education and critical thinking skills to understand that the government's policy of austerity is ideological, and the problem (understatement) with using sites like MigrationWatch and Breitbart and Infowars and treating them as information sources, and the people on the internet who introduce them to these sources (or run them) and feed them arguments to regurgitate, which sound convincing enough to people with a certain lack of education and/or experience.

A paste from where, exactly, OP? You seem to be copy/pasting from some rather unpleasant sources there. Yes I know, i've reported it to get it deleted.

I do think the truth is somewhere in-between the two sources though.

Lateralthinker, it's not an either or situation.

Even if we stopped immigrants entirely we would still not help the homeless or those using food banks.

The two are not connected. We could help them instead of attacking them with government policy but we choose not to regardless of the number of immigrants.

It is genius however, to link the two so that we blame immigrants instead of the harsh austerity measures.

So many fall for it.

Charitable food donation is now a part of our welfare state. It is shameful. I better start shaming everyone for giving to charity then

The increased use of food banks in Britain is because more people are aware of their existence. Before 2010, food banks were not allowed to advertise their existence.

So Supper most people have to stay where they are? Born there and die there? Isn't that what happens already?

At the moment all Non-EU migrants have to be tax payers, have to have a well paying job before they can apply for a visa (and keep it), and can't claim benefits until they become perm residents which in some cases can take years. Why can't we have a similar package for EU migrants? As for the 'who will do that job without EU migrants' brigade, make people work for their JSA.

Supper mummy
This is complete nonsense. The rise is food banks is to do with the ending of social fund loans (which used to bridge the gaps when benefit claims were being processed) and sanctions

Sorry also use of food banks to do with zero hours staff not getting work and other types of precarious work arrangement .Lately seen a lot of employers just not paying wages (because they know it costs £100s to pursue a claim in the ET)

Before 2010, food banks were not allowed to advertise their existence.

It's pretty tricky to find any source on this, except a quote by one politician in 2014 that you seem to have more or less copy-pasted.

Elendon, no that is not what I said. What I explained was that if people want to immigrate to a different country they have to meet whatever requirements that country sets for admission. And I think having a job should be one of those requirements.

Migration within the UK. There was a total of 2.85 million people who migrated within the UK in 2015. Some people like to move. Most it would seem, like to stay where they are born. Interesting.

I do wonder if those 2.85 million received a warm welcome in the new towns, cities they moved to.

If people could take the emotion out of it and see it as basically a maths puzzle...there wouldn't be all this flaming for those who are voicing concerns. it doesnt automatically make you a racist.

If your beef is lack of NHS and schooling - well alot of that is due to a government cuts in funding, not merely strain from extra people.

I don't think food banks advertise, and I think they were around in 2010. And there were always ways to help people who had no money for food, because this has always been a necessity for some people. The inability to afford food when on benefits isn't new, it didn't suddenly begin in 2010. I have a feeling there were loans for food and possibly social workers could give out vouchers.

What is shameful is that we have a big economy which is successful and we are not choosing to help people, we are pushing them onto charities. Giving to charities isn't shameful, not sure why anyone would say it is.

Supper mummy, could you find evidence that says before 2010, food banks were not allowed to advertise their existence?