To think we should occasionally be able to spend a relaxing morning home with kids without constantly entertaining them?

[ToShelAndBack]

I live with DH, DS1 (age 6.5), and DS2 (age 3). DH works long hours and I'm currently a SAHM. During the week the kids are busy with school, activities, and homework for DS1 -- if feels like we're always running around.

So far this has been a pretty typical weekend for us: yesterday we were out with friends and did some Halloween stuff with our neighbors. Today the kids woke up around 7 and we let them have some iPad time -- probably too much, about 2-3 hours, more or less, so DH and I could sleep in. They each had a breakfast bar early and then DH got up and made them proper breakfast, which was eaten while watching a show on the iPad. When it was time to turn off the screens, there was much whining and protesting, to the point where I had to pull it out of DS2's hands. We then sat down as a family and carved pumpkins, cooked the seeds, and put up some Halloween decorations. DH cleaned up from that while I did some homework with DS1 and played a bit with DS2. Then DH needed to do a bit of work and I had to do some house stuff, so we told the kids they needed to play on their own. If it matters, we have a nice (enough) home with space to play, a decent-sized garden and tonnes of books, toys, games, Lego, craft stuff, etc.

This all sounds perfectly fine, right? But it's not. This whole morning has been a NIGHTMARE. The kids (especially DS1) have done nothing but whine, complain, fighy, talk back, and generally behave miserably. And this is not unusual -- it's always like this on weekends unless we have a specific activity planned. They have plenty of days out, weekends away, birthday parties, play dates, trips to the playground, swimming, etc. But why can't we spend a relaxing weekend morning at home without entertaining them every second? Today is particularly long bc of the time change, but it's always like this. Today DH finally caved and took them to the local playground but they were back in 15 minutes because they were so miserable there.

Both kids are the issue, but DS1 in particular has always been virtually unable to entertain himself alone at home. That was understandable when he was smaller, but now he is almost 7. He will occasionally play with Lego or do a craft but even then he comes to us every 3 minutes to show us what he's done. Even when he's playing with his brother he constantly comes and reports every little thing they are doing. The ONLY thing that keeps him occupied is TV or iPad, but we're not willing to just let him do that for hours on end. To be fair, we moved last year and he has made nice friends, but not as many as he had before and they don't seem to be around much on weekends. But we really do keep him pretty busy.

DH thinks we bring it on ourselves because we know they will be like this at home and we try it anyway. He thinks we should schedule them in more weekend activities. But I think they have enough activities and we are catering to them by entertaining them every minute, and maybe they just have to learn how to be at home. But in the meantime it's misery for everyone.

What are we doing wrong? Should we be scheduling them in a million activities so they have no downtime? Should we just let them rot in front of screens all day? Or AIBU to expect an occasional relaxing morning/day at home with the kids?

I think YABU, they are still pretty young to be amusing themselves for any length of time on their own: mine are 6 and 9 and it's really only in the last couple of years that they have got better at playing together / independently of us.

I think that on a weekend, if you don't want to use screens twice, you have to choose either a long lie-in OR time out in the afternoon to do housework / work-type stuff. Yes, LEGO / pokemon / whatever will keep them amused for a short while, but not long enough to actually get anything worthwhile done.

We've gone for allowing TV - not ipad - in the morning (they are not allowed out of their bedroom until after 7am: DS2 usually sleeps in, DS1 reads a book in bed if he wakes earlier) to have a bit of a lie-in, but we are usually up by 8am and getting breakfast on the go. Then the TV goes off, they go to the park, or whatever. We come back for lunch, then they are allowed 1hr on the Ipad (very clear time limits seem to lead to less arguments). After that we do a combo of lego / pokemon /reading / playing alone and us playing with them until around 4pm, when they have a snack and are allowed to put the TV back on - if homework etc is done. DH and I would tend to take turns - one of us will play / bake / craft / read / play badminton outside with the children while the other works, and vice versa.

Agree with the above that the screen time might be causing the issue instead of solving it.
We save screen time (i.e. TV as none of them have iPads or any other screens) until just before bedtime, and for 30mins or 45mins max. Usually once they are in pjs and always after bath so there is literally nothing left to 'do'. I couldn't imagine motivating them to do homework after a long session in front of a screen.

I think if they have sat in front of screens for anything like 2 hours (which is a LOT at that age) it will make them very irritable and mentally frazzled without having any physical activity, which is a recipe for disaster.
Maybe try and turn things upside-down, and get them outdoors early in the day (for us we find we have to get outdoors soon very after breakfast to avoid cabin fever, and we have a huge indoor play space but it matters not, there is something magic about the outdoors and is calming effect on kids) and then let them do the chillout/screentime later on, such as after lunch.
It means you don't probably get a lie-in but you might find the day is still much better all round.

I am very old-school on screens, even though I work in IT and have done for > 20 years, and of all my finds our kids have the last access to screens and gadgets. I just don't see much benefit for the kids, in fact none at all really, so it's about balancing the parental benefit (which is huge and I certainly resort to movies/TV sometimes when I am desperate) with the negative impact on kids.
Kids need to be moving around, i.e. not physically slumped in front of a screen for long periods, and they certainly need to be bored so they can learn to entertain themselves.
Have you ever tried getting them to help you with the mundane jobs you want to get on with? That's a surefire way of making mine find more interesting things to do!

Thanks for the suggestions. We've considered abolishing the screens but I will admit that that extra sleep/cuddle time with my DH is hard to give up. And it's actually cute how the boys get cuddle together to watch. But if this is what's ruining our weekends it's not worth it.

SpookyPotato, in an average week DS1 is in school from 8:30 - 3 pm. Two afternoons he has school-based clubs (football and science) so he stays at school until 4:30 pm. He also has another club (music) that meets during break at school. On non-club days we very often stop at the playground and they play with their friends for an hour or so. Then it's home, snack, tea, homework, bath, read, and bedtime. They do have some free time but it's limited so they don't seem to get as restless. We almost never do screen time on school days although now that it's going to be dark at 4 pm I will have to try my best not to cave on that.

DS2 is at nursery 3 days per week from 9:30 - 2:30. On one off the off mornings he has a swimming lesson and on other one we usually meet up with friends who have similar-aged kids. DS2 actually plays fairly well by himself when he's alone, but when DS1 gets in the mix it's about 25% playing together and 75% screeching/crying/tattling. (This not all instigated by DS1, it's just the dynamic of them together.)

I would love for DS1 to make more friends to play with on weekends, and he would love it, but I'm not sure how. He seems to be well-liked and I don't think he's being left out, but frequent playdates just don't seem to be "the done thing" at his school, and none of our neighbors have kids his age. We all had a wider social circle where we used to live. I think we've made a good amount of friends since we've been here but it doesnt happen overnight. Still, though-- I wish he could entertain himself a little better!

My DCs are similar ages. They'll tend to get up and put CBeebies on, or play with lego. Other screen time is usually put off until the evening (tablets/ YouTube/Amazon) as they get more hooked into those.

The accustics our house are quite clear, so its easy to hear what they're doing from downstairs.

They seem to have quite good attention spans. DS1 got a trainset for his second birthday and spent 2 hours chuffing the train around the tracks without looking up!

I think your problem may be doing too much. It sounds like they are used to constantly having something to do tbh. My kids can play for hours and hours between themselves rarely requiring any input from me. We still do stuff obviously and go out a fair bit...but a lot of the time they entertain them selves and have done since being fairly young. When DD was born I had plans of diaries and such full of activities and my mother warned me against it...I am glad she did. I can't imagine having to do stuff constantly every day with no down time..

MissClarke86 to be fair if you have a toy day at school the children have a wide choice of friends to play with, not just toys. Children are rarely bored when they have their friends over - if they are its because they are using "we're bored" as code for "Friend is trying to blackmail me into getting you to let us play xbox" (and they can be sharply reminded that friend is free to go home if playing at ours is too boring).

Our neighbour kids knock for our kids all the time - I know a lot of MNers hate that for some reason but it is an excellent help in raising children who are not reliant on adults for entertainment - I'd hate it if the only way my kids got fresh air was if I physically took them to a park, but for some families that is the reality and in some of those cases unavoidable, it depends where you live... Many of the adults who never remember being bored as children probably had freedom to play out and friends to call for / calling for them, which somewhat fewer children have these days.

I agree that its likely the screen first thing in the morning that causes the issue. I find DD is a lot more difficult and moans about being bored if she watches too much telly and since we got rid of it she entertains herself much better.

Too much entertaining them is a problem too. Its important to let them get bored so they learn how to deal with it. Benign neglect is the way to go!

If mine are bored I give them a pack of babywipes and get them to clean the bannisters, and skirting boards.

Tidy your room. Read a book. Be bored.

Didn't have iPads etc when kids were very young ( 2dds 22,19 and ds17)
They loved doing art/crafts, drawing, playing with playmobil, dolls, cars whatever was flavour of the moment
They also liked dressing up, playing schools/ hospitals with teddies and dolls!!
Used to enjoy cooking / baking with them but stopped now as I'd be size of a house!
We did have Wii and PCs by time they were 10 and 12 so they loved playing games on this (Sims city!)and sing star on PS
Sometimes think technology is a bad thing and should be rationed

DD and DS didn't really play together until DS turned 4, and DD was 6 - something suddenly clicked at that age where they could play on more of an equal footing, rather than DD just bossing DS around.

We're a couple of years down the line now, and they definitely play much better together (without input from us) than previously.

DD wouldn't entertain herself at all until age 5, I wouldn't necessarily expect the younger one to.

We also limit screens to 1 hour on weekdays and 2 hours (split into two 1-hour sessions) on weekends/holidays. She accepts this and mostly entertains herself the rest of the time! She's an only as well so no playmates at home!

I had this with DS2. As soon as his older sibling was not around/reading a book/doing homework DS2 would winge and moan about boredom and the only thing he wanted was TV or IPad. I sat down with him one day and got him to write a list of things he can do - and liked to do which involved him playing on his own. Lego, drawing, playdoh, playmobile, cars, reading, playing in the garden, making dens. And then a list of stuff he could do with sibling (all of the above plus board games, etc etc) for when he was bored but sibling around to play. The things to do could only go on the list if they didn't need me or DH in anyway to facilitate .

Then each time DS2 came to me bored or wanting to use screens I would just calmly and brightly suggest he went to do something from his list. 95% of the time that would work. I may have needed to repeat it a few million times at first- Before, once in "bored" mode he could not see the options in front of him iyswim. Presented with a list he had agreed/written himself of stuff that was fun he could no longer argue there was "nothing to do". Also as he "chose" what to do, rather than me suggesting it he felt more in control.

May be worth a thought.

I find when dd1 has too much screen time she can be like this too - maybe not to the same extreme though.

I have children the same age and if I need to do something or want some quiet time I either tell them that they need to entertain themselves or i put on a DVD for them, close the curtains and make it like a cinema with snacks. That works well but I appreciate this wouldn't work all the time.

I don't think entertaining them constantly will work either though. Crafts will never work as even age 6 they still need lots of input with them - although dd1 who is also 6.5 can be trusted with kids scissors and glue and loves to sit and cut and stick while I get housework done or sit with a coffee. So I think it's maybe about thinking about the activities on offer - I imagine sitting playing with lego alone isn't going to be very fun. Have a think about what bob dc likes to do that doesn't take a lot of adult input. My dd's play together very well with their dolls and can easily spend an hour playing together. Same with colouring in too.

And I agree if they winge that they are bored to ignore them some of the time. It's the only way children learn to play. Screens have taken away so much imaginative play. I remember being bored when I was younger and taking myself off to find something to do

We've found it better to get up and out and then do the relaxing. If we take them to a park for a bit of letting off steam they seem to play much nicer and calmer when we come back, and they're happy to be at home and chill. I fucking hate the park though.

mine happily play for decent chunks of time; I might suggest activities
But often they default to Lego.
I think they key is they know they only get TV /iPad at set times and between those times no amount of whining makes me cave in. And if the older ones moan about being bored I just suggest some jobs they could do .

I just say 'not now, I am working'.

They learn.

It's not 'cruel' to teach them to a) entertain themselves and b) learn the world doesn't revolve around them and no one cares about every single little thing they do and every single thing they think of to say.

Also, now they're older, I don't do kiddie stuff. I don't craft. I don't sit down with crayons. I'm an adult and I have adult stuff to do, and they are the children. They play with the toys. They play very well together and entertain each other, coming up with new games without my direction.

Have you tried giving them set periods to do things on their own? Tell them not to come to you for say 1/2hr and set an alarm clock so they know when time is up. Use sticker charts/rewards game with the younger one or both if you think that will wrk. I don't think you can expect more than 30 mins max with children that age, infants /nursery usually change activities about every 20 mins so even 30 mins is asking a lot. Encourage reading now and with a bit of luck by type time they are 7 they be able to settle down with a good book for considerably longer.

I was similar to Ketsby when mine were kids.

In fact most parents were!

There were no tablets then and "activities" we're pretty much swimming once a week or something then Cubs/brownies as they got older.

And yes. "I'm bored" was met with a list of household jobs that needed doing!

They don't know how to use their imaginations because you never give them chance with your constant stream of structured activities.You are hindering their development.

I'm nearly 12 years into parenting and it's bloody hard work and unpredictable. What works one day might not work the next and sometimes you do wish they'd just leave you alone for 5 mins!!

But what I am sure of is that screens first thing in the morning = miserable whingy kids. It's as if they then forget how to entertain themselves and are grumpy with it, just as an added bonus

Similarly, if they have too much screen time at once, they are then pretty unpleasant when they come off.

Personally I save the screens for the ONE occasion in the day when I really need it. It's always a juggle and a compromise!

We spend quite a bit of time in another country where we have convinced our (not normally that dim) children that youtube and their tablets don't work. We noticed that after two weeks of no screens they just became far better children!

We were doing the same as you - weekend mornings ended up with long blocks of time with them on the tablet (so we could get some rest) and then they were a nightmare when they came off it. Now they know they can have 15 mins a day in the week (just reduced from 30) and an hour in the weekend. They even have a timer on.

It works. As does 5moreminute's 'If you tell me you're bored again I'll give you a job to do.

We started this when mine were 5 and 6 so a bit older than your youngest. One of the best things we ever did!

I agree with all who have said use the iPad as a reward after periods of nice playing. Also setting a specific time of 5 or 10 minutes to play nicely rather than expecting hours straight off.

I'm sure they'll get there.

We live quite differently... I'm not saying we're right as different things work for different people but we never have a lie in as our children are early risers. We all get up at 7am even at weekends and get up and dressed and out by 9.30/10am even if it's just a walk into town or to the local park. We try and do a lot of stuff like visit heritage sites and get in the car and go to other parks and woodlands etc. Then we are all back home by 12.30ish or later if we take lunch or have lunch out and the children are then shattered and happy to slob out in front of the tv or ipad for a couple of hours. They are then content to play at home for the rest of the day.

We find if we don't get up and out the day is unbearable as they are just so bored and restless.