Thankyou for an 'interesting' time

[Brightsmoke]

Just got back from a week away with my DH's Grandfather (85yrs). We invited him on holiday with us because we found out he was going away alone and felt sorry for him. He has family local that don't really bother. We paid for the holiday, drove 300 miles to pick him up, a further 40 miles to the local airport, and the same in reverse to drop him off.

I've had a LOT of stress in my life recently so really needed a nice relaxed week. We picked him up, told him to be ready for a certain time (he lives on his own and is fairly self sufficient) and of course he wasn't ready. He then proceeded to complain about my car 'oh you've got one of those ugly things' Uhh, actually its my pride and joy and we have it because its practical for the dog and family (pick up). He asked for 20kg luggage as struggles with 15kg normally, we got for extra luggage normally so didn't complain. But when DH picked up his suitcase, it was as light as a feather (11kg at check in, when he'd put his thick winter coat in it) Got to the airport eventually, and he expected us to tow his suitcase around, knowing I'm pregnant, and obviously DH cant carry all 3.

He needs a wheelchair to help downstairs, which means we had to cancel the extra legroom seats we had booked due to DH illness, and he was in pain the whole flight because of it. Not GF fault, but annoying non the less, especially when it turned out there weren't any stairs!

DH & I only got 500EUROS out, as GF is normally very generous, and we didn't expect to pay for everything. He didn't stick his hand in his pocket ONCE! Didn't offer, just assumed we would pay the bar bill, buy all outside food, excursions etc.

He had ONE shower the whole week, and it was 20-28 deg all week. DH also had to clean up (TMI, sorry) diarrhoea type poo drops from the bathroom floor, that he had trodden through to the living area TWICE!

We went to a zoo, said its a LONG walk, long day and many hills, why don't we hire you an electric mobility scooter, he laughed it off, and took the piss out of DH for the suggestion. Then proceeded to moan and shuffle the whole way about how far it was.

So, after spending around £1000 on him, when we dropped him off, without an offer of payment for fuel (we didn't expect it by now), and said 'well thanks for an interesting time you 2'. Not a thank you at all!!

So, AIBU to a) never want to see him again (light hearted),

b) try and get his family to encourage him getting some home assistance,

c) to not be expected to pay for EVERYTHING when offering to take someone on holiday,

and d) to be so angry with the whole holiday that I started an AIBU thread

YANBU OP
Being 85 doesn't entitle a person to moan about everything and be rude to people.
You did a nice thing inviting him on holiday. In hindsight you probably realize it was possibly unsuitable for him, but still. You did a nice thing,

To be honest there doesn't seem to be anything he did wrong here other than not offer to pay.

He misjudged his luggage, who cares, he made a disparaging remark about your car, seriously, get over it, he needed a wheel chair as there may have been stairs so you couldn't have extra leg room seats, kinda selfish to whinge about that, he had to walk a long way but didn't want a scooter, probably for dignity purposes and he's struggling with some personal hygiene issue probably due to some age related issues.

All these things apart from the money were to be expected. One things clear, I doubt he will want to go with you again.

Well, you mention that his family don't really have much to do with him and now you've found out why. A holiday with an 85 year old is never going to be stress free and there were bound to be fireworks.

Never mind, you did your best. Some older people become less sensitive to others' feelings. Just put it down to experience and try to relax now.

Re; the personal hygiene- it's worth remembering when dealing with elderly relatives that you lose your sense of smell as you age, and it's often a case of the person simply not realising that twice weekly baths are not leaving them daisy fresh because they can't smell themselves like you can.

Also, a weekly bath used to be the norm, even when I was a child, and I'm only in my early fifties!

Sounds a lot like my old dad who died at 92. Especially the not paying for things and giving thanks. The curmudgeonly old bugger

You really can't lump all 85-year-olds together. My aunt aged 94 is perfectly fine, if a little frail. Mil had raging dementia by the time she was 85. And as someone said upthread, dementia is not a little dottiness, it can manifest itself as double incontinence, angry outbursts and all sorts of other antisocial traits.

Even if the grandfather here is in full possession of his faculties, elderly people can be very hard work . They become fixated on routines and can be demanding (or conversely fiercely independent and do things like climbing up ladders and then falling off). A day trip - let alone a holiday - would likely have to be all about the elderly person - their stamina, mobility, meal requirements - just like a toddler, in fact, but without the cute factor!

I feel for you OP!

We do three- or four-generation family holidays a lot (current age range: 4 to 94). Everyone contributes and participates to the level they are are able. This obviously involves a lot of juggling of the various needs and wishes and, frankly, a great deal of work and expense in the planning and implementation for those of us who are neither very old nor very young. But it works and there is no room for rudeness! I had lovely thankyou notes from the oldest family members after our most recent trip.

Obviously if dementia were a factor then things would be very different, but it doesn't sound as though it is a factor from what you have described.

Hope you have a happier break next time around.

I do think we need to cut the same slack to over 80s grandparents that we do to toddlers. They aren't mentally the same. Early stages dementia can make people very grumpy. Obstinacy is in a way at least a bit of life and kick.

I do think that you felt that it should be easy enough and that taking him should have made him grateful. It was good of you to take him away, but tbh not if you weren't prepared to give him an awful lot of slack, and you didn't.

I think that you are the adults here. He doesn't sound any more unreasonable than my parents - who are lovely but would have been the absolute same on holiday. This may have been the last holiday he ever goes on. It's really hard being old!

The thing is, these posts about 'you can't pull a suitcase while pregnant?!?' are missing the bigger picture. If the holiday had been largely a success the OP wouldn't have made a post complaining about a few niggly things, they'd have been forgotten. It was the whole miserable experience bundled together that annoyed her - and quite right!

Maybe many other forum users also have an ASD, like me, but I've learnt that nitpicking at little things is rarely helpful, it mostly comes across as petty. You have to look at the picture as a whole. The OP has a right to feel miffed that her holiday was ruined and she didn't even get a proper thank you. It sounds like he needs too much care to take a trip like that in future though.

Obviously if dementia were a factor then things would be very different, but it doesn't sound as though it is a factor from what you have described

I agree with barbarian there's not enough info, but I think there is actually a lot pointing that way, and I disagree with the OP it's not her 'place' to speak up about it. This is someone who:

• has recently changed in character (the generosity)
• has struggled with continence/clearing up
• seems to have forgotten recently-made requests (the extra luggage allowance)
• may be confused about times (late for a pick-up).
• may not be remembering to shower
• is being inconsistent about physical needs (does he or doesn't he need a wheelchair/mobility scooter).
• doesn't seem aware of the OP's recent stresses or her pregnancy, or isn't accommodating those things well.

Of course all of those points might be unrelated to dementia. But they would worry me. I know I said this upthread, but honestly, having seen my granny go through some of these changes, I wish so much that we'd got over our irritation and realised there was an underlying problem, instead of pussyfooting around it or fuming quietly.

It was probably a misunderstanding. He may have assumed that since you invited him on holiday, that you'd be paying for everything.

My dad is elderly and my brother and his wife took him on a holiday once. When dad came home, he was complaining to me about the fact that they expected him to pay for things like meals etc (just for himself, not even theirs) He said he wouldn't have gone if he'd known that

He sounds awful!

So you only 'took out 500 euros' because you expected him to pay for your stuff aswell?

Sounds pretty grim. I'd be unhappy about refusing a mobility scooter in the park and not offering to pay for anything. Otherwise, it sounds normal-ish - what's the state of his house?

He might have antiquated views about you hosting him on holiday.

So you only 'took out 500 euros' because you expected him to pay for your stuff aswell?

No the OP has clearly said She wanted him to pay for his food and drink. Why is that unreasonable?

Honestly I think some people expect everyone to look at eldelerly people with nothing but benevolence and gratitude no matter how awful that person is. It's bloody patronising to say the least.

FWIW my grandad washes far too little and I've had to tell him before that he needs to wash more, I'd rather do that than let him go out reeking of BO

This makes me sad (am also hormonal.)

It was so lovely of you to take him away, don't spoil it by being resentful.

He lives on his own and sadly doesn't get much company, he is probably not used to being around people all day. I hope you continue to visit him and value him in your lives.

I've just been to a funeral of a 90+ gent. He thought he still drove, but the reality was that he hadn't actually driven for a few years. His wife is the same. I have come across this with many of my elderly relatives, they think they do something which they have always done, but actually they don't.

My stepFIL thinks MIL cooks, as she has always done. She is in final stage dementia and barely does anything at all, she's even lost her speech except for the odd phrase which pops out willy-nilly.

I started using a mobility scooter a couple of years ago. IT'S FUN!!!!! It's bloody useful too and I can now get to the shops and get back, and then nip back for something I've forgotten. It took a while to admit that I needed it though, probably a couple of years, in which I spent more and more time at home, less and less inclined to go out.

It's a horrid step to take, until you actually take it and then it's great and you're really pleased you did it. I'm not even 60 yet but have MS.

Your dh's gf might be more open to the mobility scooter if you were to hire one from a Shopmobility place (you're pg, you can't stay on your feet long enough to do a proper shop in the middle of whatever city; your doctor has said you've got to rest and keep your feet up but it's really really important you do a final tour of the shops before you do the bedrest) and then tell him about it. It's an adventure, I promise you, that first time you mingle in one.

My uncle agreed to get one after I'd told him what fun I had in mine, how much it helped, and how much energy it saved for things that matter more than just getting there.

You were doing him an act of kindness, and now you ruin it all by saying about money, how he was, his toilet accident. I think it's too much for you too handle. So kindness fail.

My parents are nearly that age, and wouldn't dream of being so stingey. They also wash daily. And they express genuine gratitude when we have taken them to the supermarket, never mind on hols!

Mine too.
Unless there's a medical reason, old age doesn't excuse bad manners.

We have been fed a myth that elderly people automatically turn into sweet old men and sweet old ladies after the age of 80.
The truth is, that you're not a very nice young person, you will morph into a not very nice old person.

Honestly I think some people expect everyone to look at eldelerly people with nothing but benevolence and gratitude no matter how awful that person is. It's bloody patronising to say the least.

I agree.
It's actually quite ageist to expect them to have no faults.
It's like saying that they're not allowed to have 'personalities'.
Some older people are nice, some aren't.

They're not all nice, purely because they old.

Did he realise that your dh's illness would make him unable to deal with 3 suitcases (by using a trolley)? Because in my world normal manners would dictate that any young or middle-aged person would offer to carry for anybody older (or pregnant). I would expect my 16yo to step right up and take any suitcases out of the hands of his grandparents, because that is the way he has been brought up and if he failed to do so there would be subtle digs in the ribs until he cottoned on. They are amazingly fit for 85, but even he knows that amazingly fit for 85 is not the same as having a younger body.

They're not all nice, purely because they old.

Trouble is, our society generally doesn't treat older people well. They are routinely subject to horrific discrimination (on these boards as much as anywhere), abuse, neglect, cruelty and so forth.

A surfeit of kindness is not currently a major problem facing the elderly. Quite the reverse.