Skip to main content
Skip to main navigation
Skip to talk navigation

Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Saved Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

Flip

MNHQ have commented on this thread

1 2 3 4 5 6 ··· 40 41

MNHQ have commented on this thread

AIBU?

'It might not have been rape, she might have had sex and regretted it afterwards'

1002 replies

BravoHopeful · 21/10/2016 10:29

This statement makes no sense. If you had consensual sex and the next day regretted it, why on earth would you go through the whole horrible experience of reporting it to the police and everything that follows? You would just move on and put it behind you.

It's always trotted out as a likely explanation in 'date rape' type cases. But it makes no sense whatsoever. AIBU?

OP posts:

Report

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:18

"We should be telling girls from a young age to show these signs and be vocal. If they don't, then unfortunately it's going to be very hard to prove it was rape."

And how will it be proven if she does, going by that logic? Since she said no the man's going to say to the police "oh yeah now you mention it, she was frozen at first and I wasn't sure, but then she DID say no...oh silly me."

WittyCakeMeister · 21/10/2016 16:26

Actually I'm not ignorant. I have been raped. I was 19 and he was 49.
And if it is so black and white, why are there so few prosecutions? Because it's not always so clear cut. You just want to believe that it is clear cut. Really, can't be bothered to try and have a debate because its clear those commenting on here want to just push one view and are not open to looking at it any other way. You've got to consider all possibilities.

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:28

It is clear cut. Rape is rape. If there's no enthusiastic consent, it's rape. To suggest the onus is on women and that we should teach girls to avoid rape (which is already all we seem to do anyway) is victim blaming and takes the responsibility away from men, who have the power in the potential situation.

I'm very sorry to hear about what happened to you.

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:28

There are so few prosecutions because of rape culture, rape myths, victim blaming, which all pervade through the justice system and society. There would be no need for any if men chose not to rape.

WittyCakeMeister · 21/10/2016 16:29

And by 'frozen' I didn't mean that he had to force her legs apart FFS. I meant a bit still. Not having to force her physically into it.

DoinItFine · 21/10/2016 16:29

And if it is so black and white, why are there so few prosecutions?

Lol

Because the world is run by men and a lot of them like to do rapes without getting into trouble for it.

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:31

Then the solution is educate boys not tell girls not to avoid rape which is IMPOSSIBLE as it's boys and men who choose to rape us.

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:31

*to avoid rape

Marbleheadjohnson · 21/10/2016 16:31

I kind of get what you are trying to say Walter, but I think the solution to "nice men not wanting to be rapist" is to tell them that actually, what they are doing is rape, rather than try to impress further "how to avoid rape" lessons onto women and girls

Marbleheadjohnson · 21/10/2016 16:31

Walter? I meant Witty

MrsTerryPratchett · 21/10/2016 16:32

There are so few convictions because even when a man describes himself raping someone he gets freed on appeal.

WittyCakeMeister · 21/10/2016 16:32

You guys have really negative views of men. Like i said, I've been raped but lets not tar them all with the same brush. Saying prosecutions go in favour of the man because the justice system is run by men. There are a lot of good, caring men out there you know.

Marbleheadjohnson · 21/10/2016 16:34

I have positive views of men. Negative views of rapists. One man who raped me is sure he was a "nice guy" and cried when I said I was upset about what he did, "are you calling me a rapist?". I never used that word, he came to that conclusion himself when I said I clearly did not want him to carry on. He knew it. Pleading ignorance is just because they don't want to be branded a rapist, not because they disagree that what they were doing was rape.

WittyCakeMeister · 21/10/2016 16:35

Of course Marblehead - we need to do BOTH. I never said we should not be educating men also.

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:35

If there are so many good, caring men out there then maybe they could start challenging other men on misogyny not going quiet when in all male company and teaching boys not to rape instead of making excuses and blaming girls. I am bloody sick of it.

DeleteOrDecay · 21/10/2016 16:36

And if it is so black and white, why are there so few prosecutions

You seriously have to ask this? Seriously??

It usually is clear cut, it's just difficult to prove in court as it's usually a 'his word against mine' scenario and the defence will do absolutely anything for a not guilty verdict.

I'm very sorry for what you've been through but you really are talking a lot of bollocks.

MyGiddyUncle · 21/10/2016 16:36

It's hardly a mystery why there are so few prosecutions...because it's one persons word vs anothers. You raped me. I did not rape you. Near impossible to prove beyond reasonable doubt.

Marbleheadjohnson · 21/10/2016 16:37

Witty, the more onus that is put onto women and girls to avoid rape, the easier it is for rapists to get away with raping.

DeleteOrDecay · 21/10/2016 16:42

I'm sure the guy who 'nearly raped' me 10 years ago, who now has a wife and a child is considered a very nice guy by many. I know the truth though. The only reason it didn't go 'all the way' is because someone came into the room which 'killed the mood' so to speak. And yes I did tell him no, he blatantly ignored me.

No doesn't always work. We should be teaching men and boys about consent and what signs to look out for. They've got no excuse then.

MostlyHet · 21/10/2016 16:44

Witty I'm so sorry to hear what you've been through. But it doesn't make your views right. Most rapists, the overwhelming majority, know exactly what they are doing and don't care. They are prepared (under the cloak of anonymity) to tell behavioural psychologists this. The reason so few rapes make it to court is because "beyond reasonable doubt" is an incredibly high standard, because most women don't want to be violated a second time by having a defence lawyer shred them and in all probability pick over their sexual history in court, and because rape myths are so incredibly prevalent. Recently there was a case where a man successfully used the defence that he tripped and fell penis first into the woman's vagina. You'd laugh if that was Sarah Silverman doing it as part of a stand-up routine, but in real life it makes me want to weep that that is the bar set in rape trials - that a jury was prepared to believe that!

I get what you're saying about most men being decent. If David Lisak is right and 6% are rapists that means 94% are decent men. But it's not a tiny minority, it means every time you walk into a crowded bar there are two or three rapists in there and they don't conveniently come with the mark of cain on their foreheads.

WittyCakeMeister · 21/10/2016 16:44

Let's just hope your sons never get accused of rape that they feel they are innocent of, because some of you are going to believe he is a rapist, because it's that black and white in your minds. I really don't think it is that black and white. Even after reading all of the arguments you've written, I think there are always exceptions and situations where a man could have misread a situation.

Let's not bother educating girls (I think need to educate both) because that just suggests they are to blame - ridiculous.

MrsTerryPratchett · 21/10/2016 16:48

'they feel they are innocent of'? I would hope any child of mine understands consent well enough to know if they have it or not.

Male children and men are more likely to be raped by other men than falsely convicted of rape. Amazing how little we talk about the first and how much we talk about the second.

DoinItFine · 21/10/2016 16:50

We are already educating girls that it's not rape if they don't say no/scream/fight harder/die rather than give in.

We have been teaching them that for CENTURIES.

And yet - SURPRISE!

Hundreds of millions of them get raped every year.

Because men want to rape them.

And they get away with it.

Because of rape apologists like you.

DeleteOrDecay · 21/10/2016 16:52

I think you will find many posters on this thread who disagree with you have sons and are not worried about them being 'falsely accused' because they are going to raise them to know that it's wrong to stick their penis where it's not wanted and that if they're not 100% sure then don't have sex. You are complicating something that really isn't complicated. You are giving rapists an excuse to rape and get away with it.

Do you realise how few rape accusations are proven to be false? It is far more uncommon than it is for rapists to be found not guilty in court over a technicality.

Fantome · 21/10/2016 16:54

"Let's just hope your sons never get accused of rape that they feel they are innocent of"

When so many girls and women are raped in our lifetimes, and so few boys or men are ever falsely accused, that is a sickening comment. "They feel they are innocent of", oh, they FEEL they are innocent of, how about what rape and sexual assault does to girls and women's lives DAY IN DAY OUT, what the fear of it does to us. I am so angry, as I said, this is why neither I nor most of my friends would ever report a rape if it happened to us. It'd ruin a life, but no, let's be concerned for the men who are DOING THE RAPING.

"Let's not bother educating girls" WE DO. I hear NOTHING but telling girls how to avoid rape (even though it's impossible). WE NEED TO EDUCATE BOYS because it's them who attack US.

Going to have to back out of this I think. Sickening.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5 6 ··· 40 41

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.