To think 335,000 extra people coming to the UK in a year is too high

[jdoe8]

Where will they all live? What jobs will they all do? I know it may help GDP, but that is irrelevant as GDP per head is the important thing.

It does seem to be race to the bottom with more part time work , uber type work and the country is borrowing more and more and the national debt is 35k per head now.

We have an aging population and a falling birth rate. Pensions are paid to older people from younger people's NI contributions. Where are the younger people going to come from if we halt immigration?

We are also not training enough nurses or midwives and need to make up this shortfall. Have you visited your local A&E lately? Many of the staff are from overseas, doing a sterling job and keeping things going.

I often hear that schools are over-subscribed, housing is under pressure and so on. I also hear the UK is overcrowded. It's not. We have built on very little of the available land. Why not build more houses and schools? If there is land for golf courses and grouse moors, why not for hospitals?

Immigration is an indication of a thriving economy, despite all the gloom. We could house and educate everyone who needs it, creating jobs and stimulating the economy more, we just don't and then we blame immigrants for housing and education shortages.

I also think that once global warming kicks in (manmade or not, it's happening) the present wave of refugees will be a drop in the ocean.

I'm sure there are enough houses, schools, doctors...

Who do you think pays for schools and doctors? Tax payers. What do you think working-age immigrants do? Pay taxes. I already discussed one of the biggest benefits to the NHS of immigration upthread, helping to offset the demographic shift of our aging population.

We do need more houses, and a different approach to the property market. But that's not a problem specific to immigration, not by a long way.

lewwat

Do you think it has been bad for our economy? What would have happened to our economy IF we hadn't had such immigration?

I think that is is reckless to have such high numbers entering when our infrastructure is no where near ready for it.

I think that is is reckless to have such high numbers entering when our infrastructure is no where near ready for it

How are we going to pay for the infrastructure? We need a strong economy. How are we going to get a strong economy? With people working, paying taxes etc.

Fabulous lets all wait 50 years for that plan to work. Meanwhile, public services are being stretched beyond belief. The housing market (esp rental) is an absolute joke.

I don't disagree with immigration. Skilled immigration. But the numbers are too high to be sustainable.

I am hugely grateful for the European migrants.
They are a vast workforce.
In my experience they turn up for work, on time: sober, and work hard. They deserve every penny of their often low wages.
Diligent and honest.
They pay their way, through taxes, rents etc without recourse to the public purse.
Taking some of the less attractive jobs that the UK worker is reluctant to do.
I have known UK nationals too idle or too cushioned by handouts to do a decent days work.

But the numbers are too high to be sustainable

And there's the rub. How many? What type of immigrant? Should they go to certain parts of the country?

One of the reasons public services are being stretched beyond belief is our aging population. (Another reason is chronic government underfunding , but hey ho.)

If you want to deal with that demographic shift, you have two options:

• wait for it to work its way out through the generations (will take about fifty years)
• allow immigration of young, working-age people.

Taking some of the less attractive jobs that the UK worker is reluctant to do

And a skilled immigrant won't want to do that job - and why would they if they have skills?

So how do you get people to do the less attractive jobs?

At what stage are we going to have such h a strong economy from the tax benefits of immigration that we can build all these new hospitals and schools? It doesn't appear to have resulted from the massive immigration so far and we appear to build hospitals on the never never and have a massive deficit. Or is that just spin?

PhilODox The OP did not address that, and I haven't watched the news this morning. Too busy unpacking from a house move.

I have never had a problem getting a job, even when i was unqualified. If you have a problem getting work, it's not the fault of an immigrant, it's your own fault.

That's my opinion anyway, and I'm sure I'll get knocked down for it.

Immigrant here!! Worked for NHS for 10 years in a skilled position. We have advertised jobs in our department this year multiple times as no qualified applicants. Only one application for my maternity leave cover. My husband (British) and the company he works for ( British and British owned) have had two recruitment days this year and not been able to hire enough people-minimal qualifications required for good pay- there are jobs out there not been filled! NHS service will never expand in anticipation of serving more people it's not how they work but they will expand over time given more demand. Working in my part of the NHS serving immigrant populations is rare most of our patients are elderly or long term unemployed with addiction issues. We need people in work paying taxes to keep all this going.

At what stage are we going to have such h a strong economy from the tax benefits of immigration that we can build all these new hospitals and schools?

At the stage the government decides to invest in that, rather than pursing austerity.

Oh fantastic. I woke up and was feeling a lack of xenophobic threaddage, and then I found this.

So you genuinely think that they are all coming here to exploit our 'generous' benefits system (which pays out a pittance- the welfare systems in other EU states are far superior to ours so surely go there if you're a benefits tourist)? Or that maybe they are coming here to work and to contribute to the economy. Also, you do realise that the vast majority of immigrants from outside the EU have a 'no recourse to public funds' condition to their entry? Yes, they can access NHS services, but I promise you that they are not receiving the hundreds of thousands a year that the DM would love to have us believe.

Thank you to randomuser for debunking the stats. Immigration has a net positive effect on the country, not the other way around.

650,000 level of immigration in the year to June 2016
284,000 EU citizens
289,000 coming from outside Europe
77,000 Britons returning to live in the UK

So non-EU immigration that is totally within the governments control is higher than EU immigration?

Not to mention that 8.5% of "immigrants" are UK citizens returning home

What 53rdAndBird said

The UK population is ageing - immigrants tend to be young on average. They will help support the ageing population.

Is there any evidence to back up the claim companies are only advertising abroad and refusing to hire anyone British? That sounds unlikely ... Why would that even be useful business practice unless there just have not been any appropriate local applicants for the positions in the past?

At the stage the government decides to invest in that, rather than pursing austerity

Yup, that's exactly it. People don't get that it's not true when the government says 'there is no money'. If they wanted to find the money, they could easily find it. We are one of the richest countries in the world. Of course we can build schools and hospitals. However, it is not a priority for the Tories, who would prefer to spend cash on renovating Buckingham Palace and ensuring that our royal family continue to live a life of absolute luxury and the plebs continue to bow down to them and worship them.

It is clearly government policy on a long term basis (not only this government, though they are upping the pace) that is dismantling the NHS and underfunding the public services

It's pretty obvious (isn't it?) that gaining an extra million population every three years is not particularly sustainable long term.

But maybe it isn't going to be a long term trend? Is it being boosted by Brexit churn and other factors?

My big worry is that Brexit will severely curb emigration.

user (it would make discussions a lot easier if you sorted out a proper name for yourself!), is the Brexit question adressed to me?

If so, yes I did vote Brexit. It was 100% to do with the issue of sovereignty though. I would almost go as far as to say I don't mind what we do, as long as we are the ones choosing to do it.

Brexit is working out just fine for me, thank you. It'll take a while, and I think the government are right to keep their cards close to their chest. That's what people do when they are going to enter negotiations.

I think Europe as a political super-state is going to crumble over the next few years, and that is a good thing in this globalised world. Free trade with all countries would be my starting point.

Anyway, back to the main point. Immigration is an important issue, but to a lot of people, it is not the main one.

I think this is the problem that the Government is going to have.

I have no doubt that immigration was a concern and a reason for Brexit with some people.

There are people who want less migration - and there are valid reasons as outlined on here.

But then - how many migrants is 'acceptable' and do we want skilled or unskilled migration?

There are jobs that need doing, that are unskilled and that aren't filled by British workers. So what do you do?

In my area the Farmers leaders are becoming very worried about the increasing lack of workers to pick the crops and food processing .

Despite claims to the contrary this is relatively skilled but also very hard work; and often takes place in areas with low unemployment. However workers from Eastern Europe are now going increasingly to other European countries (the fall in the pound post Brexit and greater hostility shown to them makes UK much less attractive.)

I understand there are similar worries in the care sector.

A better question would be what are the causes in areas of high unemployment for UK residents not to internally migrate? I suspect that a lot of the unemployment is from an older, more disabled demographic who would find it difficult to relocate/ efficiently pick crops. Another problem with care work is the need to pass a DBS check (9.2 million British people have a criminal record).

The trouble with focussing purely on current infrastructure and ignoring economic output is that is very short term. For our economy to grow and prosper, we need to increase economic output; and the evidence is very much linked to encouraging younger working age migrants