To think we should occasionally be able to spend a relaxing morning home with kids without constantly entertaining them?

[ToShelAndBack]

I live with DH, DS1 (age 6.5), and DS2 (age 3). DH works long hours and I'm currently a SAHM. During the week the kids are busy with school, activities, and homework for DS1 -- if feels like we're always running around.

So far this has been a pretty typical weekend for us: yesterday we were out with friends and did some Halloween stuff with our neighbors. Today the kids woke up around 7 and we let them have some iPad time -- probably too much, about 2-3 hours, more or less, so DH and I could sleep in. They each had a breakfast bar early and then DH got up and made them proper breakfast, which was eaten while watching a show on the iPad. When it was time to turn off the screens, there was much whining and protesting, to the point where I had to pull it out of DS2's hands. We then sat down as a family and carved pumpkins, cooked the seeds, and put up some Halloween decorations. DH cleaned up from that while I did some homework with DS1 and played a bit with DS2. Then DH needed to do a bit of work and I had to do some house stuff, so we told the kids they needed to play on their own. If it matters, we have a nice (enough) home with space to play, a decent-sized garden and tonnes of books, toys, games, Lego, craft stuff, etc.

This all sounds perfectly fine, right? But it's not. This whole morning has been a NIGHTMARE. The kids (especially DS1) have done nothing but whine, complain, fighy, talk back, and generally behave miserably. And this is not unusual -- it's always like this on weekends unless we have a specific activity planned. They have plenty of days out, weekends away, birthday parties, play dates, trips to the playground, swimming, etc. But why can't we spend a relaxing weekend morning at home without entertaining them every second? Today is particularly long bc of the time change, but it's always like this. Today DH finally caved and took them to the local playground but they were back in 15 minutes because they were so miserable there.

Both kids are the issue, but DS1 in particular has always been virtually unable to entertain himself alone at home. That was understandable when he was smaller, but now he is almost 7. He will occasionally play with Lego or do a craft but even then he comes to us every 3 minutes to show us what he's done. Even when he's playing with his brother he constantly comes and reports every little thing they are doing. The ONLY thing that keeps him occupied is TV or iPad, but we're not willing to just let him do that for hours on end. To be fair, we moved last year and he has made nice friends, but not as many as he had before and they don't seem to be around much on weekends. But we really do keep him pretty busy.

DH thinks we bring it on ourselves because we know they will be like this at home and we try it anyway. He thinks we should schedule them in more weekend activities. But I think they have enough activities and we are catering to them by entertaining them every minute, and maybe they just have to learn how to be at home. But in the meantime it's misery for everyone.

What are we doing wrong? Should we be scheduling them in a million activities so they have no downtime? Should we just let them rot in front of screens all day? Or AIBU to expect an occasional relaxing morning/day at home with the kids?

I know the screens are probably the primary culprit. It's just soooo nice to have a lie-in, and since it's usually the only screen time they get all week I didn't think it was excessive. But I guess it's getting so much at once that's the problem. We will work on that.

For those people who tell me to just ignore them or send them to do other things, I have tried that, though maybe not hard enough. It always leads to them either fighting with each other or playing together in a rough/dangerous way, like jumping off things or running around screaming and slamming a little pushcart into the wall. Or if one sits down to color or build Lego, the other one will either decide that's the EXACT toy he NEEDS right this minute or just start harassing the other one until they are both screaming. With a 3.5-year age difference I still feel like it's unfair on the little one to completely leave them to it.

I have stopped the rules and regulations around screens although my dc are older. They hardly watch tv but they would be on laptops for hours.

I also find it best if we are up and out early before the bickering starts or before everyone is so engrossed in their screens they can't be bothered to move. Mine are really early risers and it's a long day otherwise.

My dc don't play in the garden at all any more. They will do colouring if I leave it out for them and occasionally things like play dough or crafts.

My dc are lovely readers and have loads of books but would never ever pick up a book themselves.

What you describe is pretty much normal I would say!

But you had 3 hours when they were entertaining themselves. You choose to have a lie I'm rather than get on with things. I would swop things around and get up with the kids get breakfasts. Let them entertain themselves whilst u do chores to get them out the way before moaning sets in. You also need to show kids activities to entertain themselves (a problem with the removal/too little free play time in younger years which in my opinion should be the majority of nursery time). Try setting out small world/ Lego/other imagination toy and playing for small time tgen leaving mid play and coming back then leaving longer each time. This skill is more important than homework, housework imo. Time to ditch the lie in, or one of you lie in Saturday and the other sunday if you need the extra rest

Our screen solution has been that the kids (0, 2, 4 and 6) aren't allowed iPads/wiii any time except Sunday morning once homework is done and school stuff laid out. Then they can play for as long as they like which can be around 2-3 hours. They never ask for it Amy other time.

They can be a bit cranky when they come off but are thrown straight outside and quickly get a grip. If they ( my oldest son primarily) is too adult behaved he won't get it the next week

I agree that expecting the dc to play on their own for both the 3 hours for lie in and then again in the afternoon seems quite a lot. Can they not help out with the housework tasks in the afternoon? When I have housework to do (which I try to keep to a minimum on a weekend) my dd (4) helps me.

Just a thought, when they winge and moan, do you give in and entertain them? If so, they have learnt that whinging will get your attention.

We take it in turns to lie in so that they don't get too much screen time ( and it's nice to have the whole bed)

I think that you entertain them too much. We have just finished a week off and honestly I haven't entertained them much, trip to park twice, Halloween baking, swimming, walks in woods. Basically one activity a day then they have been on their own.

They play really well, they have built dens, made a boat from a big cardboard box, made catapults, played Lego, done craft....all on their own. Anyone that is bored gets to clean. They are 6 and 8 I have always left them to play, for years I would set them off and pop over every so often to jolly them along, but now they can do that themselves.

They had very, very limited screen time for years but now I allow screen time first thing in the morning, again in the afternoon, after tidying up, then again in the evening after tidying up.

There is a downside that they can make a huge mess but they are keen to tidy for an iPad so that's ok.

Fighting solution - separate rooms. The moment one fight breaks out, no one is blamed but they are separated 'for their own good' and sent to their rooms. Amazingly enough, now they do not fight, and if they want to bicker about something they do so very quietly so I don't hear them.

It's good for kids to be bored, the whining is annoying but they should eventually learn to entertain themselves.

And as loads of people have already pointed out,, excessive screen time is really bad for their development. There's a good article about it here m.huffpost.com/us/entry/4899218?

You could try making them ( especially the older one) more self sufficient in othher ways, for example, at nearly 7, he could be getting breakfast for himself and his little brother.
Have you tried bribing him? It could be one of his jobs to entertain the younger one for an hour or so at a time.

It's very hard work. Ds was never like this and still isn't but Dd has just turned 6 and still cannot just play alone. She won't even watch TV or play a game on the tablet alone.

I don't have any suggestions, just sympathy.

Agree with pp that it is too much screen time too early in the day. We do breakfast, homework, then mum and dad go back to bed with a cup of coffee for 1/2 an hour while they watch some TV. Then TV goes off and they play or we go outside for a proper walk. Its not really fair to begrudge them a trip to the park. We find if we tire them out in the morning, they are happy to read / play with Play Mobil etc in the afternoon.
They then get TV again from about 4pm onwards while we're making tea.

I can never remember my Mum or Dad entertaining me. [hmm[

There was also limited TV and we didn't go out very often. I just used to entertain myself. I am an introvert though which might help. It's very important that they learn to play on their own though as it's how children learn though. I have idea how you do that though! Are there any books that could help?

doesnt sound to me like you did much with them.
you ignored them while you had a lie in
you did some pumpkin carving.
Then you should have gone out, worn them out

these years are precious. enjoy them

the clock change does throw everything out though

Anecdote:
I was at a beach restaurant (not uk) recently, lovely autumn day, sunny, T shirt, sun glasses, it was the school holidays. There were all sorts of clients, including grandparents with their GCs & families.
All the children, at table had smart phones or tablets, some even with headphones. There was no interaction.
Our feet were in the sand, the large open beach was more or less empty & the sea around 19°C.
Why weren't those kids running around, making sand castles, playing foot/volley ball/ swimming ??? or simply talking with the adults?

Sorry, excessive electric devices to entertain the children is the work of the devil.

IMHO They want you to give them the iPad. they are deliberately manouevring & pulling ou the "bored" card, because they need their fix.

They entertained themselves for three hours without you! Then you gave them breakfast, carved some pumpkins and expected them to do the same again while you both worked.

I think that's pretty harsh. They're only young - when you have small kids you don't have the luxury of three hour lie-ins with your husband every weekend!

Remember, you are a parent, not a kid's entertainer.

It doesn't do children any harm to see adults with their own agenda- this is how they learn what people need to do to have a fulfilling life. The children are part of the family's activities, not the parents directing the children's activities.

They should experience adults doing necessary chores (sorting house, garden, food ) exercising (family walks, or hobbies) , relaxing (reading, listening to music, playing music, socialising, watching films, even-shock horror-doing nothing at all).

Doing your own thing with dh, or on your own should not be a source of guilt; it is modelling a good relationship. Children should learn that adults need some space, just as children do. It's not selfish to expect a child to play with siblings or friends when you are doing housework or even relaxing.

Children (and even young animals!) all over the world spontaneously play when left to their own devices, with or without toys or adult input. It's what they do. If we over direct them by filling their time, they will wait for direction from adults.

That said, I do think getting everyone outside for some exercise every day is sensible. Limiting screen time to a few hours a day is also a no brainer.

you need to start them off on an activity, then leave them to do it, as an idea,
say a jig saw, some colouring, whatever you can think of and reasonably leave them to it, they can play alongside you while you do your chores, or get them to help you.

i think you should forget the lie ins.

I don't think you can have a lie in AND play without grown up interaction later.

I have a feeling it's a mutually exclusive kinda thing!

But yes, to agree with others, screen time doesn't help with mood afterwards, or ability to play independently.

Maybe try to manage playtime by using some of the ideas on this thread? Like writing down a list of little projects, games and toys they can do and asking them to pick one? Or helping them understanding the time they have via alarms/ timers etc? And definitely giving them a choice of boring tasks if they whine they're bored before the end of the time!

I read a psychology / philosophy essay about being bored, it was very interesting (ironically) :) it was about the importance of being bored and the positive effect of when we use our brains to get out of that state. Boredom is really important for children to experience and find their way out of alone... However difficult that process is!

Mind you, age and ability to manage moods must effect whether the child's capable of finding their way out of boredom themselves.

I also suspect that having too many options makes it more difficult as well, and leads to children just giving up trying to work it out on their own. When there are only a few toys to play with, or a few options, play here or in the garden etc, it's easier to engage with them, rather than standing there unable to choose and whining!

So I'd suggest:

• less screen time
• timed independent play time / 'free time'
• clear rules for free play eg no fighting, arguing, and no whining/ I'm bored stuff!
• guiding choices / cutting down choice to a minimum just to get them started
• boring helpful jobs to do if they come with the 'I'm bored whining'!

I'm a firm believer in kids needing to be bored. I remember being bored so much as a kid but I learned to entertain myself.

All that said my DS is similar though and I reckon it's because he's indulged too much by everyone. The only thing he'll do for extended periods is watch telly or play on his kindle. Occasionally he'll colour or play with the Lego but like yours OP needs to show me what he's done every few minutes. I have no solutions but thought I'd share

Interesting thread. We are also guilty of over-reliance on the tablets..but I will say that my firm policy on the need for my two to play without adult involvement has started to pay off at weekends. For example yesterday was a good mixture of morning tablet time/lunch at the table chatting/trip to the garden centre (met with cries of "boring" but hey it was fresh air!), some independent playing (eldest drawing/writing, youngest brio tracks/play dough), some nice playing together throwing a ball through a hoop (playing together can often back fire and end in tears but worked on this occasion!), then family snuggle watching a film, then bed. No screens upstairs and they both get what I call "a quiet play" in their separate rooms. Mine are similar ages & age gap to yours OP, I'm hoping playing together improves as youngest gets older- I do insist they sort out their own battles though!

My favourite line is 'only boring people get bored', mine are 4 and 6 and need a couple of suggestions occasionally but jut because I need to get on with housework or jobs doesn't mean I have to ignore the children completely. It's not difficult to walk over occasionally and make a few positive comments and take an interest.